Are you going to pay the household charge? [Part 1]

chickencurry02 · 29-03-2012 4:35pm

On the household charge website i saw the following paragraph, What does the 12 years relate to?

Furthermore, both the €100 charge and any accumulated late payment fee will be a charge against the property concerned and will continue to be such for twelve years after the charge or late payment penalties concerned became due. Any Household Charges or late payment penalties due on a residential property will have to be discharged, in full, before a transfer or sale of the property can be completed.

Faolchu · 29-03-2012 5:10pm

So with the deal made on the promisory note does this mean the charge is off the table and we can get a refund? Not bloody likley.

seamus · 29-03-2012 5:22pm

Faolchu wrote: »

So with the deal made on the promisory note does this mean the charge is off the table and we can get a refund? Not bloody likley.

I was going to say that with the deal made on the promissory notes and that RTE is going to cut the top presenter's salaries by 30%, does that mean that all those, "get your house in order" guys are going to pay the charge now that the government have provided some fiscal improvements?

eadyzrx1200 · 29-03-2012 5:24pm

I will not be paying as its an unfair tax.
Why should i pay when someone who rents or is in a concil house not have to pay. Do they not use the parks and services etc. A friend of mine who out earns me by 5000aprox but lives in a concil house does not have to pay but I do !!! The concil dont cut the grass on my estate I have to pay for it, the local concil did not pay for the local playground the local residents had to raise the funds for that and the church gave us the land. Anyway the money is being given to French and German bank for their bad lending practices. I will never again vote for FG or Lab

Ghandee · 29-03-2012 5:32pm

seamus wrote: »

I was going to say that with the deal made on the promissory notes and that RTE is going to cut the top presenter's salaries by 30%, does that mean that all those, "get your house in order" guys are going to pay the charge now that the government have provided some fiscal improvements?

But the underlying problem still remains Seamus.

That problem being that the household charge = an indefinite rent placed on your property, a family home.

Bring in rates like the north, charge us up front for public services, then:
abolish the following:
bin charges,
emergency service charges,
tolled roads,
Plans to meter our water

Then,

Introduce the following:
lower motor tax ,
Free health care, and while they're at it, flat rate prescriptions in the chemist!
Free education
Lower the vat rate.

Why should we have to pay twice for the same services?

The government are fond of telling us that a full property tax will be in place next year, but they've forgotten to tell us that simply put, this means an extra payment that will need paying every year WITH all your other bills.

It's in no way similar to rates in the north (as they so often compare it to) no other bills will disappear, but a charge for living in your (maybe fully Paid for) home will appear and it will reappear, year after year, like a credit card Bill that won't reduce!

Noreen1 · 29-03-2012 5:43pm

black francis wrote: »

Can't you read - rte is the source.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0328/26-have-now-paid-household-charge.html

Dear, oh dear! It's that "attack the poster" tendency of yours again.

Now, since I can rather obviously read, and you appear to wish to attack me personally rather than give a reasonable, and polite, response - I'll rephrase the question.

How many people have registered who are exempt, and how many people have actually paid the charge?

Freddie59 · 29-03-2012 5:51pm

black francis wrote: »

SWP/SF/PBP - all those hard left lunatics.

You know, the ones that wanted a property tax until the Goverenment actually proposed one.

It might interest you to know that the majority of people opposed to this are far from "loony lefties" as you put it. I myself would have utter contempt for the SWP, etc, as they usually object to ANYTHING that will get them, in their eyes, media exposure.

But in this instance it is the normal, everyday person who is in the 1.2M - much as you would like it not to be. People, like myself:

* who are being asked to get the economy going, while already heavily
taxed - in every way,

* who look around and see 400m being borrowed weekly to prop up Public
Sector pay and "entitlements"

* who look on in amazement at a social Welfare System which is being
abused to the hilt and is a further cause of borrowing 400m a week.

* who look a failed business entities being bailed out for billions of euro,
who are in turn paying their CEOs 800k a year.

Loony lefties indeed. Loony lefties would be the "Labour" party, who are propping up this Government, while their cheerleaders, the unions, call on members not to pay the charge, instead of calling on the "Labour" party to withdraw from Government.

Freddie59 · 29-03-2012 5:53pm

seamus wrote: »

I was going to say that with the deal made on the promissory notes and that RTE is going to cut the top presenter's salaries by 30%, does that mean that all those, "get your house in order" guys are going to pay the charge now that the government have provided some fiscal improvements?

Key word being "some". If they went the whole hof and reduced their expenditure to match their income I might. But then that would mean slashing Public Sector pay and SW, which none of them have the balls - or the inclination - to do. RTE is grossly overstaffed and overpaid.

It needs to be cut to size, and told it can have either advertising revenue or licence fee. Not both. Something else that won't happen as long as it's a mouthpiece for Government.

Freddie59 · 29-03-2012 5:57pm

black francis wrote: »

Because we don't have enough money to pay for our own stuff. overpay our public sector and civil service workers, while handing out too much free money to people on the dole.

That about covers it.

Bullseye1 · 29-03-2012 6:07pm

joolsveer wrote: »

I received a Final Reminder for the Household Charge in the post this morning. I have a receipt in my email account showing I paid the charge on 9 January 2012. What should I do?

Pay for 2013.

Frank Black · 29-03-2012 6:13pm

Noreen1 wrote: »

Dear, oh dear! It's that "attack the poster" tendency of yours again.

Now, since I can rather obviously read, and you appear to wish to attack me personally rather than give a reasonable, and polite, response - I'll rephrase the question.

How many people have registered who are exempt, and how many people have actually paid the charge?

Great re-phrase :rolleyes:

Noreen1 wrote: »

Source for "30% have paid", please?

Note I said "Paid" - not "registered".

gerryo777 · 29-03-2012 6:15pm

Buford Tannen wrote: »

Hope the fine people of Kerry are paying their household charge

http://http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0111/1224310101325.html

PAYROLL COSTS account for as much as 42 per cent of Kerry County Council’s total expenditure.
More than €50 million is being set aside to pay staff costs this year, including travel, subsistence and pensions. This is out of a total projected expenditure of more than €120 million on roads, water, housing, waste management and other services.
The council’s new head of finance, Angela McAllen, told the annual budget meeting of the local authority that payroll costs continued to rise, despite the fact numbers employed had decreased significantly. Up to 300 people have left Kerry County Council in recent years.
In the planning department, in the 2004 Kerry County Council budget, for instance, at the height of the boom, €2.19 million was set aside for salaries and travel and office expenses of staff.
This was when hundreds of applications for single and large-scale housing developments were flooding the council’s planning department.
This year, applications are at their lowest level since the early 1990s, and both administrative and technical staff numbers have been reduced, as the 2012 budget report shows. Yet, almost €2 million has been set aside to cover salaries and staffing costs in planning.
Some of the staffing costs are quite stark. In one programme concerned with grant schemes for the housing of older people and those with disabilities, more than €465,000 is being set aside to administer just €3.5 million in grants.
The proportion spent on payroll has risen to the 42 per cent of expenditure set aside this year – in 2011 payroll costs accounted for 40 per cent of the overall expenditure and in 2007 salaries and payroll accounted for 38 per cent of overall council spend.
The council has agreed to freeze rates this year.

It's becoming increasingly obvious where the real problem in this country lies.

The PS/CS.

When you look at the 'allowances' teachers get on top of their wages,you really have to look twice. €505 million per year, that's over half a billion every year in allowances.

It's the same in the Garda.

Our county councils are a joke. Massive glass fronted buildings containing a shower of prima-donnas with a massive sense of entitlement.

The 'gravy train' is alive and well in the PS/CS, four years into a recession and still getting annual pay rises, just in order to have industrial 'peace'.

Industrial blackmail more like.

The CPA is a complete joke and the sooner the IMF/EU sort that sordid mess out the better.

If anyone thinks I will pay a household tax while this ****e is still going on, they're sadly mistaken.

Are you listening, big Phil???

Bannasidhe · 29-03-2012 6:18pm

gerryo777 wrote: »

It's becoming increasingly obvious where the real problem in this country lies.

The PS/CS.

When you look at the 'allowances' teachers get on top of their wages,you really have to look twice. €505 million per year, that's over half a billion every year in allowances.

It's the same in the Garda.

Our county councils are a joke. Massive glass fronted buildings containing a shower of prima-donnas with a massive sense of entitlement.

The 'gravy train' is alive and well in the PS/CS, four years into a recession and still getting annual pay rises, just in order to have industrial 'peace'.

Industrial blackmail more like.

The CPA is a complete joke and the sooner the IMF/EU sort that sordid mess out the better.

If anyone thinks I will pay a household tax while this ****e is still going on, they're sadly mistaken.

Are you listening, big Phil???

Big Phil can't hear us over the roaring sound of his sky rocketing blood pressure

.

Bullseye1 · 29-03-2012 6:18pm

Teachers were paid €500 million in extras in 2011. Says it all really so that 600 million savings delivered under the CPA is almost wiped out by the extras. Who is kidding who here.

People talk about the country needing his €160 million. Yet we are spending more when we should be spending less.

ThinkAboutIt · 29-03-2012 6:23pm

Just pay it you tax dodgers.

mconigol · 29-03-2012 6:25pm

ThinkAboutIt wrote: »

Just pay it you tax dodgers.

The government should pay the promissory note at the end of the month too. Can't be dodging their debts or changing their agreements, that's not possible apparently.

ThinkAboutIt · 29-03-2012 6:29pm

Well I paid it in full. I'm not a tax dodger.

gerryo777 · 29-03-2012 6:30pm

mconigol wrote: »

The government should pay the promissory note at the end of the month too. Can't be dodging their debts or changing their agreements, that's not possible apparently.

They haven't dodged that one.
They just turned more bank 'debt' into sovereign debt that we'll have to pay down the line.
Don't be fooled by Noonan's magic numbers game.
When that bond matures the household tax will be increased to pay it back.

gerryo777 · 29-03-2012 6:31pm

ThinkAboutIt wrote: »

Well I paid it in full. I'm not a tax dodger.

Give yourself a pat on the back.:rolleyes:

mconigol · 29-03-2012 6:31pm

gerryo777 wrote: »

They haven't dodged that one.
They just turned more bank 'debt' into sovereign debt that we'll have to pay down the line.
Don't be fooled by Noonan's magic numbers game.
When that bond matures the household tax will be increased to pay it back.

No but it shows that the deal is negotiable. One of the arguments for the household charge is that it was agreed with the troika.

apache6 · 29-03-2012 6:33pm

Almost deadline time people, so it's time to either

Lie down and be mounted OR stand up and be counted.

I'm not paying and that is that............next.........

gerryo777 · 29-03-2012 6:33pm

mconigol wrote: »

No but it shows that the deal is negotiable. One of the arguments for the household charge is that it was agreed with the troika.

If that's the best Noonan & co. can come up with, then we're in deeper do-do than we all think!:mad:

Frank Black · 29-03-2012 6:38pm

I believe the Paddy Power Red C poll is showing 61% of people willing to pay the charge.
Assuming half of those who say they won't pay are keyboard warriors and blowhards, it's looking like compliance rates will be over 80% without too much hassle.

Seems like the huge majority claimed by the 'don't register, don't pay brigade' has been abducted.

ThinkAboutIt · 29-03-2012 6:40pm

black francis wrote: »

I believe the Paddy Power Red C poll is showing 61% of people willing to pay the charge.
Assuming half of those who say they won't pay are keyboard warriors and blowhards, it's looking like compliance rates will be over 80% without too much hassle.

Seems like the huge majority claimed by the 'don't register, don't pay brigade' has been abducted.

The majority on people in the country aren't tax dodgers, it's simple fact. They'll pay it because everyone knows you have to pay your taxes.

gerryo777 · 29-03-2012 6:42pm

black francis wrote: »

I believe the Paddy Power Red C poll is showing 61% of people willing to pay the charge.
Assuming half of those who say they won't pay are keyboard warriors and blowhards, it's looking like compliance rates will be over 80% without too much hassle.

Seems like the huge majority claimed by the 'don't register, don't pay brigade' has been abducted.

Ha ha,
The way you come up with your figures is nearly as good as the way the government does.
10 out 10 for effort!
Well done.

mikom · 29-03-2012 6:46pm

black francis wrote: »

I believe the Paddy Power Red C poll is showing 61% of people willing to pay the charge.
Assuming half of those who say they won't pay are keyboard warriors and blowhards, it's looking like compliance rates will be over 80% without too much hassle.

Seems like the huge majority claimed by the 'don't register, don't pay brigade' has been abducted.

La-la land.

ratracer · 29-03-2012 6:56pm

ThinkAboutIt wrote: »

The majority on people in the country aren't tax dodgers, it's simple fact. They'll pay it because everyone knows you have to pay your taxes.

I used to think like this, but this household tax is definitly the straw that broke the camale's back for me. I'm not paying it, if that makes me a white collar criminal like the politicians, so be it, it appears no one can be prosecuted for white collar crime in this country

Noreen1 · 29-03-2012 7:11pm

black francis wrote: »

Great re-phrase :rolleyes:

I'm being charitable.

I've noticed that you have a tendency to attack the poster, rather than answer questions that you would rather not answer.

Hence my "great re-phrase" was an attempt to get you to answer a clear, concise - and polite - question, that you have (unsurprisingly) avoided answering by becoming aggressive, and blustering.

Really, I expect a better quality of response than:

Can't you read?

or

Great re-phrase.

How about a polite reply to the question?

We wont think too badly of you if you don't know the answer.:D:D

Chucky the tree · 29-03-2012 7:19pm

Ghandee wrote: »

But the underlying problem still remains Seamus.

That problem being that the household charge = an indefinite rent placed on your property, a family home.

Bring in rates like the north, charge us up front for public services, then:
abolish the following:
bin charges,
emergency service charges,
tolled roads,
Plans to meter our water

Then,

Introduce the following:
lower motor tax ,
Free health care, and while they're at it, flat rate prescriptions in the chemist!
Free education
Lower the vat rate.

Why should we have to pay twice for the same services?

The government are fond of telling us that a full property tax will be in place next year, but they've forgotten to tell us that simply put, this means an extra payment that will need paying every year WITH all your other bills.

It's in no way similar to rates in the north (as they so often compare it to) no other bills will disappear, but a charge for living in your (maybe fully Paid for) home will appear and it will reappear, year after year, like a credit card Bill that won't reduce!

Top range of free service, while paying very little taxes. That's definitely a workable model alright. :rolleyes:

Ghandee · 29-03-2012 7:47pm

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Top range of free service, while paying very little taxes. That's definitely a workable model alright. :rolleyes:

So chucky,

*sigh*
You obviously missed where I said I would pay for a system like rates, how would this still amount to very little taxes?
A workable model in your opinion is charge them for all the services they're already paying for, then, on top of that, make them pay a grand or so extra, for which you will receive nothing, zilch, nada, the centre of a donut in return.

Can't you see Joe and Josephine public have no more money to give? My above post that you quoted , clear as crystal explained how I (speaking for myself here) would endorse a system like rates, where we get something back. I won't hand over a grand or more to a govt for nothing who'll give me nothing back for it in return.

And on a closing note, for all the people 'looking forward' to a property tax placed on their family home, will you be all smug when it's far more expensive than what the people in the r North pay for rates?

(let's be honest, there ain't much we pay less for compared to people in the north, why break the habit of a lifetime eh?)

Are you going to pay the household charge? [Part 1]

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