Survival groups?

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Sigh!! As per this post??????[Waterboy]
I think what highnoon is trying to ask is how do you go about getting a community of like minded preppers to open up communications with each other so that you have a community ready to go in a shtf situation.

Think this was the whole point some effective method of private communications amongst ourselves???

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Yeah and will you get any thanks for it,pre or post event??Not likely! In the sense you wont get any recognition pre event apart from the PTB saying they can manage and you are "mere civillians" so sod off.Post you might get a thank you note in the papers with some fool glad handing you.But anyting practical..Forget it!!

And, for the first time, the federal government will help hams help others. The Corporation for National and Community Service (CNCS) will provide a $100,000 grant supplement to ARRL to support its emergency communication operators in states affected by Hurricane Katrina. The grant will help to fund what is being termed “Ham Aid,” a new program to support amateur radio volunteers deployed in the field in disaster-stricken areas.

Doc Ruby wrote: »

You live in an entertaining world Grizz, I'll give you that.

Members of the general public are not going to be able to listen in on something like a private mailing list, even if they did care enough to bother. The only ones who have that capability are usually governmental, so encrypting communications is not just pointless it's counterproductive, as it attracts official attention. Unless you were planning to swap tips on how to make a semi auto full auto or produce semtex or something.

For the last time!!The idea was formulated awhile back that we wanted a group comms for people HERE on the board to chat in privacy.As that was the problem I proposed a solution,which I now wish I hadnt!! YOU came in with allsorts of computor doublespeak and what not and it has gone off track..If you all want to talk on radios that cost more money,learn ham radio or whatever, fine!!! Kind of stupid as by the admission the things only have a 10 klick range.While the functioning Net with a FREE PGP programme costs nothing !!Now I dont know where you are getting all this other BS from about Semtex and full auto from!!!And if Fortune 500 companies use encryption on a day to day basisIN IRELAND without the Govt/NWO or whatever other fantasy you belive is reading our mail on a daily basis without fear,why cant we??but hey if itis too paranoid for you....Lets forget the whole thing and spend money on radio sets!!!:rolleyes::rolleyes:
So we can advertie where we are and talk to noone pre SHTF as we are out of range of each other.

First off, so what. You help people in emergencies because they need help, not because you're getting paid at the end.

AH!!! Human altruism!!:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: How noble!!!:rolleyes::rolleyes:How pathetic!!!

Secondly, yes groups have gotten recognition and funding for stepping in with help.

Simply because it suits Uncle Sam to do so ,and to have another bit of control of an asset that might go against him.

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

And if Fortune 500 companies use encryption on a day to day basisIN IRELAND without the Govt/NWO or whatever other fantasy you belive is reading our mail on a daily basis without fear,why cant we??

Doc Ruby wrote: »

I'll try one last time, and you may take it or leave it. You're going to get high fived (flagged and bagged by your good buddy five eyes) if you start any encrypted "survival network" cloak and dagger schoolyard bullshit, faster than you can say "fuck me that was smooth".

I'm aware that its unlikely to make a dent, but nonetheless.

bonniebede wrote: »

Well I think on some things we might have to agree to differ. I prefer to take a rational approach to life thats why i am religious, but probably should leave that discussion to the religion forum, if you are interested.

Indeed one should disagree otherwise it would be a very boring world.
As I said im an atheist,and want nothing to do with religion as I consider it an evil that has brought nothing but death,war and misery to humanity,in the name of "love and peace".So no ..not particulary intrested.

BTw , my bible says ' let him who will not work, let him not eat' , is that hard nosed enough for you?

It says quite alot about many different things.It also has Jesus Christ advocating people arming themselves in Luke 22;36 Let he that have no sword sell his cloak to buy one".However I treat it as an intresting collection of history,a tribal story,intresting references to space travel,cloning,garbled eye witness reports and heavily censored by mankind.So no wonder it is a best seller..Beliveable...Not to me.

Three things old people could contribute....
Knowledge and skills.... my old dad used to snare rabbtis, he never did teach me how, but now i am trying to learn i wish he was around.

Ok,nothing that cant be learned with practise.Belive it or not the formulas and processes our great grand parents used for everything from paint to explosives are still out there,and can be understood by a ten year old reading ability.All modern society has done was improve and complicate them with more modern processes.So what will an old person tell you to improve this knowledge??

Child care...when your ten women start popping out the next generation of workforce, it will be quite an effort to raise them and an extra pair of hands, or rather an extra lap to sit on is very very useful.

I would think a younger obstreticion and midwife in their 30s might be more help???
You really want to finish them off completly do you??:DI can just see an 80 plus year old woman wanting to look after a dozen schrreching kids..
What is Mom going to be doing??:rolleyes:What are all the other Moms going to be doing?Sorry Corrie and Eastenders and all that other mind numbing rubbish is now so off the TV.[Which you might as well convert into a rabbitt hutch or chicken coop anyway].So that excuse for not child minding is gone.

Continuity of culture...don't want to go all 'lord of the the flies' here. Civilisation is worth the effort, the thing which gives people the hope and reason to go on in the face of the daily drudgery. Generational respect and continuity has been the hall mark of every enduring community group ever.

Lord of the Flies..intresting comparision there actually!! Which will certainly be what your "seed potatoes" will become very quick post the Crunch.As their parents arent exactly looking after them and disiplining them for current modern day "civilised" life.:rolleyes:

Sorry "civilisation" as we know it is generally somthing that will self destruct and better off too.It has ruined the planet,produced world wars,genocide and is a mess.Generational respect is a myth,hasnt everyone said how badly behaved the younger generation than they are these days??Continuity,is going the way of the dinosaurs.

I once saw some Grafitti in NYC and I thought it was actually profound and you ll like it too as it is religious.
Jesus is coming!!! And Boy is he pissed off!!!

I guess i am preparing to survive, but hoping to thrive, even in a post collapse world. Thriving for me will mean more than food on the table, it will mean civility, manners, respect for other human beings young and old, the strong serving the weak, (not serving them up for dinner:D).

Nice if it happens...But how will you enforce this?How will you defend this and most of all keep it together??And sorry I just cant see it being done without massive dieback of both young and old.By the Crunch or natural causes.

Strong and weak in survival situations in the long term is more about mental attitude than physical attributes. Maturer people may have a toughness and grit that others don't.

Indeed,but then they mightnt have the body strength anymore.look I'm not talking here about the hale and hearty 60/80s folks.I'm talking the 90s onwards,those who are already in Gods waiting room or the numberd days nursing home.These are the kind of people I think this will be aliving Hell for them.

Besides which, I am heading into the maturer category myself at this stage.

Aint we all??

Oh an you misinterpret. I am definitely not a feminist chauvinist

.Do you know what this is ?? It signifies a joke or humour.
Thats what it was meant as.

Just the opposite. I simply thing that in a situation where child bearing and rearing became a costly exercise for women again, it would entail the re-emergence of behaviours which favoured the finding and retaining of an industrious self controlled mate;

one who could show by his behaviour that he would be able to provide for you and the children in the long term, not leave you literally holding the baby.

Well now you know one reasons why the Mormons allowed polygamy[sic]
Yeah,possibly ,but I think that is going to be really intresting now with the modern additions of single sex parents,total Feminists[the bald headed,doc Martined, lumberjacked shirted ones] who think and act like men.All these will be intrestingon the post TETOWAKI social dating scene.:)

There is no getting away from it, if you want to build a strong community which will last for a long time, it has to have a healthy set of intergenerational relationships. Check out the current population stats in our declining civilisation to see what happens longterm to cultures that don't nurture their own young.

Tell me somthing I dont know.:rolleyes:BUT those early civilisations be they ancient or modern to a certain extent were brutal to anyone who didnt fit the mould.

Sparta,for example any defects on the newborn,they were flung over a cliff for the carrion birds to feed on.
Their children were brutalised from four years onwards to become such hard soilders that nothing would put fear into them.Up to the point that 300 Spartans held off a Persian army at the pass at Thempoylae.it was a sucidie mission,but they willingly died as did their ruler with them.

The Vikings,it was considerd a sin against the Gods to die of old age..You died in battle,or if that was not possible it was the duty of your eldest son to cleave his father headless with an axe,when he was totally infirm!
The Gauls and Celts had the same for their old cheiftans.They sacrificed them to the Gods.

The 3rd Reich,another modern example,The eugenics and the Lebensborn clinics,and the training of kids at seven years of age to be soilders or little blonde breeders for the Master Race...Yet all became in their times dominant political and military powers.Ancient Rome,started off as well being a hardy brutal civilisation,but when it started having more concern for the idle ones and useless mouths to feed,its decline started immediately.
So Bonnie with all due respects ,your brave new world to survive is going to have to be pretty tough on who will live and die.Not just for the eugenics of the race but because of maybe a lack of food supplies or space or whatever.It will be nice if we can all sit around singing a few bars of Kum ba eh and we are all friends.But the first bunch of raggedy assed brigands that show up are going to take your place to bits!!
Or worse ..Say a winter hits like for 6months,your food supplies are running low...You want to feed everyone obviously,but the supplies wont do it.Do you feed your able bodied men who are your protectors and workers,your women of breeding age?your sickly young who might or might not survive and the aged and infirm who cant do anything??
Your community survives or dies by your word...
Uneasy rests the head that wears the crown!:eek:

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Indeed one should disagree otherwise it would be a very boring world.
As I said im an atheist,and want nothing to do with religion as I consider it an evil that has brought nothing but death,war and misery to humanity,in the name of "love and peace".So no ..not particulary intrested.

Exactly as I thought you would answer and I didn't want to bore you.

I would think a younger obstreticion and midwife in their 30s might be more help???
You really want to finish them off completly do you??I can just see an 80 plus year old woman wanting to look after a dozen schrreching kids..
What is Mom going to be doing??What are all the other Moms going to be doing?Sorry Corrie and Eastenders and all that other mind numbing rubbish is now so off the TV.[Which you might as well convert into a rabbitt hutch or chicken coop anyway].So that excuse for not child minding is gone.

Exactly what they're going to be doing - raisng chickens, keeping the veg garden etc etc. From experience (I used to mind 56 kidws every dat, all under 4, ) granny is useful.

As their parents arent exactly looking after them and disiplining them for current modern day "civilised" life.:rolleyes:

no argument from me there. Though its not true of all, thankfully.

Sorry "civilisation" as we know it is generally somthing that will self destruct and better off too.

But I don't think we do know civilisation. This culture we are living in is losing all toucvh with what civilisation is. some of the symptoms are consumerism, materialism, decadence, ethical relativism , disrespect of the the young and old... WE are more like technologically savvy barbarians.:)

I once saw some Grafitti in NYC and I thought it was actually profound and you ll like it too as it is religious.
Jesus is coming!!! And Boy is he pissed off!!!

My favourite is that pictue of Holman Hunts of Jesus with a lantern standing outside the door knocking, with the tagline - Jesus is coming back, quick! look busy!.

Nice if it happens...But how will you enforce this?How will you defend this and most of all keep it together??And sorry I just cant see it being done without massive dieback of both young and old.By the Crunch or natural causes.

Don't disagree, a collapse situation becomes a bottleneck through which only a smaller number survive. Prepping is to make sure I have maxed my chances of it being me.

I'm talking the 90s onwards,those who are already in Gods waiting room or the numberd days nursing home.These are the kind of people I think this will be aliving Hell for them.

Guess I was thinking more the haler and heartier types you mentioned. I think people in nursing homes will either be a) rescued by people who love them and who therefore are tied to them pyschologically and emotionally. Keeping Granny going then becomes a positive driver for survival action or b) abandoned, by their paid carers who are looking after them because their own have already abandoned them or they because they have none. After that its three days without water, i'm afraid.

.Do you know what this is ?? It signifies a joke or humour.
Thats what it was meant as.

Yes . Do you? Can't help if the range of icons doesn't include subtle irony, mild sarcasm etc etc. I'm more expressive in person.:D

Well now you know one reasons why the Mormons allowed polygamy[sic]
Yeah,possibly ,but I think that is going to be really intresting now with the modern additions of single sex parents,total Feminists[the bald headed,doc Martined, lumberjacked shirted ones] who think and act like men.All these will be intrestingon the post TETOWAKI social dating scene.:)

Indeed. Lots of ways of thinking and living supported by state intervention will just disappear, i think.

those early civilisations be they ancient or modern to a certain extent were brutal to anyone who didnt fit the mould.

True. But I'm happy to be a member of the religious organisation that scandalised the Romans by picking babies out of dumpsters. (ok i know they didn't have dumpsters as such, but you know what i mean.)

So Bonnie with all due respects ,your brave new world to survive is going to have to be pretty tough on who will live and die.

I'm a prepper.

Not just for the eugenics of the race but because of maybe a lack of food supplies or space or whatever.It will be nice if we can all sit around singing a few bars of Kum ba eh and we are all friends.

First off, I will personally skin and broil anybody who sings kum by ah near me. (see humour:D) (but I am serious)

Eugenics , theres an interesting one. Eugenicists seem to focus on physical fitness as far as I can see, and read. But Humans have not excelled by physical fitness, from an evolutionary point of view. What sets us apart is our ability to think and reason, to communicate, to pass on learnt skills to future generations, especially those skills which run against more basic instincts like using fire instead of avoiding it, on sublimating the sexual instinct to some extent in order to build strong and robust multigenerational family units where all this happens...

Love isn't about niceness. It is tough assed, ready to chew you out, lay down your life stuff. And it is closely allied with hope, which is essential for survival. Witness Victor Frankyls experience in the concentration camps.

Any way getting preachy. Sorry. :P

But the first bunch of raggedy assed brigands that show up are going to take your place to bits!!

Emm, I think you got me mixed up with a pacifist. My take on christianity includes the concept of just war, or in the scenario you outline self defence with extreme prejudice. (:D no not religious prejudice,the other kind, you know...)

Or worse ..Say a winter hits like for 6months,your food supplies are running low...You want to feed everyone obviously,but the supplies wont do it.Do you feed your able bodied men who are your protectors and workers,your women of breeding age?your sickly young who might or might not survive and the aged and infirm who cant do anything??
Your community survives or dies by your word...
Uneasy rests the head that wears the crown!:eek:

Rationing, no problem. Unequal shares based on need, both personal and the communities need to keep more important people going? no problem. Cannibalism, no problem. Not live, you understand, but when they die, let them contribute.
THe 'everybody' in that scenario will be my survival group. I'll be happy to share knowledge with anyone who comes along peacably. but my tin of cut price Tesco own brand sludge is mine. Unless I choose to share it. Which i might. Or might not.:o

bonniebede wrote: »

Exactly as I thought you would answer and I didn't want to bore you.

Exactly what they're going to be doing - raisng chickens, keeping the veg garden etc etc. From experience (I used to mind 56 kidws every dat, all under 4, ) granny is useful.

no argument from me there. Though its not true of all, thankfully.

But I don't think we do know civilisation. This culture we are living in is losing all toucvh with what civilisation is. some of the symptoms are consumerism, materialism, decadence, ethical relativism , disrespect of the the young and old... WE are more like technologically savvy barbarians.

My favourite is that pictue of Holman Hunts of Jesus with a lantern standing outside the door knocking, with the tagline - Jesus is coming back, quick! look busy!.

Guess I was thinking more the haler and heartier types you mentioned. I think people in nursing homes will either be a) rescued by people who love them and who therefore are tied to them pyschologically and emotionally. Keeping Granny going then becomes a positive driver for survival action or b) abandoned, by their paid carers who are looking after them because their own have already abandoned them or they because they have none. After that its three days without water, i'm afraid.

Yes . Do you? Can't help if the range of icons doesn't include subtle irony, mild sarcasm etc etc. I'm more expressive in person.:D

Indeed. Lots of ways of thinking and living supported by state intervention will just disappear, i think.

True. But I'm happy to be a member of the religious organisation that scandalised the Romans by picking babies out of dumpsters. (ok i know they didn't have dumpsters as such, but you know what i mean

First off, I will personally skin and broil anybody who sings kum by ah near me. (see humour:D) (but I am serious)

Eugenics , theres an interesting one. Eugenicists seem to focus on physical fitness as far as I can see, and read. But Humans have not excelled by physical fitness, from an evolutionary point of view. What sets us apart is our ability to think and reason, to communicate, to pass on learnt skills to future generations, especially those skills which run against more basic instincts like using fire instead of avoiding it, on sublimating the sexual instinct to some extent in order to build strong and robust multigenerational family units where all this happens...

Love isn't about niceness. It is tough assed, ready to chew you out, lay down your life stuff. And it is closely allied with hope, which is essential for survival. Witness Victor Frankyls experience in the concentration camps.

Any way getting preachy. Sorry. :P