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A5 - Derry Dual Carraigeway

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 185 ✭✭oharach


    cgcsb wrote: »
    pop: 14,590. Hardly a city, even by Irish standards.

    It's a city alright, merits aside.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,284 ✭✭✭dubhthach


    Surely having trucks idling in small villages while caught in traffic causes more emissions then driving at a constant speed for a shorter period of time on a motorway?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,812 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    dubhthach wrote: »
    Surely having trucks idling in small villages while caught in traffic causes more emissions then driving at a constant speed for a shorter period of time on a motorway?

    you'd think that wouldn't you, but according to the English rent-a-hippy crowd that tour Europe camping at various construction sites and spend the day taiming their dreadlocks, drinking fosters and playing guitars(badly), you'd be wrong.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,282 ✭✭✭westtip


    cgcsb wrote: »
    you'd think that wouldn't you, but according to the English rent-a-hippy crowd that tour Europe camping at various construction sites and spend the day taiming their dreadlocks, drinking fosters and playing guitars(badly), you'd be wrong.

    And a smoke before breakfast, lunch and dinner....


  • Registered Users Posts: 43 Setanta_og


    This project is so fundamental to the economic revival of this Island it should be a priority project for the Assembly and the Dail


  • Registered Users Posts: 230 ✭✭johnbk


    There is more updates on this road on the offical website. www.a5wtc.com
    Very detailed junction designs are now available.

    My views are my own.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    It will be a brilliant road when done and will finally help link west Ulster together and to Dublin...


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,102 ✭✭✭Stinicker


    A new 20km stretch of the A4 connecting Ballygawley with the M1 West of Dungannon has been opened recently according to newspaper I read in Belfast on Saturday called the Newsletter. It is Dual Carriage way and will cut journey times from Sligo, Donegal, Leitrim, Tyrone, Derry and Fermanagh to Belfast and East Ulster considerably and there is Dual Carriageway/Motorway all the way from Ballygawley to Belfast now which is a big improvement for East/West Links in the Province.

    It only got a small mention in that Newspaper (and isn't on their Website) and it said there was small amounts of work ongoing but it sounds like the mainline is open to traffic and they are probably finishing stuff like offline junctions and signage etc. They have not

    Scheme Link


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,909 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    Stinicker wrote: »
    A new 20km stretch of the A4 connecting Ballygawley with the M1 West of Dungannon has been opened recently according to newspaper I read in Belfast on Saturday called the Newsletter. It is Dual Carriage way and will cut journey times from Sligo, Donegal, Leitrim, Tyrone, Derry and Fermanagh to Belfast and East Ulster considerably and there is Dual Carriageway/Motorway all the way from Ballygawley to Belfast now which is a big improvement for East/West Links in the Province.

    It only got a small mention in that Newspaper (and isn't on their Website) and it said there was small amounts of work ongoing but it sounds like the mainline is open to traffic and they are probably finishing stuff like offline junctions and signage etc. They have not

    Scheme Link
    re. A4 upgrade (Dungannon->Ballygawley) - whats the speed limit there does anyone know?
    Its a high grade dual Carraigeway according to the article, so is it 70mph or only 60?

    If its 70mph then its a pretty decent improvement for those heading up towards Omagh direction from Belfast, even if the A5 hasnt come on line yet.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 70,172 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    70. The national speed limit on dual carriageways is 70 in the UK.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,909 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    MYOB wrote: »
    70. The national speed limit on dual carriageways is 70 in the UK.
    I know that its 70 as a rule, but there was talk here before that the junctions on the new build are very closely bunched together meaning it probably wont be a motorway at any stage. And if it is a tight road specification then you would wonder if its a 60mph limit.

    If you can confirm that its 70 then thats great.

    Till now it was much of a muchness for Cavan-Belfast whether you went via Clones-Monaghan-Armagh or the slightly longer but slightly better/ faster road via Fivemiltown/ Balygawley.
    If youre getting motorway speeds to west of Ballygawley then it now has to be the preferred route.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 70,172 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    They use 70 on roads with crossing junctions (A1, A26, etc). This is the second highest standard non-motorway road in the entire of NI!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,281 ✭✭✭mackerski


    re. A4 upgrade (Dungannon->Ballygawley) - whats the speed limit there does anyone know?
    Its a high grade dual Carraigeway according to the article, so is it 70mph or only 60?

    If its 70mph then its a pretty decent improvement for those heading up towards Omagh direction from Belfast, even if the A5 hasnt come on line yet.

    The default Dual Carriageway limit is 70, and when I drove the eastern end of this upgrade recently I could see no evidence that a lower limit would be imposed.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,102 ✭✭✭Stinicker


    The article said nothing about speed limits but I think it will be 70mph. Aren't the PSNI unable to touch Southern registered cars speeding anyway?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,909 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    from the council for cross border stuff, disqualifications carry but not points.
    http://www.borderpeople.info/mutual_recognition_of_driving_disqualification

    you'd presume that speeding fines also follow you back across the border, if they can find you :D


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,476 ✭✭✭ardmacha


    This project is so fundamental to the economic revival of this Island it should be a priority project for the Assembly and the Dail

    I reckon that early completion of this road is a non runner given recent events.
    I know that its 70 as a rule, but there was talk here before that the junctions on the new build are very closely bunched together meaning it probably wont be a motorway at any stage. And if it is a tight road specification then you would wonder if its a 60mph limit.

    you also have to wonder about the logic that says that a road isn't good enough to be a motorway as it is not well enough engineered while still allowing the same speed limit on it and allowing tractors, cyclists etc as well. :confused:
    disqualifications carry but not points.

    or not yet.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 70,172 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Stinicker wrote: »
    The article said nothing about speed limits but I think it will be 70mph. Aren't the PSNI unable to touch Southern registered cars speeding anyway?

    They can and do stop, arrest and detain southern drivers doing excessive speeds past manned checkpoints. Camera vans, however, currently are ineffective.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,909 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    ardmacha wrote: »
    I reckon that early completion of this road is a non runner given recent events.
    Although its abandonment mightn't be as likely as it seems.

    The UK is offering 7billion sterling as a bilateral loan to the irish government (with separate terms and conditions to the eurozone agreement).
    Who would bet against them making one of the conditions of the loan that 500million of it should be used as the Irish governments already agreed share to pay for the A5?

    USA / Uk and other states in the past have made aid loans being conditional on using the loans in a certain way benefical to the donor. Why should this be different?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,108 ✭✭✭nordydan


    Although its abandonment mightn't be as likely as it seems.

    The UK is offering 7billion sterling as a bilateral loan to the irish government (with separate terms and conditions to the eurozone agreement).
    Who would bet against them making one of the conditions of the loan that 500million of it should be used as the Irish governments already agreed share to pay for the A5?

    USA / Uk and other states in the past have made aid loans being conditional on using the loans in a certain way benefical to the donor. Why should this be different?

    I work for one of the major banks in this country, or will be doing so for the next few months as the axe is about to fall big time (and realistically this was coming a long time ago).

    There is no condition applicable that the sterling loan will be used for this road, the UK care more about the exposure of their own banks in Ireland than any roads to Derry/Donegal. Its not a loan as such to Ireland, more to prop up their own institutions.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,909 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    I didnt see it in anywhere else, but Ivan Yates listed off measures announced yesterday that he didnt agree with this morning on his newstalk breakfast show, one of them being 500Million euro for this project.

    Its not in the dept of transport list, but then again, its not in the 26 counties or under the remit of the NRA so why should it?


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 25,234 ✭✭✭✭Sponge Bob


    Its not in the dept of transport list, but then again, its not in the 26 counties or under the remit of the NRA so why should it?

    It is you know, look at the very bottom of that document. No expenditure in 2011 or 2012 and expenditure thereafter is predicated upon the creation of a special fund that does not exist right now.

    http://www.transport.ie/pressRelease.aspx?Id=257

    ** It is proposed that the 2013 and 2014 costs of the upgrading of the A5 road from Aughnacloy to Derry will be met from the Capital Reserve Fund”


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,909 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    Sponge Bob wrote: »
    It is you know, look at the very bottom of that document. No expenditure in 2011 or 2012 and expenditure thereafter is predicated upon the creation of a special fund that does not exist right now.

    http://www.transport.ie/pressRelease.aspx?Id=257

    ** It is proposed that the 2013 and 2014 costs of the upgrading of the A5 road from Aughnacloy to Derry will be met from the Capital Reserve Fund”
    mother of god
    they couldnt have printed that any smaller and out of the way without ommitting it altogether!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 230 ✭✭johnbk


    This is a project that I feel very strongly about. There is huge amounts of objections to it from farmers along it's path. The UUP seem at this stage to be officially against it. Even roads enthusiasts seem at this stage to not realise it's potential benifits to to our island.

    Letterkenny has approx 17,000 people. Derry city including the towns within 20 miles of it has a population of approx 237,000. The aadt at Lifford bridge is 17570. The a5 at Omagh has an aadt of 19260. These are inadequate roads that need upgrading.

    If you consider the aadt at the a5 border of Monaghan is only 8430 then I would say the scope for increasing trade between Dublin and the north west is huge.

    Also, this investment is a very important
    part of the Good Friday peace agreement and I think the risk of cancelling the investment now is too large a risk for who ever is in government.

    My views are my own.



  • Registered Users Posts: 764 ✭✭✭Jayuu


    One of the reporters from UTV did ask the Taoiseach about the promises of funding of projects in the North by the government and from what I recollect his response was the the promised funding would be delivered.

    I'll try and see if I can find an online transcript of the exchange or a video of it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 230 ✭✭johnbk


    http://www.highlandradio.com/2010/12/09/fresh-concerns-over-a5-following-labour-comments/
    The are fears for the future of the new A5 dual carriageway linking Derry and Aughnacloy after Labour’s Transport Spokesman said it would not be a priority for the next government.

    Contracts have been signed, and preliminary work is already underway. However, while the budget this week reaffirmed funding for the cross border project, Labour’s Joe Costello said a new government could not afford to fund what he termed “grandiose” projects in Northern Ireland.

    In light of Deputy Costello’s comments, Foyle MLA Pol Callaghan, says the SDLP will be seeking talks with all the southern parties, including Labour, to set out the strong reasons for this key road to be built……….



    It is very easy for the Labour party to knock this project when they have no, and will not have a presence in the North West.

    How can the North West compete with any other region for FDI now that the interurbans are nearing completion?

    My views are my own.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 70,172 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Joe Costello's, eh, interesting views on transport projects means I doubt he'll be transport minister after the GE.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    MYOB wrote: »
    Joe Costello's, eh, interesting views on transport projects means I doubt he'll be transport minister after the GE.

    What views would they be? I haven't heard anything transport-wise from Labour. My hope is that Coveney rather than Costello would become Transport minister. That said, my first choice would be DWCommuter, Aidan1, or BluntGuy.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 70,172 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Furet wrote: »
    What views would they be? I haven't heard anything transport-wise from Labour. My hope is that Coveney rather than Costello would become Transport minister. That said, my first choice would be DWCommuter, Aidan1, or BluntGuy.

    From memory he's against practically everything, particularly DART-U as the moaning residents are potential personal voters.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,010 ✭✭✭Tech3


    Lets be honest here and admit that funding for this project from the south was never likely going to happen anytime soon. I have not seen enough proposals from both parties on their priorities for transport. The reason for this is because there are more pressing issues at this moment in time and infrastructure will be taking a back seat for the next few years while the country gets its finances back in order.

    The NRA never mentioned this project in the four year plan meaning the future government will only have one year left in office when the next tranche of road priorities are released. I think Joe Costello is being honest and straight to the point whereas you wont see any of that in FG HQ.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    tech2 wrote: »
    I have not seen enough proposals from both parties on their priorities for transport. The reason for this is because there are more pressing issues at this moment in time and infrastructure will be taking a back seat for the next few years while the country gets its finances back in order

    I basically agree. Infrastructure isn't and never was the priority non plus ultra. But a parliamentary party transport spokesman should be reciting road and rail schemes alphabetically in his sleep to be honest.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 263 ✭✭citycentre


    tech2 wrote: »
    The NRA never mentioned this project in the four year plan meaning the future government will only have one year left in office when the next tranche of road priorities are released. I think Joe Costello is being honest and straight to the point whereas you wont see any of that in FG HQ.

    But isnt this project under a completely different funding criteria than any of the NRA schemes given that it doesnt involve actually building any roads in the state. I think the funding would be more likey to appear under cross border initiatives, about which I haven't heard any cuts being mentioned.

    Notwithstanding all that its an absolute must for the whole northwest that this scheme goes ahead. Donegal and Derry's economic development would be severely curtailed if investment in key links to the rest of the country is stopped.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,010 ✭✭✭Tech3


    citycentre wrote: »
    But isnt this project under a completely different funding criteria than any of the NRA schemes given that it doesnt involve actually building any roads in the state. I think the funding would be more likey to appear under cross border initiatives, about which I haven't heard any cuts being mentioned.

    I wasnt aware of this, perhaps it does but the general view was that this scheme was being put on the backburner.
    Notwithstanding all that its an absolute must for the whole northwest that this scheme goes ahead. Donegal and Derry's economic development would be severely curtailed if investment in key links to the rest of the country is stopped.

    I agree that the road would be a major benefit to the NW but I fail to see where capital will become available for the project. The major roads being built in the republic next year will be with Public Private Partnership and ECB funding. The rest are small bypasses which will be low cost from capital expenditure. For the two years after there will be NO road projects built. Simply there is no money available for any big capital projects in the medium term at least.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    NORTHERN IRELAND Deputy First Minister Martin McGuinness has condemned the Labour Party’s warning that funding from the Republic for the construction of a dual-carriageway from Derry to Tyrone may have to be reviewed.

    Labour TD Joe Costello said the party, if it is in power after the next general election, will have to look at all major infrastructure projects, including the plan to upgrade the A5 road from Derry to Aughnacloy.

    “I am not saying we will abandon the project, but it will have to be reviewed very carefully considering the financial straits we are in,” he said.

    Mr McGuinness, speaking after a meeting of the British-Irish Council, said he had “to record my concern that some individuals in Dublin, not the present Government, are raising questions” about the Republic’s contribution.

    The Government has offered £400 million (€487 million) to upgrade the 88km stretch of the A5 from the Border near Aughnacloy, via Omagh and Strabane to Derry, along with the A8 between Newtownabbey and Larne.

    “For people to be raising questions around whether or not those projects . . . will go ahead is something that is of serious concern,” said Mr McGuinness.

    “I would advise those – one party in particular who have raised this – to recognise that these are vitally important projects for all of the people of the island of Ireland.

    “We all understand that the economic fortunes of our people are all inter-linked. It will bring huge benefits to the people,” he said, adding that Inter-Trade Ireland has shown that there is “phenomenal” cross-Border trade going on.

    “There is more trade between the North and the Republic than there is with the rest of the EU. We need to continue to encourage people to work in joined-up ways at a time of great economic hardship. Working together can alleviate some of those difficulties.”

    The discussions at the British-Irish Council, which includes Ireland, Northern Ireland, the British government, the devolved administrations in Scotland and Wales, along with the Isle of Man, Guernsey and Jersey, were dominated by economic matters.

    Saying that everyone had had “a very good opportunity to compare notes”, Taoiseach Brian Cowen said all the jurisdictions were facing challenges as they tried to repair public finances while stimulating growth.

    UK deputy prime minister Nick Clegg said all of the governments represented faced particular challenges politically and economically. “I think that there was a widespread recognition that economic growth on a sustainable basis is not possible unless you first set out a clear plan on how you are going to restore stability to our . . . finances,” he said.

    Northern Ireland First Minister Peter Robinson said the Executive is in the final stages of agreeing a budget against a backdrop of significant cuts, particularly on capital spending as a result of cuts imposed by London.

    “We are looking at ways of generating further income. We believe that we can meet those challenges, particularly in areas where we can add to and augment the block grant,” he said.
    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/1214/1224285490963.html


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,186 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    Furet wrote: »
    .
    Furet, you'll remember at the Infrastructure Beers in Athlone that even 6 months ago, it was obvious that we wouldn't be able to back up our promise of £400M to NI. I'm not surprised at the recent developments; only that it's taken this long for the governments of the two jurisdictions to realise it.

    Make the road a toll road. This obsession with not having toll roads in the UK needs to stop. You could have the whole thing a motorway and it would pay for itself. Current AADTs are misleading as there are many people not using the route or not heading for that part of the country at all due to the lack of decent roads.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,012 ✭✭✭Chris_5339762


    The problem with the UKs toll roads is that they price them completely out of the market. Think of how much it costs to go over the Severn Bridge or to use the M6 Toll.

    Makes the M4 at Enfield seem like small change.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,186 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    The problem with the UKs toll roads is that they price them completely out of the market. Think of how much it costs to go over the Severn Bridge or to use the M6 Toll.

    Makes the M4 at Enfield seem like small change.
    Yes. I'm exasperated when Irish people complain about having to pay tolls; they don't realise that ours are nothing. The only cheaper places to drive are countries like Germany that have none at all; but even then some countries are thinking of introducing an annual motorway tax that you affix to your windscreen.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,698 ✭✭✭D'Peoples Voice


    tech2 wrote: »
    Lets be honest here and admit that funding for this project from the south was never likely going to happen anytime soon.
    Ah now that the UK has given us around GBP 7 billion, perhaps we could give them EUR 400 million odd for this project.
    Even at today's exchange rates, that would even seem fair to DeValera:D

    if only the people of Letterkenny could get these boys on board:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11 Tailors Hall


    Ah now that the UK has given us around GBP 7 billion, perhaps we could give them EUR 400 million odd for this project.
    Even at today's exchange rates, that would even seem fair to DeValera:D

    In fairness the UK bailed out Ireland to copperfasten the €40bn on the RBS balance sheet in existing loans in Ireland add this to the €23bn in existing Ireland loans on the Lloyds balance sheet and €10bn plus on Barclays balance sheet; the UK taxpayer is not a charity it is helping 3 of its major banks out by bailing out Ireland.

    €400m = 4,000 top end FDI jobs creating probably another 6,000 spin off positions in transport, retail etc. Now contributing €10m towards a link road to Derry Airport may represent good value for the Irish taxpayer.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    Labour and Fine Gael at odds over Border pledges

    DAN KEENAN, Northern News Editor

    PLANNED INVESTMENT in cross-Border infrastructure projects will be a key issue for Fine Gael despite Labour misgivings, a Donegal TD has said.

    The Irish Government is committed to spending £400 million (€466 million) on key transport projects north of the Border in addition to other planned investments. Taoiseach Brian Cowen underscored this commitment in the immediate aftermath of the Budget.

    However, Dublin Central Labour TD Joe Costello believes the next government may not be able to afford key road upgrades linking the Border with Derry and Letterkenny and improving access to Larne harbour in Co Antrim.

    “We may not be in a position required to build the road from Dublin as far as Aughnacloy, [Co Tyrone] not to talk about making a half-billion [euro] contribution to Aughnacloy to Derry,” he said.

    His remarks have prompted alarm, not just within Northern Ireland, but among Labour’s potential coalition partners in Fine Gael.

    Donegal TD Joe McHugh said: “If it’s a case that we are looking at Fine Gael and Labour with the numbers to form a government, then it’s obvious that this is a project we’re going to fight hard for to ensure that it’s on the table.

    “It’s not a parochial issue, it’s not just about Donegal, it’s not just about giving money across the Border. It’s about a win-win situation on both sides of the Border.”

    The planned A5 Western Transport Corridor is designed to provide 85km of new trunk road between Derry and the Border at Aughnacloy and is a key upgrade to the road serving Dublin and Derry/Letterkenny.

    Estimated to cost £650-£850 million (€758-€992 million) in total, the Irish Government is due to fund this and other road projects, principally the €126-€138 million Larne road, to the tune of £400 million (€466 million).

    Irish Government investment in the £60 million ( €70 million) Satellite Radiotherapy Unit at Derry’s Altnagelvin area hospital, due to open in 2015, will also serve health needs in Donegal while the construction of a cross-Border bridge at Narrow Water linking counties Down and Louth is also planned.

    For Mr Costello, the issue is uncomplicated – you cannot spend what you do not have no matter how desirable the project.

    But for Mr McHugh there is a deeper significance, an argument that finds resonance across the board in Northern Ireland.

    “This is a critical access project for the whole of the northwest and not just Donegal and it’s symbolic of the ambition to have joined up thinking in terms of an integrated transport strategy for North and South,” he says.

    “That’s embedded in the Good Friday Agreement.”

    Mr Costello’s remarks jangled nerves at the office of Sinn Féin regional development minister Conor Murphy.

    He insists it’s too late for any stepping back by an Irish Government.

    “Payments are being met,” he said. “This isn’t simply a project which is sitting there for someone to decide if it will happen or not. I think it would be a huge mistake and an abandonment of the people of the northwest if this project were to be reneged on by any government in Dublin,” he told the BBC.

    The new Ulster Unionist leader, Tom Elliott, from Fermanagh, believes there could be a solution to the problem.

    “I share the views of many of the people on both sides of the Border that the project could be scaled down to a more modest version ensuring good roads design and safety conditions are met, this could be achieved at a fraction of the cost.” But that is not a view widely shared.

    SDLP Derry Assembly member Pól Callaghan said his party would meet its fraternal colleagues in the Irish Labour party and other parties to ensure the investment goes ahead as planned.

    “Economic growth is the only credible way out of the current recession and stemming that growth by not completing the A5 would have disastrous consequences for the future economic recovery of the entire northwest of Ireland.”
    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0103/1224286667161.html


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,698 ✭✭✭D'Peoples Voice


    Furet wrote: »
    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0103/1224286667161.html
    The new Ulster Unionist leader, Tom Elliott, from Fermanagh, believes there could be a solution to the problem.

    “I share the views of many of the people on both sides of the Border that the project could be scaled down to a more modest version ensuring good roads design and safety conditions are met, this could be achieved at a fraction of the cost.” But that is not a view widely shared.

    I agree with this sentiment, if we wait until we have the money to do the whole project it will never come about.
    Perhaps for Omagh and Aughnacloy we(they) should replicate the formula they did for the M2.
    It starts out as a motorway coming out of Belfast and then reverts to a lower class road until it reaches Ballymena and becomes a motorway again to bypass the bottleneck.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 70,172 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    The M2 was never intended to end up like that, though. That was the late 80s patchwork fix to the mess left by the 70s withdrawal of funds.

    As it stands, because the M23 was canned and Derry traffic still takes the A6, the Ballymena BP is *still* over-specced.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,356 ✭✭✭Redsoxfan


    Anyone know who's behind the 'No New Road' signs planted along the A5?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 70,172 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Suspect its local community action possibly assisted by one of the Unionist parties.

    You get community or astroturf protests in lots of places, there's "motorway madness" and "no motorway through our village" signs in one of the little villages on the N20 that coincidentally appears to only have one, completely passing trade related, employer...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    Redsoxfan wrote: »
    Anyone know who's behind the 'No New Road' signs planted along the A5?

    Certain Loyalists would be sick to the stomach at the thought of a motorway/dual carriageway connecting Derry to Dublin especially as it will go through mainly Nationalist areas..Its like this, Derry is now the only city on the island not connected to Dublin by motorway/dual carrigeway and its also the only city not to have a rail connection direct to Dublin, so the A5 should go ahead, the government here promised the money and it should deliver it, This road will be great for the North West and thats another reason that some Loyalists will be against it, they will see it as a threat..


  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 12,986 Mod ✭✭✭✭JupiterKid


    charlemont wrote: »
    Certain Loyalists would be sick to the stomach at the thought of a motorway/dual carriageway connecting Derry to Dublin especially as it will go through mainly Nationalist areas..Its like this, Derry is now the only city on the island not connected to Dublin by motorway/dual carrigeway and its also the only city not to have a rail connection direct to Dublin, so the A5 should go ahead, the government here promised the money and it should deliver it, This road will be great for the North West and thats another reason that some Loyalists will be against it, they will see it as a threat..


    But do you have any evidence for this view?:confused: Derry isn't connected to any other urban area by DC or motorway at all.

    In terms of traffic volumes, it is arguable that the A6 from the end of the M2 to Derry is upgraded first.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    JupiterKid wrote: »
    But do you have any evidence for this view?:confused: Derry isn't connected to any other urban area by DC or motorway at all.

    In terms of traffic volumes, it is arguable that the A6 from the end of the M2 to Derry is upgraded first.


    Where did I say Derry was connected to another urban area by DC or motorway ...
    What evidence do I need for my view....its not court we're in...
    Its common knowledge above that some hard-line loyalists dont want the road built....


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 70,172 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    A little of the A6 dualling is to start this year it seems, it seems. DC from the M22 to Toome and then DC from Toome to west of Castledawson.

    The NIRS takes things sloooowly as the timeline of the A26 dualling shows.

    Glenshane is a serious hassle for dualling the whole A6 and I suspect that some traffic would actually use the A5->A4->M1 if the A5 dualling was completed first. A4 is now dual to Ballygawley.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    Welcome for public hearings into plans for Dublin-Derry road
    OPPONENTS OF plans for a new road between Dublin and Derry have welcomed a decision by the Oireachtas transport committee to hold public hearings next month.

    The proposed route would be Ireland’s longest new road, replacing much of the N2 in the Republic and the A5 in Northern Ireland. It would be part-financed by €500 million which the Government agreed to provide under the 2006 St Andrews Agreement.

    The Oireachtas hearings were requested by Joe Costello TD, Labour’s transport spokesman, after he met a coalition of anti-motorway and pro-heritage groups from both sides of the Border in Leinster House this week.

    Mr Costello told the delegation that Labour would draft a new national development plan if it entered government and every current infrastructure project would be reviewed, “no matter what stage of planning it is at”.

    While refusing to be drawn on the N2-A5 given divided views on it in his own party, Mr Costello said the €500 million commitment would be the single biggest drawdown on transport spending in the coming years.

    Public consultation is under way on three sections of the route – the Slane bypass, the Monaghan bypass and the A5 in the North – which are being opposed by Save Newgrange, Don’t Bypass the Bypass and the Alternative A5 Alliance respectively. “No cost-benefit analysis has been performed on the proposed road and traffic numbers do not justify building a new road rather than upgrading the existing one,” said Lynne Smyth of the Alternative A5 Alliance.

    John Dunbar, the group’s chairman, said Sinn Féin and DUP Ministers, as well as those from the Ulster Unionist Party and the SDLP, along with Taoiseach Brian Cowen, “have been saying quite matter of factly that the A5 is a ‘done deal’ and that is that”.

    He said Mr Costello’s comments that any new administration in the Republic “would need to look again at taking a half a billion out of the Southern economy at a time of a national economic emergency puts paid to that notion”.

    Save Newgrange spokesman Vincent Salafia said leading archaeologists had made submissions to An Bord Pleanála against the Slane bypass route, arguing that it would be too close to Brú na Bóinne. He said the obvious solution to traffic problems in Slane would be to ban trucks, as agreed by Meath County Council in 2009, which would force them to use the M1.

    Noel Murphy of the Don’t Bypass the Bypass campaign said Economic and Social Research Institute transport economist Dr Edgar Morgenroth had characterised the proposal to build a motorway east of the new Monaghan bypass as “total overkill”.
    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0114/1224287488918.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭Ren2k7


    If it wasn't for Labours decidedly lacklustre appetite for road construction then I would be more inclined to vote for them. I'm unaware of any concrete (no pun intended) infrastructure proposals from Gilmore and Co. I despise Fianna Fail but at least they left us some top roads. I'm highly doubtful Labour would have delivered what FF did.
    Noel Murphy of the Don’t Bypass the Bypass campaign said Economic and Social Research Institute transport economist Dr Edgar Morgenroth had characterised the proposal to build a motorway east of the new Monaghan bypass as “total overkill”.
    Excuse my ignorance (I haven't been following N2 related action) but are there plans for a motorway or is this just scare mongering from anti-everything groups?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 70,172 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    There's no firm plans for anything. We intend to build a DC to connect to the A5 DC at Aughnacloy/Emyvale, in theory it could be motorway, standard DC or 2+2.

    They've now started building stuff on the Monaghan 'bypass', which justifies not even trying to re-use it.


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