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Iran's foreign minister is to visit Ireland.

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    #32
    fontanalis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,619 ✭✭✭fontanalis


    Winty wrote: »
    Are we on the same team. Sorry :confused:

    No country anywhere has the right to harm or hinder LGBT members of society. So Mousavi in Ireland is good, we may be able to teach him a bit about Human Rights

    We're not even playing the same sport. You said Iran is no better or no worse than the US. I think they are worse.


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    #33
    RealityCheck
    Closed Accounts Posts: 695 ✭✭✭RealityCheck


    Whatever about the USA, what is certain is that Israel and Iran are two sides of the same coin, both fascist, authoritarian, religious supremecist states, with not a care in the world for human rights and nuclear proliferation. I dont think america tick any of those boxes, although they fully support Israel.


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    #34
    piby
    Closed Accounts Posts: 539 ✭✭✭piby


    northwest100 wrote: »
    i'm all for human rights and democracy too but I don't think the US are in any position to lecture Iran or any other nation for that matter on these issues.

    It's actually laughable to hear americans lecturing other countries about democracy when they don't have it themselves, the US system is an oligarchy at best.

    if you actually bothered to read up about US foreign policy and their history, you'd know they've invaded more countries than any other nation in the world.

    There's no other country on the planet who have caused more problems and suffering to people than the US.

    Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo bay, indescriminate bombing and killing of civilians in foreign countries for the pursuit of wealth and power.

    Is the history of the US foreign policy an excercise in promoting democracy and human rights? :D

    At what point in my post did I mention the US? :confused:

    Anyway if you're implying that we should have relations with Iran because we do so with the US then I'm glad you're not our foreign minister!


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    #35
    Kivaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭Kivaro


    Winty wrote: »
    So Mousavi in Ireland is good, we may be able to teach him a bit about Human Rights

    Maybe we could ask him about his involvement in the murder of 10,000 political prisoners in 1988, who were executed for refusing to recant their political and religious beliefs? Or is he to be forgiven because he is seen to be a moderate?

    (Rhetorical Questions).


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    #36
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    I think this is good for Iran. It might help them build an ally in Europe. I think our Government should highlight human rights with them as previously mentioned. But as pointed out - The United States is not in a position, nor will it ever be in a position to lecture Iran about human rights.


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    #37
    Winty
    Registered Users Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭Winty


    Kivaro wrote: »
    Maybe we could ask him about his involvement in the murder of 10,000 political prisoners in 1988, who were executed for refusing to recant their political and religious beliefs? Or is he to be forgiven because he is seen to be a moderate?

    Part of the process will involve Iran admitting the abuse the carried out and Ireland and others can work with them.

    Its better to have Iran pissing out of the tent.

    We in Ireland learned alot with the GFA so we can guide others in getting the human rights issue addressed

    (Rhetorical Answer)


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    #38
    Winty
    Registered Users Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭Winty


    dlofnep wrote: »
    I think this is good for Iran. It might help them build an ally in Europe. I think our Government should highlight human rights with them as previously mentioned. But as pointed out - The United States is not in a position, nor will it ever be in a position to lecture Iran about human rights.

    Thank You dlofnep,
    You put It better than me.

    The Irish Gov. can help Iran, better us than the yanks


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    #39
    ejmaztec
    Registered Users Posts: 23,978 ✭✭✭✭ejmaztec


    Winty wrote: »
    What did the USA do after the weather struck?

    They probably set up another umbrella organisation to assess future threats.


    ...............


    Any Irish dealings with Iran should be on a money up front basis, just in case there's a surprise regime change (in Iran, that is:pac:). When the Shah was deposed, many western businesses never got paid.


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    #40
    My name is URL
    Registered Users Posts: 25,065 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    Report on the news saying there was violence during a protest at the speech, two hecklers were beaten by Iranian security guards


    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0609/iran.html, here's a video

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXUtuHYbmeA


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    #41
    gandalf
    Registered Users Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    Yep two lads interrupted the conference and were man handled quite roughly by Iranian bodyguards out the door. When the Foreign Minister left he was greeted with a hail of eggs. 3 of the protesters were arrested. (on RTE News at 9)


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    #42
    Finnbar01
    Registered Users Posts: 2,064 ✭✭✭Finnbar01


    dlofnep wrote: »
    I think this is good for Iran. It might help them build an ally in Europe. I think our Government should highlight human rights with them as previously mentioned. But as pointed out - The United States is not in a position, nor will it ever be in a position to lecture Iran about human rights.


    And do you think that Ireland is in a position to lecturer anyone on human rights? What with all the abuse going on in the church/state institutions, the corruption of politicians and cover ups by the elite, let alone the death of children in care and the many mishaps and cover ups in by our HSE. You're joking, right?


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    #43
    BlaasForRafa
    Registered Users Posts: 7,020 ✭✭✭BlaasForRafa


    dlofnep wrote: »
    I think this is good for Iran. It might help them build an ally in Europe. I think our Government should highlight human rights with them as previously mentioned. But as pointed out - The United States is not in a position, nor will it ever be in a position to lecture Iran about human rights.

    I think its pretty amusing that the same types of people calling for the Israeli ambassador to be expelled are quite happy for the Iranian foreign minister to be coming here.


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    #44
    Finnbar01
    Registered Users Posts: 2,064 ✭✭✭Finnbar01


    BlaasForRafa wrote: »
    I think its pretty amusing that the same types of people calling for the Israeli ambassador to be expelled are quite happy for the Iranian foreign minister to be coming here.


    Yep and two of his body guard thugs kicked and punched two lawful abiding Iranian protesters. What I find very strange is that there were no protesters from any of the GLTB or women's rights group protesting (I may stand corrected on this).


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    #45
    Kivaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭Kivaro


    My name is URL wrote: »
    Report on the news saying there was violence during a protest at the speach, two hecklers were beaten by Iranian security guards


    Can't find any links to the story, but here's a video

    At least they protested.

    Edit: Thanks to Gandalf for pointing out my error.


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    #46
    gandalf
    Registered Users Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    Kivaro wrote: »
    At least they protested.
    This man was involved in the murder of 10,000 political prisoners in Iran. Just because he is now in the opposition does not mean he should not be held accountable for his past deeds.

    Isn't that one of the leaders of the Iranian Opposition and not the Iranian Foreign Minister who was visiting Dublin today?


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    #47
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Personally, I can't see what the fuss is all about. Are you going to get annoyed every time a minister from a M.Eastern, Asian, S.American, etc country comes visiting? Many countries in this world have appalling periods of activities in the last 30 years. When the US sends people here do you rush out to protest over their actions with Guantanamo Bay? etc.

    I can understand the Irish fascination with Israeli actions.. its an ongoing problem and attention needs to be addressed. However, I don't see too much focus on other areas by Irish protesters.

    The fact that Iran considers Ireland worthwhile to visit is important in itself. This country needs as many links as possible outside of the EU if its to benefit on the world stage. Getting all sanctimonious isn't going to help anybody.


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    #48
    Riddle101
    Registered Users Posts: 8,380 ✭✭✭Riddle101


    I think it's great that Iran's FM is coming here. USA may hate Iran, but that dosen't mean we should. Of course i'm not condoning what Iran does, but still. If Ireland really want to uphold their neutrality(;)) then this would be a sure sign.


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    #49
    Sesshoumaru
    Registered Users Posts: 2,127 ✭✭✭Sesshoumaru


    The foreign minister of Iran visits Ireland
    The green tide has been reversed by a crackdown that has seen an estimated 5,000 people arrested since last June and 115 executed this year alone.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jun/09/iran-election-demonstration-green-repression

    and all some of you can do is is essentially say "I hate Israel, I hate America..... the Iranian regime hates Israel, the Iranian regime hates America and therefore I am happy to have a representative of the Iranian regime in Ireland"

    Whatever you say about the Israeli's at least they aren't killing their own citizens for being members of the opposition, for being gay, for getting raped etc. The double standards here in Ireland just stinks.


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    #50
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    Saw there was some problems with the appearance tonight. Protestors outside and a couple of hecklers/egg throwers inside..anyone see what the protest was about? Not happy with the FM anyway.


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    #51
    RealityCheck
    Closed Accounts Posts: 695 ✭✭✭RealityCheck


    Are the bodyguards going to be arrested and charged for assaulting some of the protesters while ejecting them from the building? That sort of behaviour might be common in Iran but it angers me to see them getting away with that kind of fascist behaviour here.

    Iran is vile, as vile if not more so than Israel.


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    #52
    RandomName2
    Registered Users Posts: 5,565 ✭✭✭RandomName2


    Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

    Jokes aside, any potential trade for this country is a good thing at the moment.

    http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=129618&sectionid=351020101

    They are likely to be disappointed when they find out we don't develop ICBMs. They are looking for new vendors now that even Russia and China have (tentatively at least) agreed to sanction Iran. North Korea is still willing to trade with Iran, but although Pyongyang is willing, its industrial might is weak.

    From the Irish government's point of view it seems a bit of a desperate gesture since being 'at the heart of Europe' didn't produce any discernible effects, nor did the personal groveling of our ministers to attempt to halt the flight of certain multinationals. I mean, perhaps creating closer ties with America might be an idea, but you know, that might be a sensible economic policy. :rolleyes:


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    #53
    wes
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭wes


    RandomName2 wrote: »
    I mean, perhaps creating closer ties with America might be an idea, but you know, that might be a sensible economic policy. :rolleyes:

    Or creating our own indigenous business's so we aren't so dependent on fickler multi-nationals.

    Also, with the situation with Iranian body guards, are they covered by diplomatic immunity?


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    #54
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    wes wrote: »
    Also, with the situation with Iranian body guards, are they covered by diplomatic immunity?

    Most likely, they were probably travelling with the Minister on diplomatic passports/documents etc. Still would like to know what the protest was about though.


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    #55
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    RandomName2 wrote: »
    They are likely to be disappointed when they find out we don't develop ICBMs. They are looking for new vendors now that even Russia and China have (tentatively at least) agreed to sanction Iran. North Korea is still willing to trade with Iran, but although Pyongyang is willing, its industrial might is weak.

    From the Irish government's point of view it seems a bit of a desperate gesture since being 'at the heart of Europe' didn't produce any discernible effects, nor did the personal groveling of our ministers to attempt to halt the flight of certain multinationals. I mean, perhaps creating closer ties with America might be an idea, but you know, that might be a sensible economic policy. :rolleyes:

    The way I look at it, the EU has offered us absolutly duck egg since Lisbon with regards employment promises. They sold out Dell under our noses to Lotz in Poland, god knows what else they will give grants to to move out out of Ireland.

    Perhaps Iran can now fulfill our dreams :)


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    #56
    Kivaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭Kivaro


    gandalf wrote: »
    Isn't that one of the leaders of the Iranian Opposition and not the Iranian Foreign Minister who was visiting Dublin today?

    You're right.

    I got 'em mixed up.
    My brain is mush after hearing about the leader of the opposition whom I respected and hoped would be a viable alternative to the current regime in Iran, was involved in the murder of so many of his countrymen (who would not recant their political and religious beliefs).

    Sorry for creating confusion.


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    #57
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0609/iran.html

    Looks like the sign in the first picture reads Freedom And Democracy, fairly self explanatory so. So much for anyone who thinks it's great to have him here.


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    #58
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    prinz wrote: »
    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0609/iran.html

    Looks like the sign in the first picture reads Freedom And Democracy, fairly self explanatory so. So much for anyone who thinks it's great to have him here.
    I hope the Gardai did their best to protect this good man.


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    #59
    wes
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭wes


    prinz wrote: »
    Most likely, they were probably travelling with the Minister on diplomatic passports/documents etc. Still would like to know what the protest was about though.

    Thanks for the info.

    Yeah, would also like to know what the protest was about as well.


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    #60
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    RealityCheck wrote: »
    Are the bodyguards going to be arrested and charged for assaulting some of the protesters while ejecting them from the building? That sort of behaviour might be common in Iran but it angers me to see them getting away with that kind of fascist behaviour here.

    Iran is vile, as vile if not more so than Israel.

    Assaulting? Did they beat the crap out of the protesters? Or did they just throw them out of a building they shouldn't have been in the first place?


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    #61
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Assaulting? Did they beat the crap out of the protesters? Or did they just throw them out of a building they shouldn't have been in the first place?

    They gave at least one guy a good kicking, which was totally unnessecary - he made no move to attack the speaker. Why the cops haven't arrested them is what I'd like to know.


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