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Child Item

Row with in-laws

elvis83

Hi,

My wife and I recently had a row with her parents. Not exactly sure how to handle it from here. Basically, what happened is this.

I was away recently, playing music for a few nights, meaning I was away from my wife and our 1 year old. This wasn't a problem, my wife was on-board with this, it was a few extra pound coming in for us. However, I received a text late one night from her father, saying I had let her and our baby down. This pretty much crushed me. I didn't know if my wife had been complaining about it behind my back or what.

I spoke to her the next day and she was livid. She hadn't said anything of the sort. Anyway, I ignored that initial text, because I figured it would be better to talk face to face (the text was sent late too, so I figured he'd had a few drinks).

Later that day (while I was still away), her mother visited my wife, and they had a bit of a row. She rang me in tears, I was disgusted that I wasn't there with her to help her out.

I got home. My wife and I visited her parents. I spoke to them, being very careful about not letting anger get the better of me. I said I was very hurt by what they had sent, it affected me deeply. They just said something along the lines of the truth hurts. They said everyone had been talking about me being away for the weekend. I said I didn't care what people said, and asked them should I turn down opportunities to make a few extra pound. To be fair, her dad conceded a little at that point, saying he didn't know that was the case.

Her mother though kept up. I get the feeling there was a lot of stuff pent-up that just came out at me. She said she felt "so sorry" for my wife and child that I was away. That I needed to grow up. That I was all me-me-me. This shocked me to the core. I've tried my hardest to be a good husband and father and to get this thrown at me was pretty shocking. My wife was equally shocked to the core.

We left dumb-founded at this stage. Both my wife and I are in bits about it. It was a good relationship (or so I thought) up until that point. Have they always thought so lowly about me? I pressed them on examples of what they meant, but all they could say was, "you know what we mean". This was frustrating and perplexing, which is why we left at that stage, before either of us said anything that would make matters worse.

The result was a sleepless night for both of us. I haven't been able to concentrate all day. My wife is in bits. I'm full of self-doubt; have I been selfish?

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bur

Do ye ever do anything nice for the MIL for all the free childminding?

elvis83

bur wrote: »

Do ye ever do anything nice for the MIL for all the free childminding?

We take them out for meals occasionally. Maybe not enough though. I never thought of it as an issue, they both seemed happy enough with the situation, especially my MIL.

I'll take to my wife again about it. I know it sounds silly, but I'm afraid now that if we continue down this road, they might try and turn my daughter against me in years to come, and that chills me.

groovyg

Op the issue here is not your or your wife its them, your father in law has an anger management problem which impacts on your MIL which then impacts on your wife. You've already said that another sibling doesn't get on with the dad, avoids staying in the house as it will lead to rows, so its obvious your father in law is somebody who likes being the centre of attention, causing rows and getting his own way. You and your wife stood up to them and they didn't like it.
You and your wife both seem to have good relationship where decisions around your own family unit are agreed on and thats the most important thing here. What your in laws think of you is not important and if they don't like you or find fault with anything you do then you will never please them.

I think you both should look at alternative baby sitting arrangements, the one thing I would worry about is them giving off negative vibes about ye as couple to your daughter, you don't want them bad mouthing you and your wife in front of her. As long as you, your wife and daughter are happy thats all that matters don't waste any more mental energy on them.

LynnGrace

I agree about looking for alternative babysitters. I know you have said that your wife would prefer not to do this, but, it's not a good set-up, especially if the fil somehow believes it gives him the right to say stuff like he did, to you.

I'd say a bit of distance / cooling off would be a good idea. It sounds like they know a bit too much about your everyday lives - that's just my take on it. Hopefully you don't live very close to them, because that, in my opinion, does make it harder to, literally, create a bit of distance.
The fil does appear to have issues, and long term, it doesn't sound an ideal environment for your child(ren) to be exposed to.

Take care of yourself, seek out any help you need, especially if you feel the symptoms of depression returning.
Sounds like you and your wife are a strong unit, which is a big plus, especially in dealing with in-laws.

All the best.

valoren

elvis83 wrote: »

And like I've said, her father has a serious rage problem, which doesn't help. He picks fights with people, I've seen him do it to every one of his family members.

He seems to have a problem with you because you spoke out against him. And in his head that is verboten. You're not dancing to his tune essentially. It seems like the family members he has been picking fights with are placating this behavior. You quite rightly refused to be another yes man and this has caused him to resent it. The text was his opportunity to have a go at you, he saw his chance and sent the text.

The next time you speak with him just politely tell him to not send anymore texts of that nature to you. That your his son in law and anything he has to say to you, he can say it to your face. You said he recoiled at hearing the real reason you were away. He owes you a full apology.

elvis83

Thanks again folks for all your input. My wife dropped our daughter off with her mum earlier. I'm not happy about this. I feel like this is condoning and accepting what they've done. There was really no choice today though as she had an appointment that she had to make, and I was stuck at work. Still, I feel like it's implicitly saying it's acceptable to treat our family like that, and we'll keep coming back.

There's more complexity. Someone asked about where we are living. There's about 8 kilometres away from us. That's pretty close, but still far enough away to put distance between us, and limits the amount of time we need to see each other. The problem is, we are midway in the process of buying a house of them, which is pretty much on their doorstep. My heart is out of this now. I get the feeling it would be used against us for years to come. My wife has continually said it will be fine, because she loves the area (and I don't blame her, it's beautiful) and they gave us a good deal on it. But I can't shake the feeling that it will just be another stick to beat me with down the line. And then, of course, if we're trying to raise our daughter and they are interfering and commenting and god knows what other manipulation.

I wasn't joking when I said it was a mess.

Someone else mentioned about her brother not staying at home. This is pretty much because he stood up to his father as well. I've seen his dad pick at him and annoy him, just to get him started and try and rise a fight. He even had to move out for a while and move in with my wife and I while he got sorted with work away from home. Basically, it's the only reason he left.

I think my wife and I need to have a big talk, because I simply can't see this working out. I really don't like disappointing her, but our mental health, and our daughter's upbringing is ten times more important.

Thanks again folks, I've found it great to air this.

Tigger99

That's tricky about the house but if I were you I'd be grateful this had happened before you bought a house beside them. Especially if they are giving you a discount and you would feel indebted.

lawred2

discus wrote: »

Why is this even an issue. Why are you letting anyone talk to you like that? You're a grown man - a father at that - and you are letting an elderly pair tell you how 'bad' you are? You don't have to answer to them. Tell them to get ****ed, if you and your wife are happy, and she is understanding of what you are doing, that's all that matters.

They aren't an elderly pair. They are his wife's parents.

Of course what they say will affect him.

lawred2

elvis83 wrote: »

They do. In fact, my wife had planned on using her mum tomorrow to look after the wee one. I'm not too keen on that, but I think it's our only option at the minute.

I can't imagine it causing resentment, but you could be right. I suggested perhaps looking at some other child-minder, but my wife thinks that's too far, that there would be no coming back from a row like that.

Devils advocate here..

It can very much create resentment. Remember these people have done their child rearing. Or at least thought they had. Looking after your kids is not the same as a weekly grandparent's trip to see their grandkids.. it becomes a job. An expectation that they feel they can't refuse. It's possible that they feel it is taking from their time together. And then they see you off playing music for the weekend..

What do you guys do to recognize that they are providing childcare for you?

elvis83

valoren wrote: »

The next time you speak with him just politely tell him to not send anymore texts of that nature to you. That your his son in law and anything he has to say to you, he can say it to your face. You said he recoiled at hearing the real reason you were away. He owes you a full apology.

"Recoiled" is a bit strong. More like a very meek, "I didn't know that". I staild something like, why the hell would you know it, it was none of your business, all you did was jump to an assumption. Can't remember the exact words. I was angry, but controlled. Like I said, I took pains not go overboard, because that could have made matters worse.

elvis83

lawred2 wrote: »

Devils advocate here..

It can very much create resentment. Remember these people have done their child rearing. Or at least thought they had. Looking after your kids is not the same as a weekly grandparent's trip to see their grandkids.. it becomes a job. An expectation that they feel they can't refuse. It's possible that they feel it is taking from their time together. And then they see you off playing music for the weekend..

What do you guys do to recognize that they are providing childcare for you?

Like I said, we've taken them out for meals on occasion, but to be fair that's about it, so probably adds to the resentment. I wanted to pay initially, at least something, but they wouldn't have it. Maybe as time has gone on, it has become a problem.

I hadn't really considered it like that tbh.

lawred2

elvis83 wrote: »

Like I said, we've taken them out for meals on occasion, but to be fair that's about it, so probably adds to the resentment. I wanted to pay initially, at least something, but they wouldn't have it. Maybe as time has gone on, it has become a problem.

I hadn't really considered it like that tbh.

Sounds like you need to give them the chance again to explain themselves... if they have some genuine reasons for the upset them you can all work like adults together..

Remember your children will be all the better for having loving grandparents.

If they offer nothing of any value.. then maybe you'll just have to live with them being d!cks

elvis83

I honestly don't think it's because of the child-minding. When I faced them about this, that wasn't mentioned once. It was all aimed at me being selfish, and feeling sorry for my wife and child, real emotional manipulation. They even brought up my dead mother, saying she wouldn't be happy at my behaviour. Pretty low.

I'm sure that if the childminding was top of their list of complaints, it would have come out then. They've always loved having our girl down with them, it's their first grand-child, they pestered us for ages about having kids. My wife's mother willingly retired early because she was looking forward to doing child-care for us.

The reason my wife doesn't want to take that away from her mum is because it would crush her - if what people are suggesting her is correct (that she resents the child-minding) then her mum would welcome it. I can't see that to be honest.

That all being said, I'm not telepathic, so I can't be sure. It's something that I'll have to iron out with them.

Electric Sheep

I am closer in age to the in laws than the OP, and I know grandparents who thought they were fine with doing the chilcare, but then found it affecting their physical and mental health. They couldn't bring it up for fear of seeming not to love their cild and grandchild.

dellas1979

Now is the time to draw boundaries OP. Its out of control (which is where the anxiety may be coming from).

They are the in-laws but they are only people.

I would suggest your wife talks to them on their own first. Listen to them and put any concerns to bed. Not as their daughter, but as a grown woman, with a husband and a child.

I would then suggest talking to them yourself, on your own, with the attitude that all parties have in common the welfare of your wife and child.
Imagine your daughter is married to a guy in 20 years. And something like this happened between you and the guy. What would you expect him to do (as her parents).

Be the bigger people in this situation. Your father in law is well aware now he has an anger issue (you've already told him). Do not throw fuel on your own fire by keeping reminding (and psyching yourself out) yourself of this.

See it as leading them by example.

lawred2

elvis83 wrote: »

I honestly don't think it's because of the child-minding. When I faced them about this, that wasn't mentioned once. It was all aimed at me being selfish, and feeling sorry for my wife and child, real emotional manipulation. They even brought up my dead mother, saying she wouldn't be happy at my behaviour. Pretty low.

I'm sure that if the childminding was top of their list of complaints, it would have come out then. They've always loved having our girl down with them, it's their first grand-child, they pestered us for ages about having kids. My wife's mother willingly retired early because she was looking forward to doing child-care for us.

The reason my wife doesn't want to take that away from her mum is because it would crush her - if what people are suggesting her is correct (that she resents the child-minding) then her mum would welcome it. I can't see that to be honest.

That all being said, I'm not telepathic, so I can't be sure. It's something that I'll have to iron out with them.

I don't think it would be as easy for them to bring up as you think

Neyite

The thing with childcare is that you become indebted to them for it. This gives them perceived rights to involve themselves in your life, in the decisions you and your wife make for your family.

They have obviously got some 'opinion' of you, from somewhere. It's unfounded, and I think that part of the reason is that if your FIL is a controlling sort, then they will likely have strong ideas of what kind of man they wanted their daughter to settle down with. And its not a musician sort they had in mind - no offence to you whatsoever.

Then the dynamics change when you have a baby - in loads of little ways - when you become a parent yourself, you see what your parents did and didn't do through fresh eyes. The awesome stuff they did, the mistakes they made. Your relationship changes too, becoming your own brand new family does that, you have your own views on rearing the baby so in lots of little ways the best practice from the time your MIL reared a baby has changed. She may feel out of her depth with new-fangled practices us young parents do. We assume that our mothers deftly step in but sometimes childminding can make them realise how exhausting it actually is.

I know your wife is reading this, so I'll phrase this as nicely as I can: She is the gateway to resolving this. That means no more going over to theirs with a moody head on her that they can deliberately misinterpret to be caused by you. Being careful about what details of your lives that she gives them. It means being firm with both her parents and shutting down any criticism of her husband the moment that they attempt to give out about you. It doesn't have to be a big row, it should be her calmly responding that she is not interested in hearing their opinion of her husband - she loves you and you have her full support with your gigs. If they persist, she gets up and leaves. They will soon figure out that their opinions are unwanted.

Now the baby is a year old, and maybe a bit down the line once the dust has settled, it might be well worth mixing in a bit of creche part time. Spin it that toddlers need socialisation -they honestly thrive playing with other babies. I see the difference between my child and my neighbours who had hers minded alone. This gives MIL a break too.

I'm not sure that confrontation is a good thing. Things said get remembered forever. Far better to work towards withdrawing gradually from being indebted to them while keeping it all cordial.

Take some time to think about moving in next door. It's all very well for your wife to want to do that, she's their daughter so its far easier for her but she is putting you in a very difficult position wanting her parents so involved. So she needs to have a good think about her boundaries with her parents, and how they impact on her relationship, her husbands mental health, and if she really wants to potentially cause damage to her family this way. My partner finds my mum a bit of a chore. I obviously love her to bits, and she's not the kind to find fault with him, but I'd never suggest moving beside her (also a beautiful area) because this would be difficult for him. Likewise, when his mother begins to be critical of me, he also firmly puts her back in her box, to the extent that now she doesn't bother at all because she now knows it falls on deaf ears. He's established the boundaries and now we get on fairly well. And we continue to make decisions as a family that the inlaws would disapprove of I'm sure, but we've gotten gradually to the point where they know to keep their opinion to themselves and we know what details to share with them.

jimmycrackcorm

elvis83 wrote:

They do. In fact, my wife had planned on using her mum tomorrow to look after the wee one. I'm not too keen on that, but I think it's our only option at the minute.

I think this has a lot to do with your problem. They feel they have a right to interfere in your marriage because of thus dependency. Source alternative childcare and keep them at bay or forever have to put up with interference.

Electric Sheep

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I think this has a lot to do with your problem. They feel they have a right to interfere in your marriage because of thus dependency. Source alternative childcare and keep them at bay or forever have to put up with interference.

And this conviction that you owe them will only get worse if you buy that house from them at a discounted price.

Toots

Electric Sheep wrote: »

And this conviction that you owe them will only get worse if you buy that house from them at a discounted price.

+1000, god if there's already bad blood between you and your father in law then moving even closer to them, especially into that house, sounds like a recipe for disaster. You definitely need to speak to your wife about this ASAP. If you move into the house and end up at the end of your rope, you could find it very difficult to move out again both for financial reasons, and also because they'd probably take it as a personal insult that you're moving out of 'their' house.

LegacyUser

I've read this thread through and OP you sound like quite a reasonable person. I know you've said that there are a few other factors at play here too, but it sounds to me like you had a bit of a row with the FIL a few months (a year?) ago, and quite possibly, he's held it against you all that time. Particularly if he's had form with anger issues in the past. I don't actually think the childminding thing is the problem at all.

You could go about this two ways. You could iron it out with them. Or - you could let it die, but now is the "fresh start" point. For what it's worth btw, I'm the mother of a 21 month old girl and myself and my husband live about 10 mins from my folks and 30mins from his, and he has no brothers or sisters. This is a minefield we've approached a few times in the last few years, particularly since our baby arrived.

If you try to iron it out, you could sort it out - or you could end up making it worse. My personal feeling is that you may end up making it worse, simply due to the personalities involved. Leopards don't change their spots and all that, and as much as it might seem obvious to you and me that confronting the situation is best, sometimes a personality like your FIL will just not allow the thing to be resolved. So for the peaceful relationships of all involved the only way to go may be to just leave it.Given the past history with the brother, it might be the best way - considering the wider relationships, shall we say, rather than just yourselves and the in-laws. However, that's just my 2c and you and your wife will know better whether it is something that could be ironed out.

The other way of letting it lie - what I mean is that you don't bring this up again, but that the regime change starts now

. The house situation is unfortunate - is there anything you can do about that? However the childminding situation - Neyite is right, and I can see from my own experience, kids do need more socialisation as they get a bit bigger. Your little one is starting to get to the age where is would be great for her to see other kids during the week, rather than just grandparents. As I said, we have one (also a first grandchild) and I was adamant that grandparents are for emergencies only. Our LO is with a childminder during the week, and there are a couple of other kids there too. It gives her the social time, brings other people into her life, and honestly, lets the grandparents be grandparents. We also felt personally that it removed any conflict that could arise in the future around these things, and I wanted to have someone that I could have a "business" relationship with, rather than in-laws who I mightn't always agree with on what they were doing with my daughter. So far, it's worked out well.Further more, it means that if we want to go out for dinner or something at weekends I don't feel so bad asking the grandparents to mind her, which I would if they had her all week. Since your MIL wants to do the childminding, I'd suggest you frame it the way Neyite has said, and maybe start by suggesting she do 2/3 days a week as an alternative, and take it from there. The other side of this is that it's all very well for her to mind the child now at this age, but what happens 2/3/4 years down the line as she and the baby get older and potentially more kids follow? Our little one is MAJOR effort to mind all day (I'm heavily pregnant too) and you need a lot of energy for her. An older person could, I think, find it hard going as time goes on.

The other thing is that your wife shuts down any comments or conversation about you or your family, or you as a family unit. That has to be the approach. You pretty much have to draw big black lines around you guys as boundaries, particularly if you end up living very close to them. They don't need to know every aspect of your lives and they don't need to be involved in every aspect of your lives. We do something similar, there is a bit of a need-to-know aspect to all these things. I know we make decisions too that neither set of parents approves of (at varying times), but - tough ****, is my response! It's tough at the start, but as the kids get a bit bigger (even at 21 months it's beginning to show in our house), your time begins to fill with other things than just visiting grandparents - you visit other friends with kids, you start going out and about during the day to playgrounds etc (because being stuck in a house with a toddler would drive you spare), and you may even get a couple of afternoon meals out with them - that kind of thing. So it does become a bit easier in some ways because you're simply not around to see them all the time. We aim to see grandparents at least every 2 weeks, if not every week, as we both work full-time.

Sorry, I'm rambling on a bit here, but I guess what I'm saying is that a bit of distance between yourselves and the in-laws is no harm, and start thinking longer-term about childminding etc, rather than just the here and now. Neyite makes some excellent suggestions that would be good to take on board. And OP, it's not a total mess. It's not YOUR mess. It's your FIL's issue and to be honest, I don't think there's much you can do about except protect yourself and your family, if that makes sense. You and your wife are on the same page which is great, and supporting each other, and that makes a huge difference.

Best of luck.

meeeeh

I wouldn't say it's childminding.

They are overbearing. If they thought your wife is distressed because you were away they should talk to your wife about it and only if she asked them to contact you. That being said precedent was set when you dealt with your father in law about issues in his marriage. It was none of your business either. On a separate note I do wonder on what planet people live on. It is completely normal that someone could be away from their partner for couple of nights.

I think your wife has to talk to them but you should stay out of their private matters too.

elvis83

ok latest update.

My wife went to visit them last night. FIL was very quiet. Made cryptic remarks that I should "read my history books", whatever that means. He's a master at making cryptic remarks when the row is on, and then getting thick when no-one can decipher them.

As for the MIL. She claimed they were trying to apologise that last night! I swear to god I have no idea what planet these people are on. On that evening they called me selfish, told me to grow up, that a married man shouldn't leave his family, called my wife a coward, brought up my dead mother, told me that "the truth hurts", and gave a very subtle threat - how in the name of God can that be considered a f**king apology.

It gets better. They said they want to put it all behind them, and that we (WE!!!) should grow up and get over it at this stage. This is typical of the manipulation and laying down of guilt that has been present throughout the entire time I've known them, but I've generally kept the peace for my wife's sake.

At this stage in proceedings, my wife broke down and said she hated all this bad blood. The worst part of all of this, is that she thinks they took that as being the end of it, that it's all settled and over and down with!

I was livid when she came back and told me all this. I said my heart wasn't in this house any more, and I had huge reservations about leaving the LO with them. Even if it's just throw-away comments about me or our relationship, I simply don't want my daughter to be around that. My wife cried for an age. She doesn't want to pull out of the house deal (or the child-minding) because "there would be no going back" with her parents - but she doesn't want to go through with buying the house because she thinks I'd end up resenting her in years to come. Basically, she doesn't want to let down either party. I tried to tell her it's not about letting down either party, it's about doing what's best for her and her family. She's been put through emotional hell by these people, does she really want a similar experience for her daughter?

She cried it out, very upset. My focus changed from the situation at hand, to her and her mental well-being. I've said it already, I suspected a bit of depression before, but was never 100% sure. For a start, sometimes she says she "needs a good cry" and feels better after it. Also, she sometimes talks about things that sounds a bit like depression to me, but she is 100% herself the next day.

But this was different. I convinced her she needed to get to a doctor ASAP. I took today off work and got her in. The doctor agreed she was suffering from depression and referred her to a psychiatric nurse who will be getting in touch in the next day or two.

At this stage, I'm relieved she's gone to the doctor, and extremely proud of her. I know exactly how difficult and harrowing it is walking through those doors and asking for help. You feel a burden to everyone - those were the exact words she used with me last night. But now I think she's realising herself she needs to worry just about herself and no-one else. She needs to be 100% selfish for a change. I'm taking sometime off work to help with the LO and let her get rest, because I know exactly how tough it can be.

As for the in-laws. I swear to God I'll chase them with a shotgun if they come within 50 foot of the house.

Neyite

I'd imagine that her depression would improve immensely if she minimised contact with those two.

I highly recommend you read Toxic Parents by Susan Forward, both of you.

LegacyUser

Maybe your in laws suspected, as you say you also did, that their own daughter was depressed? Maybe, just maybe, that was what was behind all of this?
Also, by providing free childcare, their aim would have been to ease your financial burden& to facilitate you spending more time together as a family unit? So then for you to go away gigging for a few nights on the proviso of earning more money, must have made them question - well, how would they manage financially if they had to pay for childcare, if they plan on having another kid or 2?
Just throwing out a few other possibilities OP.
You don't need to take out your shotgun, just disengage from all the- really fairly unnecessary- drama. No one has terminal cancer, you have a healthy child, a loving marriage. Focus on the positives & on creating happy times& memories. Life is too short for nit-picking& point-scoring& arguing over who said what when.

elvis83

Neyite wrote: »

I highly recommend you read Toxic Parents by Susan Forward, both of you.

I've just downloaded it to the kindle. It's bang-on so far. My wife's not fit for reading yet but I'm going to get through it over the next few days. Thanks for the tip.

fvbxx wrote: »

Maybe your in laws suspected, as you say you also did, that their own daughter was depressed? Maybe, just maybe, that was what was behind all of this?
Also, by providing free childcare, their aim would have been to ease your financial burden& to facilitate you spending more time together as a family unit? So then for you to go away gigging for a few nights on the proviso of earning more money, must have made them question - well, how would they manage financially if they had to pay for childcare, if they plan on having another kid or 2?
Just throwing out a few other possibilities OP.
You don't need to take out your shotgun, just disengage from all the- really fairly unnecessary- drama. No one has terminal cancer, you have a healthy child, a loving marriage. Focus on the positives & on creating happy times& memories. Life is too short for nit-picking& point-scoring& arguing over who said what when.

Ok, I can concede that they noticed something up and wanted to help. I still think they took that opportunity though to have a go at me. If they were genuinely wanting to help their daughter, surely they would talk to her? I know that's what I would do, I would try my best to provide a safe environment for my daughter to talk about anything that was troubling her, and avoid being judgemental. That being said, I do appreciate that I have the experience of going through depression and coming out the other side which gives you a bit of empathy and compassion.

However I don't agree with your opinion that they were questioning how we would manage child-care when I was away gigging for some extra cash. When this row blowed up initially, they didn't know I was getting paid when I was away. So I really don't think they followed the train of thought that you've laid out here.

And yes, you are correct, life is too short. The problem is, we've had this mentality for years. We've often rolled our eyes at the two of them, and kept out of things and just carried on about our business. But there comes a point when that kind of consistent behaviour blows up into something horrible - in this case my wife's depression. I've calmed down a bit since my "shotgun" rant, and I know I could now engage with them in a polite but firm way that neither of us want to see them, and let them deal with that whatever way they choose.

Again, thanks all for the advice.

LegacyUser

Are you a full time musician? As in, is that your job, or do they see you playing gigs as a hobby that you 'go off for the weekend to do', where you might be thrown a few quid? I think the answer to that might affect how they feel about you going away for a weekend.

To try to look at it from another point of view, they're facilitating you with child care, you aren't paying for childcare, you're going to get a house at a reduced price - and they're doing this to help you out financially, but yet their daughter is down when you're away for a weekend. I think they've dealt with it dreadfully, but tbh I'd question what was going on if I were them.

I'm not trying to put you or your wife down in any way, but if you strictly look from the outside in, with no other reasons to go on, your wife's parents are giving a lot financially, and a lot physically (giving up their time to be your childcare providers). And what do they see: they see you disappearing for a weekend, and your wife being upset. Being honest, I'm not surprised that they flipped out. They're defending their daughter, albeit in a cack handed way. But I really don't think they're the demons you make them out to be.

OP, they're doing a huge huge amount for you & their daughter. I can actually see why they're concerned for your daughter. But it sounds like they - and your wife - can't seem to communicate in any way other than reacting to things. Can they not talk, as a family?

I genuinely think that the childcare stuff is the root of your problem. I think they see it as taking advantage, especially when you go away playing music. Like I said, if that's your full time job, fair enough; but if you go away for a weekend playing music and come back with only a few quid, tbh I cldnt blame them for being annoyed, as they are saving you so much financially.

elvis83

No music isn't my full-time job. I used to play quite a bit but completely lost interest in it when the depression hit. I would see it the other way round - wouldn't it be worse if I was away from my family every single weekend, instead of just the occasional gig to keep it alive? And it wasn't just a couple of quid, it was good money that came in, something that would be hard to turn down. As I said, my FIL did concede a tiny amount when I told him that, and that's a big deal for him!

I hear what you're saying, but if they resent offering child-care to us, then why is my wife so adamant that it would crush the MIL if we took it away from her? Should I just push forward and say, no, we have to take it away from them because it's causing resentment and issues? Thus upsetting my wife further?

I take your point about them being concerned about their daughter when I was away. And I've conceded previously that I have the 'advantage' of having depression before to understand empathy. The generation above us didn't have the same support that we do, I guess, and I can hardly blame them for not knowing how to handle certain situations. If all they know is fight-or-flight, then that's all they'll go with. And, in hindsight, maybe going away wasn't the best decision when I suspected depression, but like I said it was hard to determine and the money from the gigs was hard to turn down.

Communication is dreadful - it's impossible for my daughter to having a meaningful discussion with her father. He'll open up with a few drinks, but that inevitably leads to a row.

They're not the monsters I make them out to be, I'm just frustrated and venting about the situation. But you can't blame me for wanting to protect my family from toxic people. I'd be happy to remove all of their help; the house, the childcare, the whole lot. We'll manage some other way. We're certainly not rich, but we're not on the breadline either. But my wife won't do this because of how it will crush them, and that it won't help alleviate the situation or make matters better. So what do I do in that case?

elvis83

And one other point to clarify - we're buying a house of them that was built 8 years ago in the boom. It's not like they've been able to get rid of it since. They're giving us a good deal, but at the same time, we are taking it off their hands; a deal that works for everyone (in theory).

But even with all this, I think it would still be used as a stick against us, another reason to get involved and try and call the shots, judge us and dictate to us.

LegacyUser

It's a tough situation. All I can say is that there's something they have a massive bee in their bonnet about, and you being away seems to have brought it to a head.

Do you think they know/suspect that your wife has depression/PND, and they were shocked that you left her on her own to mind your daughter? I can see how that might set things off, even if you were bringing in good money over the weekend by playing music.

I think shutting them out re childcare would come across as tit-for-tat, but surely you could use the reasons said here, that it would be good for your daughter to socialise etc. Takes the sting out of it for them. Even if they do feel taken advantage of, which I seriously suspect is the case.

Not getting at your wife, but does she tell them too much about the daily ins-and-outs of your relationship? That might also explain why they seem so unnaturally aggrieved.

Maybe the free childcare/cut price house makes them feel that you should be showing more gratitude than you are. Not saying they're right - but the childcare stuff is huge. I don't know what the arrangements are, but if they're minding your daughter 5 days a week, they're saving you around 1250 a week. On the other hand, you can't live your life constantly thanking them! Which is why removing childcare from the dynamic would be better all round.

I suspect that your wife may just be too involved with them (childcare, moving in beside them, letting them in on your relationship too much), and that no boundaries have ever been established. And that they feel perfectly with their rights to stick their noses into your relationship. Is it possible that your wife needs to cut the apron strings a bit?