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Child Item

Another light sentence handed down by the courts

handlemaster

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/circuit-court/man-who-broke-skull-in-attack-gets-suspended-sentence-1.2298734

It seems unbelievable with such an attack on someone that the defendant will not see the inside of a jail.

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bodhrandude

So what were they sentenced with, 40 watt light bulbs or the 120 watt ones.

darkpagandeath

jobbridge4life wrote: »

To quote Kate Nash...

Nope one has painted themselves into a corner and now demanding peer reviewed studies. Ireland has a pandemic problem with scumbags, You cannot go a day or so without reading something like this. The lack of any punishments has given rise to this if one thinks otherwise I would like to see them link peer reviewed papers stating the opposite and that none custodial sentencing in Ireland has reduced crime.

jobbridge4life

darkpagandeath wrote: »

I have managed my whole life no matter how drunk, To not batter the face off someone or kick them in the head. Maybe as I was brought up correctly and I am also not a Scumbag.

Wow so your personal experience should overwhelm the endless evidence, as recognized for centuries that drug use is, regardless of class, disproportionately associated with criminality. LoL

Ronin247

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Completely agree.. however, as long as we have a society that shirks all personal responsibility whenever possible - blaming "someone else" or the "system" or a "disadvantaged upbringing" (as was used by the Defence per the OP's link) it's going to continue.

Yet despite this, many of the same people who express shock and disgust at such a case and sentence, are then the first to be calling for the legalisation of so-called "harmless" drugs. Yup, makes sense! :rolleyes:

Bit of a strawman there really. Legalisation or not of drugs is totally irrelevant, if you commit a crime then the excuse of " I was drunk/stoned/high " should not be acceptable.

Alcohol is a legal substance and you are not allowed to drive under the influence.... and YOU are personally responsible to ensure you dont drink and drive.

darkpagandeath

jobbridge4life wrote: »

Wow so your personal experience should overwhelm the endless evidence, as recognized for centuries that drug use is, regardless of class, disproportionately associated with criminality. LoL

What's that got to do with being a scumbag ? Plenty of rich scumbags about that have battered the heads off people remember that high profile one years ago with the young fella from foxrock killing someone.

RaRaRasputin

jobbridge4life wrote: »

Personally though if for instance one of my sisters (fingers crossed, praise jesus, through salt over my shoulder) were attacked I know I'd want to end those who perpetrated it.

Please elaborate because I am very interested. Would you call for a debate to the death?

Ronin247

RaRaRasputin wrote: »

Please elaborate because I am very interested. Would you call for a debate to the death?

He would beat them round the head with a peer reviewed study

the_syco

jobbridge4life wrote: »

Whats a scumbag? Before you answer you might want to consult the thread on whether teddy boy is the new fashion.

Someone that hurts someone else for no reason = scumbag.

jobbridge4life wrote: »

You have no evidence, peer reviewed evidence to verify that. Not a bit.

No, you haven't.

NorthStars

obezyana wrote: »

And what do neck tattoos say about a person?

Lower class punk.

frostyjacks

Judges are living in some sort of fantasy land where criminals like this can learn the error of their ways. They can't; they will always be law-breaking scum. If it was a fellow judge that was kicked in the head you can be damn sure the guy would have got 40 years without parole.

K.Flyer

NorthStars wrote: »

Lower class punk.

Plenty of successful people with neck tattoos going around, in steady employment, some with their own businesses, and they don't go around smashing peoples skulls in.

eviltwin

jobbridge4life wrote: »

I'm glad you raised that point. What does make it easier for the victim?

I think knowing the person who did this has been punished would be a start. Psychologically going through the legal process only to have the culprit go free is mentally hard to take. It makes you wonder why you bothered. His crappy upbringing is a lame excuse. What if he'd killed the guy, would you be as forgiving then?

Little CuChulainn

The court heard that there were shouts of “kill him, kill him” from the crowd.

What are you supposed to do to fix an area like that?

Gatling

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

What are you supposed to do to fix an area like that?

White phosphorus lots of white phosphorus

darkpagandeath

eviltwin wrote: »

I think knowing the person who did this has been punished would be a start. Psychologically going through the legal process only to have the culprit go free is mentally hard to take. It makes you wonder why you bothered. His crappy upbringing is a lame excuse. What if he'd killed the guy, would you be as forgiving then?

Ireland badly need similar 1 punch legislation like Aus. Seems to have had a positive effect over there.

Kermit.de.frog

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/man-involved-in-temple-bar-group-attack-on-us-tourists-sees-jail-sentence-reduced-688440.html

Man involved in Temple Bar group attack on US tourists sees jail sentence reduced

The court heard that the two American tourists suffered “very significant injuries” as a result of the attack – one suffered a broken arm and the other permanent facial scarring from a broken battle.

Counsel for the Director of Public Prosecutions, Kerida Naidoo BL, said a man had been lying unconscious on the ground in Temple Bar when a group of people including Dent proceeded to interfere with him.

The two Americans tried to help the man on the ground. A melee ensued and it was accepted by the jury that the fight was started by Dent's group, Mr Naidoo said.

Following that incident, everybody left Temple Bar - the Americans turned right along the quays towards O'Connell Street and the group of men turned left towards Heuston Station.

At that stage, Mr Naidoo said, the event was over. It would have been an unpleasant story for the Americans to tell back home but it would have been the end of it.

However, the group decided to chase the Americans and very significant injuries were inflicted on them, Mr Naidoo said.

****ing scumbag little scamp

darkpagandeath

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

What are you supposed to do to fix an area like that?

Aye seems Environmental as well, All of them in the same position loads of convictions no actual punishment gives the community a sense of immunity and can do anything they like attitude.

K.Flyer

jobbridge4life wrote: »

[...]
Personally though if for instance one of my sisters (fingers crossed, praise jesus, through salt over my shoulder) were attacked I know I'd want to end those who perpetrated it.

So how would you feel if it did happen, and how would you feel if he had an armfull of convictions for all sorts of crimes including assault and how would you feel if the sent him on his way with a suspended sentence.

The reason incarceration doesn't really work in this country is because it is too light, and is not a detterent. Suspended sentencing, concurrent sentencing, revolving door court rooms, it's a fcuking joke. And don't get me started on the free legal aid.
How the fcuk can it be called justice letting this scumbag out after being found guilty of what can only be described as attempted murder.
As for overcrowding, if there is not enough room then lets build more prisons, create employment building, maintaining and running them and put these cnuts away for much much longer terms.
Then our streets could be safer and these litttle toe-rags might think twice before trying to smash someones head in.
The judicial system is a joke, and this type of cr@p makes me so fu@king angrry.
/rant.

bur

What can be done to rid ourselves of these useless ****ing judges? These sentences are criminal in their own way.

captbarnacles

I remember reading an interview with the cop who helped clean up NYC and he was asked what Ireland could do to reduce crime in the capital. His number one recommendation was "make criminals serve out their sentences".

Bongalongherb

It's very strange how a so-called modern country's justice system can be completely backward/the opposite of the correct way, of which in this country Ireland it's all about the welfare of the criminal and their upbringing but not logically for the victim. How can the justice system of which is so important for the welfare of it's law abiding citizens be so unjustified in regards to the victims ?.

There is something seriously wrong that needs to be put right. Not so long ago a burglar scumbag could enter your abode to rob you and if they tripped up over a lip at the edge of your carpet and fell over and hurt themselves they could sue you, even though they broke into your home walking around upstairs while your kids are asleep.

Politicians and especially judges in Ireland are basically unstable and seem to have a love for the bad criminal with all of the criminal book-reading they do as leisure. They don't understand how it feels for the victim because they themselves are guarded 24/7 from all criminals, but what a lot of these judges are doing is criminal on their part for not upholding true justice when it needs to be upheld.

The people as usual are the only ones that can change it, and to get a long stick and poke the sh!te up and stick it in the rubbish-bin, get those judges out of service.

BattleCorp

There are plenty of people going around with 100+ convictions. Jail obviously isn't rehabilitating or deterring them.

If I was a criminal, what would I have to fear. There are little or no repercussions for illegal behaviour.

Alternatively though, if I lived in Saudi Arabia and the punishment for crime was getting your hand cut off, I think I would be less likely to want to reoffend.

suicide_circus

BattleCorp wrote: »

There are plenty of people going around with 100+ convictions. Jail obviously isn't rehabilitating or deterring them.

If I was a criminal, what would I have to fear. There are little or no reprecussions for illegal behaviour.

Alternatively though, if I lived in Saudi Arabia and the punishment for crime was getting your hand cut off, I think I would be less likely to want to reoffend.

While irish sentencing is too lenient, I don't think Saudi Arabia is the benchmark for a desirable society.

BattleCorp

suicide_circus wrote: »

While irish sentencing is too lenient, I don't think Saudi Arabia is the benchmark for a desirable society.

I agree with you, but it would be an effective deterrent.

Barely There

captbarnacles wrote: »

I remember reading an interview with the cop who helped clean up NYC and he was asked what Ireland could do to reduce crime in the capital. His number one recommendation was "make criminals serve out their sentences".

Wow.
That must be the answer so.

handlemaster

http://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/brave-garda-hit-in-face-with-a-rock-thought-he-would-die-in-attack-31408382.html

Four years is not enough... he will probably be out in two

Riskymove

BattleCorp wrote: »

I agree with you, but it would be an effective deterrent.

then why do the Saudis have to actually carry out these sentences?

why is there still serious crimes in US States with death penalties etc.

robbiezero

BattleCorp wrote: »

There are plenty of people going around with 100+ convictions. Jail obviously isn't rehabilitating or deterring them.

If I was a criminal, what would I have to fear. There are little or no repercussions for illegal behaviour.

Alternatively though, if I lived in Saudi Arabia and the punishment for crime was getting your hand cut off, I think I would be less likely to want to reoffend.

They are not getting half enough of it. I couldn't care less about rehabilitating them, but at least with long sentences they are deterred.

handlemaster

robbiezero wrote: »

They are not getting half enough of it. I couldn't care less about rehabilitating them, but at least with long sentences they are deterred.

Can criminals wilth say 30 plus convictions be reformed ? Id agreed longer sentences ... Perhaps even send some 10yrs plus criminals to Bulgarian or other Eastern european countries prison to keep the cost down. Im sure it would cost less than the 70k plus here per year

twowheelsonly

jobbridge4life wrote: »

What if that is worse for us all in the long term? Other jurisdictions have enjoyed 'law and order' rhetoric loving politicians who promised more and longer custodial sentences with harsher conditions and they are now facing the ruinous impact of that dogma. Surely we should be asking what works? Not what satisfies our immediate desire for retribution.

10, 20, 50 or more convictions before getting a sniff of jail isn't exactly "immediate retribution". Those guys have had their chance. Lock them up.

jobbridge4life wrote: »

That isn't evidence, its an anecdote and as the saying goes, the plural of anecdote is not evidence its anecdotes.

Look I am not saying that a custodial sentence would have been inappropriate in this instance I am simply stating that the foaming at the mouth, lock em all up and throw away the key is universally a disaster. We need a nuanced calm response.

No we don't.. we need a reaction to the ridiculous sentencing policies in this country. We've had all the calm responses we need. Courts as they stand are not a deterrent for most of the scumbag population whereas they should be.

jobbridge4life wrote: »

I have heard this line argument plenty of times and I sympathize with it. At the end of the day however when boiled down to its essentials, it is little more than survival of the fittest argument. It also nullifies the other negatives that tend to go along with the same deprivation statistics, for instance familial breakdown, domestic violence, sexual violence, child abuse activity. Not everyone in a particular 'class' of individuals needs to suffer the same thing for it to become a class trait. It is beyond wonderful that a few individuals born into homelessness have become billionaires but that doesn't in anyway invalidate all the evidence that demonstrates the huge disadvantage that those born into homelessness face.

There could be a literally endless list of reasons but I won't pretend to be a sociologist or psychologist. As a criminologist it is well established fact that the behavior we witness and are raised to accept as 'normal' is very often the same criminal behavior we replicate.

Excuses, excuses, excuses. The highlighted part applies to every class of society. Not every criminal or violent offender is born into homelessness, in fact the numbers would be minuscule whereas you seem to be trying to make out that a large proportion of them are.

BTW, you're never going to break the cycle of 'familial criminality' if your offspring/peers see that there's no serious consequences to your offending and therein lies the problem.