Ogniochialli wrote: » I think what annoys some people us the refusal to believe how genuinely difficult it can be for some men with certain physical attributea to navigate the realm of dating and relationships.
lavdad wrote: » Do you honestly think it's acceptable for women to be total sluts and whore out to a minority of men during their youth, then maybe when they get old and wrinkly settle down with male providers who wouldn't have gotten anything when they were young? That's what women's "sexual liberation" inevitably results in. It's an absolute disgrace.
One eyed Jack wrote: » FSOG is probably a terrible example. There's plenty of people who are ashamed to admit they've read it, not because of the sexual content, but because it's so badly written. I've read the trilogy, I'm not proud of it Truth be told though if a woman were to admit to being aroused by the content in FSOG, you'd be forgiven for thinking she doesn't get out a whole lot :pac: Honestly I'm reminded of a friend of mine who led a very sheltered life, married 20 years to her first love at 16. They divorced anyway when he decided to shack up with a younger woman. Now honestly to look at his 40 year old ex-wife, she was stunning looking, but completely fell apart after her marriage breakdown and almost reverted to the mentality of the 16 year old she was, truly bizarre thing to witness. Long story short anyway I without thinking it through, gave her a present of a vibrator for her birthday. It was meant as a joke present. We were in the pub and the party was in full swing, and I had told her already not to open her present till she got home. Did she listen? Did she fcuk, opened the wrapping and all in front of the whole crowd, everyone, faces dropped, and the poor woman is standing there bewildered asking "What is it? What is it?"... She genuinely had no clue! :pac: Neither of us lived that one down for a while, but my god she didn't half go on about how fantastic it was afterwards and that it was only a shame it wasn't rechargeable! I hadn't expected her to actually use the damn thing, it was only meant as a joke! :rolleyes: I think it very much depends on your social circle tbh. Nah, the only part of the above that's true really is that women discovered that some men were willing to pay for sex. Women simply didn't have the means to pay for sex, and that's ignoring all the other historical and cultural factors in MANY societies, not just in Irish society that meant that women were held to an inhumane standard of chastity and virtue, still very much in evidence today with the idea that women are just not as sexual as men. Trust me, they are, and every bit of it! Ehh, have you seen the market for women's toys to play with themselves behind closed doors? The market for women to express their sexuality just isn't as big as the market for men, but it's growing, and society is constantly evolving all around us, and that's not because of some feminist agenda nonsense, no way should they be able to take all the credit. It's due to women themselves deciding as individuals that they don't have to be subservient to men any more, that they are no different to men, that they have just as much right to express their sexuality as men.
ceadaoin. wrote: » Well some of them seem to think that merely engaging in conversation with a woman, especially one they deem to be below average in looks, should be enough to make them swoon. If she isn't interested then she is a stuck up b!tch with a princess complex and, by extension, so are all irish women or just women in general. I've seen this attitude on here numerous times.
nokia69 wrote: » maybe in the past but the double standard has been changed, if a women says she is reading 50 shades of grey and thinks its great, she is liberated and in touch with her sexuality but if a man was to say something similar he would be called a sicko
sex workers are not part of mainstream society they exist and exploit the difference between men and women, because men have a higher sex drive than women and are willing to pay for sex this creates the market for escort
if men and women were the same sexualy then they should also be a large group of women paying male escorts for sex, the fact that this does not exist is further proof of a difference between men and women but you are unable to admit to any difference very strange
One eyed Jack wrote: » Ok, so I can understand why you might think that it's not as freely available to men as it is women, but then, who are these women having sex with, if not men? Takes two to tango surely?
One eyed Jack wrote: » Men are paying for sex because they are unwilling to sleep with women who do not meet their standards. How is that any different from women who are unwilling to sleep with men who do not meet their standards?
One eyed Jack wrote: » Would you acknowledge that a double standard exists in society where women are made to feel shame for expressing their sexuality, while men are lauded for expressing their sexuality?
One eyed Jack wrote: » Sex workers exploit this double standard by advertising themselves as the answer to men's sexual fantasies, doing the stuff that "nice girls" just wouldn't do, and "nice guys" are just too afraid to ask for, so they visit sex workers in secrecy, thus maintaining their air of 'respectability'.
the evasion_kid wrote: » I'd say the thread title opens this up to all aspects of discussion,my question still stands do you have a problem with men who pay for sex?
When you clearly state that women give sex in return for being provided for?
nokia69 wrote: » but this one of the points that people are trying to make its not as freely available to men as it is to women and thats one of the reasons that some men will pay for sex
One eyed Jack wrote: » Women have as much to offer men, as men have to offer women. The second is a loaded question and is just you putting words in my mouth. This discussion isn't about the morality of paying sex workers for their services, it's about exploring the motivations as to why someone would actually want to pay for something that is so freely available to them already, and nowadays more so than ever.
One eyed Jack wrote: » The second is a loaded question and is just you putting words in my mouth. This discussion isn't about the morality of paying sex workers for their services, it's about exploring the motivations as to why someone would actually want to pay for something that is so freely available to them already, and nowadays more so than ever.
the evasion_kid wrote: » And what pray tell do women have to offer men?if its just sex as you state as some kind of bartering tool then surely you have no problem with men paying hookers for sex?
One eyed Jack wrote: » Clearly not, because it's simply a massive sweeping generalisation that really has no basis in fact, and secondly, even if I were to leave out my own anecdotal bias, I'm not sure where or how you're seeing this massive advantage manifest itself? Women turning down guys they don't wish to sleep with? It's not whataboutery to acknowledge that guys too turn down women they don't wish to sleep with. Women aiming for guys they haven't a snowballs chance in hell with because they can't be arsed to make the effort? No different than guys will do. Women feeling bitter because they don't get what they want? Bet you can't guess what comes next... Women carving out a niche market for themselves because traditionally guys could ride round themselves left, right and centre and devil may care the consequences? Ever since the beginning of time, there have been attempts made so that women could do this too, and it's only in recent times we seem to have cracked it, and women now too, are asserting themselves and expressing their sexuality at a frighteningly fast pace. That's some scary shìt that takes some adjusting to if you're used to being dominant and having everything your own way, and suddenly what you feel is your right is being eroded away before your very eyes as women are actually becoming more choosy in who they choose to be with, and they're no longer dependent on you to provide for them in return for sex, the only trump card you once held. Of course that's going to make a minority of men who can't make the adjustment, very bitter at their lot, because now they have nothing to offer a woman. Is that a woman's fault? Hardly, but I don't expect these men who can't assert their dominance any more will accept that, they'll just go and find a woman they can dominate, instead of making something of themselves that they could offer to a woman who they really want to get with. They'll settle for throwing a few quid at any woman who can offer them the fantasy they wish for instead. The same also applies to women btw, nowadays moreso than ever, there's a reason Fifty Shades of Shìte was so successful - it sold women a fantasy they could buy into, and many, many women are taking that into the realm of paying to have their fantasies guaranteed to be fulfilled, rather than take any chances with a guy who isn't a sex worker. They're doing this a long time now, but as socially unacceptable it is for a man to do it, the idea of a woman doing it is almost unfathomable for some people. I wouldn't have any hard data to present for that idea either, but I'll bet you're already thinking "Where the fcuk does he come up with this stuff?" :pac: That'll be the denial speaking.
Mister Vain wrote: » The fantasy maybe. Ever see The Secret Diary Of A Call Girl? It's a bit glamourised granted, but there are some guys who are into role playing. She might dress up as a sexy secretary or a school girl for example. Some fetishes would be more weird, a little too weird for most people, but with the call girl he can live out his wildest fantasies. I'd imagine that would be a big attraction. One man dressed up as a car while she dressed up as a disabled parking space and he was trying to drive it in to her.
One eyed Jack wrote: » You only have to look at the "fed up with being single" thread in this forum to see who posts more, men or women, and you get a general sense of the attitudes too. I'll leave it up to yourself to draw your own conclusions. (Hey if other posters can use PI and r/deadbedrooms as examples of "evidence") :rolleyes:
HardenendMan wrote: » Yeah ok whatever....but... Oh baby now you're talking :pac: pics? ASL? PS just kidding.
dark crystal wrote: » I don't want to have to pay someone to pretend to fancy me. Where's the turn on in that?
dark crystal wrote: » Personally speaking, it's very important to me that the man I'm having sex with wants to be there; that he's attracted to me; that he wants me as much as I want him.
dark crystal wrote: » I can relieve myself quite nicely by myself
KomradeBishop wrote: » Granted, I don't have hard stats available to prove it as a point, but really...does it not seem blindingly obvious to people, that sex and relationships are both something that women have a far greater advantage with? (note: nothing to do with sex drives - don't know how people switched it to discussing that) I'm mainly just interested in (what looks like) the denial and whataboutery that is used in response to that idea - it seems unusual.
HardenendMan wrote: » Are people actually arguing whether or not Men have higher sex drives than women???? Surely the ratio of female to male prostitutes is 100:1??? That proves that men can't go without it as much as women!
One eyed Jack wrote: » It's not that the idea is controversial or anything else though. It's ludicrous, and loaded with considerable confirmation bias, and in fairness now as objective as you're trying to remain - Can you honestly say the idea is being put across in any sort of reasonable manner that isn't saturated in venomous "feminist agenda, rabble rabble" nonsense. I know a few women who identify as feminist, but jesus if they actually did go on like that, I wouldn't be long telling them there's a way to get their points across without sounding like a bitter tit.
KomradeBishop wrote: » While, again, I'm loathe to be on the opposing 'side' in this debate, it really doesn't seem to be controversial to say that women in general tend to have a greater ability to achieve both sex and relationships - and that there really is a big gender disparity here (I don't think 'sex drive' comes into it at all though - don't know why focus has shifted to that).It's really odd how this seems to be denied, or how posters sometimes engage in whataboutery to try and discredit the idea - it shouldn't really be all that controversial, but does in the end seem to be.
Ogniochialli wrote: » Of course it's their own problem, no one is owed sex.
ceadaoin. wrote: » Plenty of average or even below average men manage to get women without it taking years of effort as some posters have claimed on here. The difference is those men probably don't exude bitterness and dislike in all their interactions with the opposite sex.
lavdad wrote: » Like I said before, women reared in our culture often tend to develop a complex where they cling in every possible instance to the notion that men have it easier in life. In reality this is to cover up a deeper issue of inferiority in regards their femininity.
