Guy:Incognito wrote: » If the team were playing great and flourishing but carrying Gerrard there might be a bit of truth
BenThere wrote: » The PL isn't the Scottish PL you know? Teams can't afford to carry anyone. .
daithijjj wrote: » .. And the weird thing is, we still dont have a player or 2 better than him to play there right now. .....
Augeo wrote: » Do we need to play someone "there" in all games?
Augeo wrote: » I haven't seen Gerrard do enough/much defensively to feel worried about the back 4 without someone else sitting in a DM/sweeper role tbh.
daithijjj wrote: » If Gerrard is the first name on your lips for that shambles today you need to have words with yourselves. Same tired arguments trotted out for around 3 years. And the weird thing is, we still dont have a player or 2 better than him to play there right now. Sick reading posts about him being not as effective as he used to be. Talk about stating the bleedin obvious, he has moved 40 yards back towards our goal. I thought he was great v City myself. We have arguably 4 players to play there, Gerrard, plus 2 injured plus the worst player in the squad imo, who started today. Henderson should never ever be used there, he is simply wasted doing anything other than pressing high. Only way i would remotely entertain Henderson there is if there was a plague of biblical proportions with injuries. If you are expecting 33/34/35 year olds to do the donkey work then you dont know football tbh, especially ones who are alien to that concept for the majority of their careers, you need players beside those players to do it for them. To use as an example, 2 seasons ago City sold De Jong, Yaya had an indifferent season through having the lack of coverage behind, the like we need for Gerrard. City bought a DM the next season, Yaya flourished, and then bought another one this summer. Lampard has had Ramires, Matic etc. LFC have done nothing for this position, we have bought Can, and he is the only one since we lost Mascherano that justifies what i would call a 'strong' def mid to 'horse' the midfield and carry the ball. It's been glaring in this team. Remove what we did in the attacking half last year and its even more glaring. This deficiency will come to pass this season and the only way it changes is if its addressed in January. But it probably wont because it seems out of the comfort zone of certain managers to obtain these types of players. I'd include Wenger in that and seemingly Rodgers. A ready replacement for Lucas would be Schneiderlin for example. He would be a good signing for this team. As much as it pains me to say it, Mourinho recently replied to a question about his squad.....to paraphrase, 'we assessed what we needed, identified the players, and bought them'. Now thats easy financially for them but the thing, is, as much as i like the look of Markovic, there was no necessity for that signing. He may turn out to be great in the future but it told me the club saw no issues in defensive midfield and that is the blind spot for us imo. Has been for years. Gerrard was pencilled in to move back but the Xabi role needed Mascherano beside him.
daithijjj wrote: » No, but it would be preferable to have the option should we need to set up that way. You cant just stick any midfielder in and hope for the best. Personally, if money was the sticking point, i thought we could have kept Ibe, not signed Markovic and bought a starting DM instead. Allen and Lucas cant play there, too weak, its a half hearted attempt at doing the importance of the position justice imo. Allen can do a different job though, Lucas is ineffective in everything he does these days.
daithijjj wrote: » No, but it would be preferable to have the option should we need to set up that way. You cant just stick any midfielder in and hope for the best......
daithijjj wrote: » If Gerrard is the first name on your lips for that shambles today you need to have words with yourselves. Same tired arguments trotted out for around 3 years. And the weird thing is, we still dont have a player or 2 better than him to play there right now.
daithijjj wrote: » If you are expecting 33/34/35 year olds to do the donkey work then you dont know football tbh, especially ones who are alien to that concept for the majority of their careers
daithijjj wrote: » you need players beside those players to do it for them.
daithijjj wrote: » 2 seasons ago City sold De Jong, Yaya had an indifferent season through having the lack of coverage behind, the like we need for Gerrard. City bought a DM the next season, Yaya flourished, and then bought another one this summer. Lampard has had Ramires, Matic etc
daithijjj wrote: » LFC have done nothing for this position, we have bought Can, and he is the only one since we lost Mascherano that justifies what i would call a 'strong' def mid to 'horse' the midfield and carry the ball. It's been glaring in this team.
daithijjj wrote: » This deficiency will come to pass this season and the only way it changes is if its addressed in January.
daithijjj wrote: » But it probably wont because it seems out of the comfort zone of certain managers to obtain these types of players. I'd include Wenger in that and seemingly Rodgers. A ready replacement for Lucas would be Schneiderlin for example. He would be a good signing for this team.
daithijjj wrote: » As much as it pains me to say it, Mourinho recently replied to a question about his squad.....to paraphrase, 'we assessed what we needed, identified the players, and bought them'. Now thats easy financially for them but the thing, is, as much as i like the look of Markovic, there was no necessity for that signing. He may turn out to be great in the future but it told me the club saw no issues in defensive midfield and that is the blind spot for us imo. Has been for years. Gerrard was pencilled in to move back but the Xabi role needed Mascherano beside him.
MD1990 wrote: » Steven Gerrard game in numbers: 82% pass accuracy 0 through balls 0 shots 0/5 crosses completed 0 tackles won
MD1990 wrote: » No one is saying Gerrard is the only problem. But he was terrible today & at 34 needs to rotated. Steven Gerrard game in numbers: 82% pass accuracy 0 through balls 0 shots 0/5 crosses completed 0 tackles won With Sterling & Ibe. Markovic is a good talent but not what was required for the team this season.
BenThere wrote: » No other player, in any PL team, with those stats would start the next game. no chance.
Harry Palmr wrote: » as mentioned here three and a half hours ago Downing waltzed past him, that's all one needs to know really.
BenThere wrote: » Yes we do, Can or Allen would give better defensive protection than Stevie is capable of any more. Agreed. so what exactly is he supposed to do in his new position? Stand around saying "I'm not supposed to be here and I can't play this position because I'm not suited to it and I'm too old to adapt? Your argument is self defeating. Either a 34/35 year old can do the role or he can't. Which is it? So you're advocating having a player on the pitch who can't do his job and his duties should be outsourced to his colleagues who in addition to their own jobs have to carry him? Ah, I gotcha now. You're advocating moving him back up the pitch where his pace and movement will be devastating to..........LFC!! You're in a minority of one if you think Stevie can play a central midfield role in front of a DM any more. Yes, especially with Stevie playing that role. I agree with you but until then it should be Allen and Can who play the DM role. Totally agree, it wouldn't surprise me if we go for him in January. DM doesn't make the best use of Allens skills whilst Can is still a bit too young to be the main DM. Agreed up to the last bit. If we're going to play a diamond you can't have someone sitting beside Stevie in front of the back four. Bottom line is Stevie is 34, he isn't a DM and there isn't any other spot in the team for him. Last year (when he was 33 with fewer games and no World Cup messing with pre season) he moved to a new position and it took time for teams to figure out how to neutralise him but they all know how to do it now and it's not even that difficult - man mark him when our keeper/defence have the ball and the positive technical attributes he brings to the game with his incisive passing are wiped out. He's a legend but he's a 34 year old legend playing a role he isn't suited to or effective in. Why do we think we can get away with a 34 year old DM when not a single top 6 club have a 34 year old starting midfielder?
darced wrote: » This post has been deleted.
Agent Coulson wrote: » The one thing I have learned from this thread is all the so called bad players signed were the transfer committees fault and all the players that work out were Brendan Rodgers choices.
darced wrote: » I cant believe people want Gerrard replaced with the likes of Can who has mostly looked a donkey from his cameos so far and Allen who has hardly been inspiring either. We are in the same situation with Gerrard another year older and still no proper replacement that looks like they should keep him out of the side. Im all for replacing Gerrard but they have to be good enough to take his place and I dont see anyone up to it at the minute,we have no better option so we need to make sure Gerrard has the right players with him when he plays,not Lucas. Balottelli impressed me today with lots of his play today,great hold up,nice touch and some cute passing.
daithijjj wrote: » Gerrard isnt there to do the donkey work, if he is deployed in that fashion then he might as well be put out to pasture right now, or indeed last summer. It makes zero sense that Gerrard would be a defensive cog, he was never any use at it when in his prime so why expect it now?.
daithijjj wrote: » You know what the common denominator is though with both our stances?. The manager, just for different reasons.
Nerdlingr wrote: » I think all our problems both defensively (obviously) and offensively are coming from our centre backs. They all seem unwillingly, or unable, to bring the ball out of defence themselves.
