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Water meter protests

[Deleted User]

I've been kinda following the story about the water meter protests on & off for a few weeks now via the Dublin says no facebook page (looks like there's trouble in Raheny today with the Gardaí there).

I can't say I'm a big fan of another bill but it's very clear that we are going to be paying for water next year no matter what.

I admire the dedication of the people who've been out protesting everyday but I can't help but wonder if their actions won't inevitably help increase the water charges. Irish water have contractors working for them & the workers will get paid regardless of weather they install no meters or 10 meters a day. The longer the protesters block work, the longer Irish water will need to keep the contractors on the payroll & you can guarantee that cost will be passed on in the long run.

What do other people think about the protests?

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Tokarev

When the water charges come in a lot of people will be very dirty and some may even die.

As a lot of folks won't wash their hands after been to the bathroom as it will cost money to wash your hands :eek:.

sdanseo

Meters going in around my estate at the moment and thankfully no hippy/scumbag classes round these parts (yet, at least) have made a show of themselves. Any such nonsense is quite simply a parade of morons making a nuisance of themselves and no more or less.

The idea that a protest could at this stage have any effect is laughable. Let alone the fact that protesting to the workers at the coalface is about as fruitful as protesting to the Pope about it. It's utterly pointless, has no effect only to piss everyone else off, and anyone causing a public obstruction in any manner like this should be arrested and prosecuted to the maximum possible extent allowed by law.

Tokarev wrote: »

When the water charges come in a lot of people will be very dirty and some may even die.

As a lot of folks won't wash their hands after been to the bathroom as it will cost money to wash your hands :eek:.

Trollop of the highest order. The free allowance might not be anywhere near enough to cover normal usage, but if you were to conserve water to the extent required to stay within the allowance, you'd be able to clean yourself frequently enough to avoid death. You're scaremongering here.

end of the road

sdeire wrote: »

Meters going in around my estate at the moment and thankfully no hippy/scumbag classes round these parts (yet, at least) have made a show of themselves.

protesters are scumbags and hippies? thats news to me.

sdeire wrote: »

Any such nonsense is quite simply a parade of morons making a nuisance of themselves and no more or less.

no, its protesting, you may not agree with them and thats fine but its still protesting.

sdeire wrote: »

The idea that a protest could at this stage have any effect is laughable. Let alone the fact that protesting to the workers at the coalface is about as fruitful as protesting to the Pope about it.

i agree with this but still people do feel strongly about this

sdeire wrote: »

It's utterly pointless, has no effect only to piss everyone else off

everyone else? you mean the types who get pissed off everytime someone stands up for something they believe in? i wouldn't worry about them

sdeire wrote: »

anyone causing a public obstruction in any manner like this should be arrested and prosecuted to the maximum possible extent allowed by law.

can't be done, it would cost to much, we need the resources and funding to deal with crimes such as murder rape and so on.

Lemlin

Tony EH wrote: »

No, your stance is based on bitterness, because of the situation you find find YOURSELF in presently.

Any chance you could respond to the rest of the post, irrespective of what you believe my stance is based on.

SteM

sdeire wrote: »

Meters going in around my estate at the moment and thankfully no hippy/scumbag classes round these parts (yet, at least) have made a show of themselves. Any such nonsense is quite simply a parade of morons making a nuisance of themselves and no more or less.

The idea that a protest could at this stage have any effect is laughable. Let alone the fact that protesting to the workers at the coalface is about as fruitful as protesting to the Pope about it. It's utterly pointless, has no effect only to piss everyone else off, and anyone causing a public obstruction in any manner like this should be arrested and prosecuted to the maximum possible extent allowed by law.

Trollop of the highest order. The free allowance might not be anywhere near enough to cover normal usage, but if you were to conserve water to the extent required to stay within the allowance, you'd be able to clean yourself frequently enough to avoid death. You're scaremongering here.

Did you get any advance notice that they were going in or did the workers just show up?

shedweller

A thought just occured to me recently. What are toy shops etc that sell water based toys like water slides and paddling pools going to do when nobody buys their products?
There will at least be a drop in sales. It'll be minor enough in the bigger picture but i wont be surprised if i see them crying about it. Just a thought.

No Pants

shedweller wrote: »

A thought just occured to me recently. What are toy shops etc that sell water based toys like water slides and paddling pools going to do when nobody buys their products?
There will at least be a drop in sales. It'll be minor enough in the bigger picture but i wont be surprised if i see them crying about it. Just a thought.

The government will announce a grant/subsidy for the Irish water pistol industry. :pac:

shedweller

No Pants wrote: »

The government will announce a grant/subsidy for the Irish water pistol industry. :pac:

Thanks for the belly laugh!

DoesNotCompute

shedweller wrote: »

A thought just occured to me recently. What are toy shops etc that sell water based toys like water slides and paddling pools going to do when nobody buys their products?
There will at least be a drop in sales. It'll be minor enough in the bigger picture but i wont be surprised if i see them crying about it. Just a thought.

Those who choose to use water slides and paddling pools will just have to pay for it.

darkpagandeath

DoesNotCompute wrote: »

Those who choose to use water slides and paddling pools will just have to pay for it.

There is no point personally trying to save water on this. The more you save the more revenue IW losses, They will keep having to put the price up to compete with people saving water. It's nothing to do with water saving. So therefore using water normally will be the best option. You are going to pay a minimum amount regardless of what you use.

Buzz Killington the third

darkpagandeath wrote: »

There is no point personally trying to save water on this. The more you save the more revenue IW losses, They will keep having to put the price up to compete with people saving water.

This is like telling people to stop buying efficient cars because the government will keep raising motor tax to cover the losses.

darkpagandeath

Buzz Killington the third wrote: »

This is like telling people to stop buying efficient cars because the government will keep raising motor tax to cover the losses.

No it's not, The government has said many many times it will have to raise the price of water it they cannot generated enough through he current charge. That means any saving made though saving water result in a price hike. It's noting to do with saving water. It’s all about paying for new infra structure and running costs + shareholders.

Buzz Killington the third

darkpagandeath wrote: »

The government has said many many times it will have to raise the price of water it they cannot generated enough through he current charge.

They'll raise the price anyway, it's inevitable. But people can still limit the amount they pay if they save.

DoesNotCompute

darkpagandeath wrote: »

There is no point personally trying to save water on this. The more you save the more revenue IW losses, They will keep having to put the price up to compete with people saving water. It's nothing to do with water saving. So therefore using water normally will be the best option. You are going to pay a minimum amount regardless of what you use.

Where did I say anything about saving water? I said that people who choose to use their water for such things will have to pony up for it.

Just like those who choose to have their central heating on 24/7 must accept that they have to pay for it.

darkpagandeath

Buzz Killington the third wrote: »

They'll raise the price anyway, it's inevitable. But people can still limit the amount they pay if they save.

No it won't it will go up faster if people save water. You can limit your own usage too but people on flat charges will not be doing that. Some may even use more water due to there making me pay a flat amount may as well get the benefit.

DoesNotCompute wrote: »

Where did I say anything about saving water? I said that people who choose to use their water for such things will have to pony up for it.

Just like those who choose to have their central heating on 24/7 must accept that they have to pay for it.

I could have my water on 24/7 if i wanted to and will be paying a flat charge. People with meters will be footing the bill. I won't obviously be doing that but I'm betting people in apartments will soon realise this and just carry on as normal. The more water people save the higher the charge will go up regardless of inflation they have blatantly said they need to fund the company.

micosoft

darkpagandeath wrote: »

There is no point personally trying to save water on this. The more you save the more revenue IW losses, They will keep having to put the price up to compete with people saving water. It's nothing to do with water saving. So therefore using water normally will be the best option. You are going to pay a minimum amount regardless of what you use.

This was explained plenty of times before to you. The population of Ireland is growing. Therefore demand is growing. The savings that existing people make will merely retard the growth of water demand. This saves everybody money.

It's everything to do with water saving to prevent overall demand increasing and making dishonest claims based on disingenuous scenarios (the population is static) won't change that.

micosoft

darkpagandeath wrote: »

No it won't it will go up faster if people save water. You can limit your own usage too but people on flat charges will not be doing that. Some may even use more water due to there making me pay a flat amount may as well get the benefit.

I could have my water on 24/7 if i wanted to and will be paying a flat charge. People with meters will be footing the bill. I won't obviously be doing that but I'm betting people in apartments will soon realise this and just carry on as normal. The more water people save the higher the charge will go up regardless of inflation they have blatantly said they need to fund the company.

Again, a disingenuous claim. Apartments are physically limited in potential water usage by not having gardens or the ability to wash cars which are by some margin the biggest unnecessary use of potable water. Trying to pretend apartment owners will have baths instead of showers just to extract maximum value from a standing charge is frankly, a silly article.

micosoft

darkpagandeath wrote: »

they have blatantly said they need to fund the company.

Stop the press! They blatantly said they need to fund the company? Shocking! Can you explain your alternative of... umm not funding the company?

papu

micosoft wrote: »

Stop the press! They blatantly said they need to fund the company? Shocking! Can you explain your alternative of... umm not funding the company?

Run it like a country.

VinLieger

micosoft wrote: »

Stop the press! They blatantly said they need to fund the company? Shocking! Can you explain your alternative of... umm not funding the company?

So you agree that as a reward for using less water we should be charged more for the shortfall in tax intake?

How about instead of upping the price reduce the size of the company as income reduces? You know how a normal company runs?

sdanseo

shedweller wrote: »

A thought just occured to me recently. What are toy shops etc that sell water based toys like water slides and paddling pools going to do when nobody buys their products?
There will at least be a drop in sales. It'll be minor enough in the bigger picture but i wont be surprised if i see them crying about it. Just a thought.

The annual free allowance is 33,000L. A water pistol holds about 1L.

I doubt the industry will collapse.

SteM wrote: »

Did you get any advance notice that they were going in or did the workers just show up?

1 or 2 week's advance notice in the form of a leaflet, then a notice on Monday saying that work would start within 3 days of a stamped date (24th in our case).

Disruption has been pretty non-existent, if you're out during the day at least. Had to move the barriers to get the car in the drive then move them back afterwards to block the hole in the ground so nobody cripples themselves.

smellmepower

Got the booklet in the door this morning about our water meter coming soon.Say the lads in Clondalkin Garda Station are looking forward to the OT.

shedweller

sdeire wrote: »

The annual free allowance is 33,000L. A water pistol holds about 1L.

I doubt the industry will collapse.

.

Thats 90 litres a day. Washing machines, dishwashers, cooking dinner, the bleedin toilet!! Showers etc will make a fair dent in that! (Blow it out of the water tbh!)
I know i wont be buying toys for the kids that need a garden hose attached!

micosoft

papu wrote: »

Run it like a country.

Like all the other OECD countries that bill people for the water consumption? Or like a broke little country with a 12 billion deficit.

papu

micosoft wrote: »

Like all the other OECD countries that bill people for the water consumption? Or like a broke little country with a 12 billion deficit.

Well all countries are in deficit...
we are just even more so..

micosoft

VinLieger wrote: »

So you agree that as a reward for using less water we should be charged more for the shortfall in tax intake?

How about instead of upping the price reduce the size of the company as income reduces? You know how a normal company runs?

And you clearly ignored the obvious point explaining that (wow!) population growth will more then make up for any individual saving in water.

If Irish Water can serve 5 million customers in 2020 with the same water as 4 million in 2014 then the cost of delivering remains the same but the individual cost of water goes down.

So no, I don't agree with you. if you use less water you get charged less. The fixed cost of Irish Water will simply be spread across a larger number of customers. If population growth were to remain static or go down, then yes, the cost of supply would go down. But thats not going to happen.

It's not a particularly hard concept to get now is it?

micosoft

papu wrote: »

Well all countries are in deficit...
we are just even more so..

Exactly. At 4.7% of GDP. This is unsustainable and if we don't reduce it as we are we either won't be able to borrow or the interest will shoot up.

Aside from the moral issue of asking the next generation of taxpayers to pay for our current use of water...

micosoft

shedweller wrote: »

I know i wont be buying toys for the kids that need a garden hose attached!

And this is why we need water meters. Thank you.

papu

micosoft wrote: »

Exactly. At 4.7% of GDP. This is unsustainable and if we don't reduce it as we are we either won't be able to borrow or the interest will shoot up.

Aside from the moral issue of asking the next generation of taxpayers to pay for our current use of water...

I agree with you 100% I've no problems with the metering , and tbh I'm a little embarrassed at the so called protests..

Annasopra

papu wrote: »

I agree with you 100% I've no problems with the metering , and tbh I'm a little embarrassed at the so called protests..

Some of them are not "protests" Its vicicious harassment and bullying.