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Kurt Cobain died 20 years ago today

ceadaoin.

I still find it hard to grasp that the 90s was 20 years ago! I was a bit obsessed with him and nirvana as a teenager but only got into them a year or so after he died so I don't remember his death at all. Strangely I do remember watching the news about Ayrton Senna dying which was the same year. I remember a few years later a friend of my mams saying he still had his ticket for the nirvana gig in Ireland that they never got to play. Wonder if he still has it

Anyone here majorly upset when he died?

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Femme_Fatale

Prior to Cobain's death there was similar extreme devotion to him and infatuation with him, particularly from girls, like friends of mine (I was 15 going on 16 when he died).

Some singers just have that charisma. Morrissey commanded massive obsession from fans too, back in the day.

It'd be remiss to completely deny suicide/premature death having an impact on a singer's place in people's hearts, but in the case of Kurt Cobain, it was there anyway. And saying suicide is a great career move is a really sh1t thing to say.

wil

20 years, unbelievable:eek:

Traffic cop - "Do you know what speed you were doing?"
Inner voice - "Well I was listening to Nirvana" ... /ears still ringing
Me - "No, sorry".

Damn you Kurt, that's 80 quid you owe me.

But worth it:cool:

ballsymchugh wrote: »

i find it hard to accept that there are grown adults who were born after italia 90.

There are grown up kids because of Italia 90,

and Nirvana...

DEFTLEFTHAND

RDM_83 again wrote: »

It doesn't necessarily stop it being true though even if its a nasty thing to say, I like Nirvana but even as a teenager I never really got the obsession and emotional connection thing some people (particularly girls it) seemed to get about Cobain (and I was a teenager after he died)

Look at Alice in Chains if Layne Staley had died had 10 years earlier we would probably see a similar buzz about Facelift and Dirt but I suppose he didn't have the look either.

Staley and AIC topped their Unplugged anyway, sublime performance from a band who hadn't played together in over a year. It regularly tops polls for best concert in the MTV unplugged series.

RDM_83 again

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Prior to Cobain's death there was similar extreme devotion to him and infatuation with him, particularly from girls, like friends of mine (I was 15 going on 16 when he died).

Some singers just have that charisma. Morrissey commanded massive obsession from fans too, back in the day.

It'd be remiss to completely deny suicide/premature death having an impact on a singer's place in people's hearts, but in the case of Kurt Cobain, it was there anyway. And saying suicide is a great career move is a really sh1t thing to say.

As I said its a shiit thing to say and I obviously don't think that was his motivation however it doesn't stop it being true.

Morrissey actually a good example of how someone can gradually ruin their reputation and mystique.
Brian Molko (Placebo) and Daniel Johns (Silverchair) both seemed to get that attention and have a similar thing going on when I was a teenager but because they didn't die at their peek I don't think they are attracting new fans because of a tragic mystique these days.

None of those things mean I think its ok to gloat in the fact he killed himself but its stupid to think that it didn't have some effect on his lasting appeal.

And anyway in terms of shiit things to say is it so much worse to say that his suicide meant Nirvana's legacy is viewed more positively and it cemented Kurt Cobains status than to say that his wife and mother of his daughter had him murdered, something that doesn't draw half as much heat.

poundapunnet

I definitely wouldn't put Placebo or Silverchair in the same league as Nirvana (I think a significant part of why he's such a big deal is that they were a: a really ****ing good band and b: very much captured a moment), but the Morrissey comparison is a good one, or imagine if Mick Jagger had died at 27. Hell, if Courtney had died in the year or two after he did she'd probably have a completely different and much more complimentary cultural significance, they'd be some kind of grunge Romeo and Juliet.

fatknacker

Two things that mixed together made for some real whiners when I was growing up: teenage angst + obsessive Nirvana fans. I found it difficult to appreciate the grunge movement when many of it's fans reminded me of Harry Enfield's Kevin character.

AllGunsBlazing

Probably worth pointing out that Nevermind shifted 8 million copies long before Cobain topped himself. Around 1992 you couldn't listen to the radio for five minutes without teen spirit being played.

The likes of AIC, Soundgarden or Pearl Jam weren't selling that much until Nirvana kicked the mainstream door in for the rest to follow. If anything AIC and Soundgarden were considered to be metal bands until "grunge" became marketable.

DEFTLEFTHAND

AllGunsBlazing wrote: »

Probably worth pointing out that Nevermind shifted 8 million copies long before Cobain topped himself. Around 1992 you couldn't listen to the radio for five minutes without teen spirit being played.

The likes of AIC, Soundgarden or Pearl Jam weren't selling that much until Nirvana kicked the mainstream door in for the rest to follow. If anything AIC and Soundgarden were considered to be metal bands until "grunge" became marketable.

Alice in Chains's album Facelift was certified Gold in 1990 eventually becoming the first 'grunge' album to go Platinum and 'Man in the Box'was nominated in the 91 VMAs. They were doing alright before Nirvana released Nevermind.

Bleach was well received but didn't shift big numbers until after Nevermind was released.

Heckler

dudara wrote: »

His passing is still a source of sadness. He was *hot* in an era of grunge looking guys but more than that, he articulated something that most of us couldn't express. Suicide theories aside, he just wasn't able for the world.

Was 21 when he died. Big fan. Don"t give me this not able for this world bull**** like he was some ****ing angel. save it for facebook. he was a talented man with depression and a drug habit.

MagicMarker

I obviously didn't mean that he killed himself for the sake of his career, that would be kind of stupid. But it's obvious he wouldn't have the status he does have now had he not killed himself.

Tigger wrote: »

i'd spit on you if you said that in my presence : just saying

That says all there needs to be said about you then, doesn't it?

upstairs for coffee

MagicMarker wrote: »

I obviously didn't mean that he killed himself for the sake of his career, that would be kind of stupid. But it's obvious he wouldn't have the status he does have now had he not killed himself.

That says all there needs to be said about you then, doesn't it?

I agree with the point that you are trying to make. You just went about it in an abrasive manner and along with uber sensitive people, the reaction you got was inevitable.

Femme_Fatale

Why are they "uber sensitive"? This is suicide he was talking about; it's an emotive subject - it's not running out of teabags.

Every time people go on about people being uber sensitive, I can't help thinking they're projecting.

Sephiroth_dude

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJGl0FQK9Ew

e_e

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Why are they "uber sensitive"? This is suicide he was talking about; it's an emotive subject - it's not running out of teabags.

Every time people go on about people being uber sensitive, I can't help thinking they're projecting.

"Suicide was his best career move lol"
"Hmmmmm."
"JSAFHWOEIFHEO STOP BEING SO SENSITIVE!!!!"

Not saying Magic Marker is like this, but it's generally how people complaining about sensitivity come across.

ray.g

Legendary band now. They are up there with the rest at the top. Still listen to them today and id also be a fan of the foo fighters. Kurt was talented and sadly damaged.

TeddyTedson

TeddyTedson wrote: »

Kurt will be a musician that I imagine will be remembered after we're all gone. What ever word people want to put behind time, there's no denying he had brilliance inside of him. I regularly listen to Nirvana and while it really shouldn't have musically worked it just did.

RIP

Gross, wrote this drunk. It reads so smugly!

Femme_Fatale

e_e wrote: »

"Suicide was his best career move lol"
"Hmmmmm."
"JSAFHWOEIFHEO STOP BEING SO SENSITIVE!!!!"
Not saying Magic Marker is like this, but it's generally how people complaining about sensitivity come across.

Major case of the lady protesting too much. They always seem to be the same people who wet their pants over tiny stuff.

Rothko

TeddyTedson wrote: »

Gross, wrote this drunk. It reads so smugly!

It's true though.

czechlin

TeddyTedson wrote: »

Gross, wrote this drunk. It reads so smugly!

Aww Teddy don't be so harsh on yourself!

RDM_83 again

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Why are they "uber sensitive"? This is suicide he was talking about; it's an emotive subject - it's not running out of teabags.

Every time people go on about people being uber sensitive, I can't help thinking they're projecting.

Of course its a sensitive subject but its not really about suicide or not saying offensive stuff its about hero worshiping Cobain.

If it was concern about suicide there would be a lot more focus on how he was a tragic fcuked up figure with self destructive urges who needed treatment instead of glorifying dying young and leaving a young kid behind. (And his suicide note does indicate there was a bit of ego at play have a read of it if you don't think so)

If its about saying offensive stuff how come the people that react so badly to the suggestion that his tragic death helped the way he's viewed don't do the same about comments about Love having him murdered thats just as nasty

upstairs for coffee

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Major case of the lady protesting too much. They always seem to be the same people who wet their pants over tiny stuff.

Quite the circle jerk.

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Why are they "uber sensitive"? This is suicide he was talking about; it's an emotive subject - it's not running out of teabags.

Every time people go on about people being uber sensitive, I can't help thinking they're projecting.

Why are they uber sensitive? Well lets see.

MagicMarker makes a valid point.
A poster responds by saying they would spit at MagicMarker in real life for having an opinion. You are also making out that I am trivializing suicide which I wasn't.

Femme_Fatale

Circlejerk because of agreeing with each other? Shur that could be said about anything. Why is it only a "circlejerk" when someone gets ass-hurt?

I'm not saying anyone's trivialising suicide or that MagicMarker was completely wrong. I'm saying those who found his approach callous are not necessarily uber sensitive. The topic in and of itself is pretty uber sensitive.

Femme_Fatale

His daughter Frances

Good lord, if ever there was someone whose looks were an exact hybrid of their parents' looks.

(Just to pre-empt the bad-ass "I'd smash it" comments, yes she IS very beautiful).

RDM_83 again

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Major case of the lady protesting too much. They always seem to be the same people who wet their pants over tiny stuff.

How else is this post meant to be interpreted apart from as the usual boards circle jerking.

And why is it acceptable to say all that shiit about Love (who i will admit is a bit of a wagon) if the issue is being sensitive and respectful rather than people defending their idols legacy.

Don't get me wrong he was a very talented individual and I still listen to them (along with AIC and Soundgarden though)

Legs.Eleven

news traveled a lot slower back then i suppose
he died on a tuesday and you only heard about it on saturday

....Hmm. I have no idea. She was definitely the one to tell me. Perhaps she was simply telling us but not saying it happened that day? No idea. Died on the Tuesday and it didn't reach the media until 3 days after. Very likely she only found out Saturday morning, no?

Femme_Fatale

I was never much of a Nirvana fan actually (a brief bit of fandom when Nevermind was released, lost interest after that), was always far more of a fan of Hole (ooh vicar, etc).
My favourite Nirvana song actually is a cover: The Man Who Sold The World

Have people said much on this thread about suspecting Courtney had something to do with his death? All I saw was people talking about how she was suspected years ago, unless I read it wrongly. I even thought she might be too (admittedly years ago when I was only a young 'un - I wouldn't be so quick to think something like that now).

RDM_83 again wrote: »

How else is this post meant to be interpreted apart from as the usual boards circle jerking.

Why isn't that said about any agreement between posters? There's no clique, no tag-team.

RDM_83 again

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Have people said much on this thread about suspecting Courtney had something to do with his death? All I saw was people talking about how she was suspected years ago, unless I read it wrongly. I even thought she might be too (admittedly years ago when I was only a young 'un - I wouldn't be so quick to think something like that now).

Went back over the thread and your right nobody actually directly says that they think themselves that she did it. Its still ok to call her "Junkie scum" though, what do you think the reaction would be if a poster said that about Kurt (who its equally applicable too)

Why isn't that said about any agreement between posters? There's no clique, no tag-team.

What exactly does your post add apart from implying that the people who think that spitting on some one for saying that a musicians suicide boosted their career are ironically the ones being over sensitive and suffering from 'ass hurt'.

Its just cheap point scoring and playing to the crowd.

Do you honestly think spitting on some one for making a comment which could have been phrased better but is still a valid point about an artist they were fans of as a teenager (not relative or friend etc) isn't the response of some one who is over-sensitive

Agree about Hole though, northern star is one of my favourite songs

Femme_Fatale

Right the spitting comment was out of order; goes without saying. The post referred to uber sensitive people though, rather than just one person.

I think Kurt was called junkie scum too, unless it was a post about Courtney that I misread.

greenflash

Sephiroth_dude wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJGl0FQK9Ew

I literally fought my way out of that crowd. Was a biig Nirvana fan in 90 and 91. Was all hyped up for that headline spot and it was ruined by Loaded-reading lad types constantly shouting for Teen Spirit and acting like complete spas. The crowd was not cool like previous Nirvana gigs and the band's performance suffered for it. I didn't buy In Utero or bother going to see them live again because I just stopped being into them that night.

I read about Kurt's death in the music press and watched the news reports but didn't get the public outpouring of grief that many felt the need for. I thought then, and to a certain extent, still do now that Kurt's suicide was another bandwagon for the masses to latch onto. It created a troubled, pitiful figurehead for the disaffected miseries who were looking to validate their depressed, introspective, angst filled pretend lives before they went onto college and comfortable jobs.

Life carried on and towards the end of the year Unplugged came on MTV and I sat there watching it with my girlfriend and band mates with tears streaming down my face. When my entire music collection was robbed in 98, Unplugged was the first cd I replaced. Still find it hard to listen to now but still have never listened to In Utero. I smile to myself when I see teenagers these days wearing either version of the smilie t-shirt under their army surplus gear. I can't help thinking the mass adulation was what put him in a box and now 20 years on he still can't get away from it. RIP I suppose.

ceadaoin.

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

....Hmm. I have no idea. She was definitely the one to tell me. Perhaps she was simply telling us but not saying it happened that day? No idea. Died on the Tuesday and it didn't reach the media until 3 days after. Very likely she only found out Saturday morning, no?

Well his body wasn't discovered until the 8th which was a Friday. 8 hour time difference between west coast USA and Ireland so it's quite likely the news was breaking in the early hours of Saturday morning in Ireland so she would only be finding out then. I think people forget what life was like before social media