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Planning issues - post them here MOD WARNING post #1

Ba$tard

Hi All,

This question has probably been asked before (didnt find it in a search but..)

We currently in live in an area(our own house) close to my wife's parents house. A site which is A3 Zoned has come on the market and we would love to purchase it. It is about (as the crow flies) 400 meters East from my wife's family home. The problem is that ;

1) The A3 zone for this site is East of the site so would not include our current area where we live or my wife's family home.

2) A3 zoning stipulation is people in need of housing, or need to live in the area for extenuation circumstances.

The site has been on sale for a long time and obviously no takers from the A3 zone for the land. What would be the best way to approach the planning department to increase the chances of being able to purchase this land/possibly rezone/re-classify the land?

Does anyone have the link to the government A3 zoning law/guidelines? couldnt find it.

Thanks in advance....

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Comments

BryanF

A V A wrote: »

jesus Christ for all that , just to add on an extension on to the back of a garden and to a shed thats al ready there,on a propriety that is fully payed for with no mortgage or anything ,im baffled!!!

most people seem to take this attitude, until an authorised development pops up next door;)

DOCARCH

Aard wrote: »

You won't need to do all that though if your development is considered exempted development. Check with your local authority if you're unsure what constitutes exempted development.

If your not sure of the measurements yourself, the Council cannot really help you other than tell you that the area of the existing shed, taken with the 'shed extension', to be exempt, should not exceed 25 m.sq., plus advise you of other exempt development criteria (i.e. retaining 25 m.sq. open space, height to roofs, etc.).

As the OP seems a little confused on the dimensions, that's why I would suggest some (very limited) professional input to give guidance as to whether what is proposed is (or is not) actually exempt.

Looking at the pictures, I think the OP can achieve what they want to achieve without planning permission, but for peace of mind (and to avoid future problems), I would suggest they engage somebody to confirm.

BryanF

DOCARCH wrote: »

If your not sure of the measurements yourself, the Council cannot really help you other than tell you that the area of the existing shed, taken with the 'shed extension', to be exempt, should not exceed 25 m.sq., plus advise you of other exempt development criteria (i.e. retaining 25 m.sq. open space, height to roofs, etc.).

As the OP seems a little confused on the dimensions, that's why I would suggest some (very limited) professional input to give guidance as to whether what is proposed is (or is not) actually exempt.

Looking at the pictures, I think the OP can achieve what they want to achieve without planning permission, but for peace of mind (and to avoid future problems), I would suggest they engage somebody to confirm.

+1
in a built up area id be recommending a 'section 5' even if the OP feels the project is exempt

Gumbo

A V A wrote: »

jesus Christ for all that , just to add on an extension on to the back of a garden and to a shed thats al ready there,on a propriety that is fully payed for with no mortgage or anything ,im baffled!!!

Yes, its called proper planning proceedures and is required to stop people building on every piece of green space (private or public) thats out there without proper guidance and permission.

A V A wrote: »

what did you mean by most people will do a bundle all in one cost, like look after everything like you explained above?

Yes, somebody could take on the job and look after everything, all you need to do is sit back and ok the layout. Their price can include everything paid for.

Again, pending on location, which you still havent mentioned yet, as this has an effect on cost.

A V A

BryanF wrote: »

most people seem to take this attitude, until an authorised development pops up next door;)

totally understandable and my argument could be kept for another forum and im sure its been brought up many times before :P and im sure builders and contractors are sick of hearing it too

im pretty sure if you came and looked at my next door neighbors gardens on both sides you'll see what im talking about when it comes to your own propety, to the left of me they have one of those big crate green containers that you would see in a dock yard, a green house, and a built shed all in the same size garden as ours, or smaller!!! and on the right side they have 3 built sheds!!

the guy on the left moans about everything ,he is an absolute fcukin nightmare, and i know he will have a problem with this as he tried detesting the small orignal shed thats built down the back!!!!

A V A

DOCARCH wrote: »

If your not sure of the measurements yourself, the Council cannot really help you other than tell you that the area of the existing shed, taken with the 'shed extension', to be exempt, should not exceed 25 m.sq., plus advise you of other exempt development criteria (i.e. retaining 25 m.sq. open space, height to roofs, etc.).

As the OP seems a little confused on the dimensions, that's why I would suggest some (very limited) professional input to give guidance as to whether what is proposed is (or is not) actually exempt.

Looking at the pictures, I think the OP can achieve what they want to achieve without planning permission, but for peace of mind (and to avoid future problems), I would suggest they engage somebody to confirm.

BryanF wrote: »

+1
in a built up area id be recommending a 'section 5' even if the OP feels the project is exempt

thanks for the inputs lads

also, the superquin loading bay is behind the wall at the back of the back of the garden and we cannot exceed above that level too

A V A

kceire wrote: »

Yes, its called proper planning proceedures and is required to stop people building on every piece of green space (private or public) thats out there without proper guidance and permission.

Yes, somebody could take on the job and look after everything, all you need to do is sit back and ok the layout. Their price can include everything paid for.

Again, pending on location, which you still havent mentioned yet, as this has an effect on cost.

i posted pictures of the location their a page or 2 back, with the existing shed that im looking to re-roof and insulate

BarryM3

I received provisional planning permission before Christmas but due to their being a submission lodged there is a window of 4 weeks for an appeal to be lodged. Today is the last day and nothing heard/seen.

What is the procedure that should happen now -presuming nothing lodged today. I'm eager to get my commencement notice in ASAP.

Gumbo

BarryM3 wrote: »

I received provisional planning permission before Christmas but due to their being a submission lodged there is a window of 4 weeks for an appeal to be lodged. Today is the last day and nothing heard/seen.

What is the procedure that should happen now -presuming nothing lodged today. I'm eager to get my commencement notice in ASAP.

You need to wait until the final grant is issued. If today is the last day for an appeal to ABP, then they have up to 4pm IIRC. And it may be Monday before it enters the system so your not home and dry just yet.

There's a calculator on their site that you can check the application and double check the exact limit for appeals.

BarryM3

Today is definitely D day, I've checked the date calculator.. and yes it's close of business today to be exact.

What I'm mostly wondering is does the final grant (fingers crossed) automatically send or do I need to be a bit more proactive? I don't want to lose any time waiting weeks for 'the system' to generate a letter if I can help it.

BryanF

BarryM3 wrote: »

Today is definitely D day, I've checked the date calculator.. and yes it's close of business today to be exact.

What I'm mostly wondering is does the final grant (fingers crossed) automatically send or do I need to be a bit more proactive? I don't want to lose any time waiting weeks for 'the system' to generate a letter if I can help it.

It's automatically sent but councils are slow. If you're that pushed call the planning office this afternoon - be nice and they might email a copy to you

Gumbo

BarryM3 wrote: »

Today is definitely D day, I've checked the date calculator.. and yes it's close of business today to be exact.

What I'm mostly wondering is does the final grant (fingers crossed) automatically send or do I need to be a bit more proactive? I don't want to lose any time waiting weeks for 'the system' to generate a letter if I can help it.

ABP sends word to the LA that no appeals are lodged, so then the LA issue the Final Grant AFAIK.

mal_1

BarryM3 wrote: »

Today is definitely D day, I've checked the date calculator.. and yes it's close of business today to be exact.

What I'm mostly wondering is does the final grant (fingers crossed) automatically send or do I need to be a bit more proactive? I don't want to lose any time waiting weeks for 'the system' to generate a letter if I can help it.

Call ABP on Monday mid morning, and they will put you through to the officer for the particular area, as any appeal will have to their desk. You will know then if there is a valid appeal lodged.

BarryM3

Thanks guys. Put in a call at 17.15 to the LA desk in ABP and it's looking good.

Now the real fun begins....

batman1

Could someone please clarify the following for me.

I plan to build a 20m2, single story, flat roof extension to the rear of my semi d home.

Can the extension be built up to the boundary between the 2 houses or must there be a 2 metre gap between the boundary and my proposed extension?

The S.I. appears, to me, to say it can. My neighbour reads it differently.
It may be the wording where it says 'above ground level' where perhaps that should have been worded ' above ground floor'?

BryanF

batman1 wrote: »

Could someone please clarify the following for me.

I plan to build a 20m2, single story, flat roof extension to the rear of my semi d home.

Can the extension be built up to the boundary between the 2 houses or must there be a 2 metre gap between the boundary and my proposed extension?

The S.I. appears, to me, to say it can. My neighbour reads it differently.
It may be the wording where it says 'above ground level' where perhaps that should have been worded ' above ground floor'?

You can build to the boundary.
The problem is you'll need to consider the extensions foundations at that boundary.
& how you insulated that boundary wall
& threat the roof detail without overhanging into your neighbours
http://www.engineersirelandcork.ie/downloads/CIOB%20CPD%20Lecture%2012Oct10%20J%20Lane%20B%20Holohan.pdf

fuzz11

Hi all your help would be appreciated,

I recently bought a 2 bed cottage and hope to apply for an extension and understand that I need to apply for planning permission due to its size.

however my architect who I meet in a few weeks said I might need to do a peculation test? why would I need one? what happens if I fail?

Quiet anxious in case I do need a peculation test as I have no idea of soil quality, drainage etc in the area, but it doesn't look great ( considering the rushes trying to grow in my lawn!!!)

thanks

sydthebeat

fuzz11 wrote: »

Hi all your help would be appreciated,

I recently bought a 2 bed cottage and hope to apply for an extension and understand that I need to apply for planning permission due to its size.

however my architect who I meet in a few weeks said I might need to do a peculation test? why would I need one? what happens if I fail?

Quiet anxious in case I do need a peculation test as I have no idea of soil quality, drainage etc in the area, but it doesn't look great ( considering the rushes trying to grow in my lawn!!!)

thanks

You need a percolation test to prove your system is compliant with up to date standard, which it most probably isn't if it's the original system.
You would need this test if you plan on changing the accommodation in the dwelling which you are most Probably doing too.

Ireland is under a lot of pressure to clean up its underground water supply and septic tanks are a factor in this. The only way local authorities can force people to upgrade their systems to acceptable modern standards is when they extend / alter their dwellings under a planning permission condition.... So that's what they do.

I'm very surprised you purchased an old cottage with no report on the condition of the effluent treatment??

rayjdav

fuzz11 wrote: »

Hi all your help would be appreciated,

I recently bought a 2 bed cottage and hope to apply for an extension and understand that I need to apply for planning permission due to its size.

however my architect who I meet in a few weeks said I might need to do a peculation test? why would I need one? what happens if I fail?

Quiet anxious in case I do need a peculation test as I have no idea of soil quality, drainage etc in the area, but it doesn't look great ( considering the rushes trying to grow in my lawn!!!)

thanks

Without knowing the probable extent of your proposals, the chance is that you are going to increase bed numbers and upgrade or even add sanitary services to the existing. On this basis you will need to upgrade the existing system (assuming old septic tank system) ie percolation test to the EPA standards.

Your existing system would not have been designed to take modern uses most probably and therefore may struggle big time with increase loadings. Trust me, you don't want to wake up to this some morning....

Their are numerous remedies to most sites now, not necessarily cheap but they are the solution as set out in the Guidelines. Your Arch will best advise on site specific circumstance.

Ccass

Hi all, Will be seeking planning permission for a site, based on local needs, in a rural/ urban setting.

From reading other posts here, I see that I can have a pre-planning meeting. However, I would like to have some advice/ guidance before taking this step as it could aid the application process.

Essentially, we are looking to build in the field adjacent to my parents house. However, they have a septic tank which is close to their house. I'm just wondering if it is possible to have someone look at the site who could advise on the best place in the field to build, taking into account distances from boundary lines, existing septic tanks and making allowance for a new water management system, percolation area etc... Who would be the best person to advise - an architect or engineer?

How/ where would I contact one?
Will they complete the application?

Any guidance would be much appreciated!

ht9zni1gs28crp

Ccass wrote: »

Hi all, Will be seeking planning permission for a site, based on local needs, in a rural/ urban setting.

From reading other posts here, I see that I can have a pre-planning meeting. However, I would like to have some advice/ guidance before taking this step as it could aid the application process.

Essentially, we are looking to build in the field adjacent to my parents house. However, they have a septic tank which is close to their house. I'm just wondering if it is possible to have someone look at the site who could advise on the best place in the field to build, taking into account distances from boundary lines, existing septic tanks and making allowance for a new water management system, percolation area etc... Who would be the best person to advise - an architect or engineer?

How/ where would I contact one?
Will they complete the application?

Any guidance would be much appreciated!

A water/percolation test will solve all your answers there.. they would most likely suggest that your own percolation area will go side by side of any existing....

Check the local planning office as they will have a list of approved soil/water/percolation engineers for your locality.

Where are you based as I can recommend in Meath...

Ccass

Thanks Miller!
It's just before the Meath border, near Clonee if that's any good for your recommendation??

Chisler2

Grant of my planning application (for installation of septic-tank, renovation of old cottage and addition of kitchen/bathroom extension (38sq.m) was delayed as the CoCo needed further information.

This gave time for further thought, leading to the belief that the extension should be relocated slightly (2.74 metres) and should have a barrel-roof, rather than the A-frame on the (very detailed, specific) planning drawings.

Unfortunately the E.S. working on the project submitted the F.I. mere hours before I shared my new vision with him:rolleyes: !

Does this disaster mean I need to submit a formal
Amendment or Adjustment of some kind? A follow-up letter declaring myself incompetent? Or are these changes (no sight-line or neighbouring property issues.........isolated rural location) admissable? Advice on the CoCo perspective would be appreciated; criticism I can do myself.

loremolis

Chisler2 wrote: »

Grant of my planning application (for installation of septic-tank, renovation of old cottage and addition of kitchen/bathroom extension (38sq.m) was delayed as the CoCo needed further information.

This gave time for further thought, leading to the belief that the extension should be relocated slightly (2.74 metres) and should have a barrel-roof, rather than the A-frame on the (very detailed, specific) planning drawings.

Unfortunately the E.S. working on the project submitted the F.I. mere hours before I shared my new vision with him:rolleyes: !

Does this disaster mean I need to submit a formal
Amendment or Adjustment of some kind? A follow-up letter declaring myself incompetent? Or are these changes (no sight-line or neighbouring property issues.........isolated rural location) admissable? Advice on the CoCo perspective would be appreciated; criticism I can do myself.

Send in your revised drawings ASAP as unsolicited further information.

Put a cover letter with the drawings explaining that due to a miscommunication with your designer the incorrect drawing was submitted.
Explain how the changes are not significant and that you would appreciate it if the planning authority would accept the unsolicited second reply and would they please grant planning permission

No guarantee it will work but worth a try.

rayjdav

Chisler2 wrote: »

Grant of my planning application (for installation of septic-tank, renovation of old cottage and addition of kitchen/bathroom extension (38sq.m) was delayed as the CoCo needed further information.

This gave time for further thought, leading to the belief that the extension should be relocated slightly (2.74 metres) and should have a barrel-roof, rather than the A-frame on the (very detailed, specific) planning drawings.

Unfortunately the E.S. working on the project submitted the F.I. mere hours before I shared my new vision with him:rolleyes: !

Does this disaster mean I need to submit a formal
Amendment or Adjustment of some kind? A follow-up letter declaring myself incompetent? Or are these changes (no sight-line or neighbouring property issues.........isolated rural location) admissable? Advice on the CoCo perspective would be appreciated; criticism I can do myself.

No harm in trying what Loremolis said but doubt it will work to be honest as all placed on register at this stage. If it did, you would be required to re-advertise at the very least under "Significant Further Information".

sydthebeat

Proper process would be to withdraw application now and resubmit new application.

Changing from A roof to barrel roof in itself is a major design change.

The above 'may' work, but planning offices being paranoid about due process, I can't see it working.

Chisler2

sydthebeat wrote: »

Proper process would be to withdraw application now and resubmit new application.

Changing from A roof to barrel roof in itself is a major design change.

The above 'may' work, but planning offices being paranoid about due process, I can't see it working.

This application was submitted 4th October! If I resubmit the process might drag on into autumn. Ouch!

Thank you all for comments. I'll see what can be salvaged and post the outcome.

sydthebeat

Chisler2 wrote: »

This application was submitted 4th October! If I resubmit the process might drag on into autumn. Ouch!

Thank you all for comments. I'll see what can be salvaged and post the outcome.

well its shouldnt drag out next time.... because this application has gone to 'further information' stage... so you should know exactly what info the planning office require on a subsequent application.

Chisler2

sydthebeat wrote: »

well its shouldnt drag out next time.... because this application has gone to 'further information' stage... so you should know exactly what info the planning office require on a subsequent application.

Syd - The F.I. was submitted with a letter on 18th, so the CoCo's consideration period has another 28 days to run, and (I am told by the E.S) a further site visit. The revisions are minor (a 38sq.m rectangle.........not adding another floor to a 2500sq.m newbuild.......). If they would incorporate the revisions, that would be the most straightforward option.

How do I go about withdrawing the present application?........just a phone-call or letter, or is there an official route? Does a completely fresh application entail another round of fee-paying, posting notices etc as well as revised planning drawings?

sydthebeat

Chisler2 wrote: »

Syd - The F.I. was submitted with a letter on 18th, so the CoCo's consideration period has another 28 days to run, and (I am told by the E.S) a further site visit. The revisions are minor (a 38sq.m rectangle.........not adding another floor to a 2500sq.m newbuild.......). If they would incorporate the revisions, that would be the most straightforward option.

How do I go about withdrawing the present application?........just a phone-call or letter, or is there an official route? Does a completely fresh application entail another round of fee-paying, posting notices etc as well as revised planning drawings?

the first thing to do is to phone the planner and ask, off the record, if they will accept unsolicited further information with a "slight" design change.

so do, some dont.

if they accept the altered FI, then worse case sceanario is that they will request you to readvertise. turning a 4 week process to an 8 week one.