KeithAFC wrote: » Football doesn't work like that. You have so many contributing factors in football. Potential ability in young players (although you never know all the time how it might turn out), fitness of a player, mentality, confidence issues, tactics and basic coaching. The logic of signing some one with good crossing stats is a bit flawed because you could easily be ignoring the lack of pace of said player, the mentality of that player, he might be weak at beating players and so on. Stats can lie.
zerks wrote: » Oranage2 wrote: » Of course Dalglish is done. John Henry wants to adapt a 'Moneyball'(buying cheap players with decent stats) type experiment and Dalglish like to buy the best players around for premium prices. Damien Comolli used a stats/scouting policy, so we had 3 people using 3 different methods. And honestly, John Henry, Damien Comolli and Kenny Dalglish one season experiment has ruined Liverpool till at least 2020 - I'd be surprised if they get into the top 5 in the next 8 seasons. Liverpool wont win anything under Henry, 'Moneyball' doesnt work in football and he should really just stick to baseball! Moneyball doesn't work when you buy overpriced,mediocre English players.Done right and bargains can be had,unfortunately Liverpool made a balls of it and wasted an awful lot of money on dross. Even Suarez,one of their best players has a very poor scoring record and for his talent & sizeable fee should be hitting the back of the net more regularly rather than just winning lots of corners. Dalglish will be given another season or if results dictate he could be gone by Christmas,can't see him going anywhere this Summer.
Oranage2 wrote: » Of course Dalglish is done. John Henry wants to adapt a 'Moneyball'(buying cheap players with decent stats) type experiment and Dalglish like to buy the best players around for premium prices. Damien Comolli used a stats/scouting policy, so we had 3 people using 3 different methods. And honestly, John Henry, Damien Comolli and Kenny Dalglish one season experiment has ruined Liverpool till at least 2020 - I'd be surprised if they get into the top 5 in the next 8 seasons. Liverpool wont win anything under Henry, 'Moneyball' doesnt work in football and he should really just stick to baseball!
G.K. wrote: » Disagree - you just have to find the right stats and then look for players, but don't only use stats in isolation. Other factors must be considered.
G.K. wrote: » Hence why I said other factors must be taken into consideration... I'm not advocating signing anyone on a single stat, that's A) stupid, and not Moneyball
mufcboy1999 wrote: » I'd give the champions league victory to You in 05 but don't be bragging about that Micky mouse treble and carling cups lol. Try winning the league and come back to me until then ye will always a mediocre team who happen to over achieve every so often.
KeithAFC wrote: » What is this moneyball then? It sounds like a lot of nonsense when it comes to football.
LuckyLloyd wrote: » Have you read the book?
Oranage2 wrote: » Well I said moneyball doesnt work - Stats are useful but there are too many variables in football for just going on stats. As for moneyball, Baseball has drafts and wage/budget caps when signing players. Football has relatively none up to recently.
I am pie wrote: » Yawn. Another Liverpool obsessed Manc super fan. Take a number and get in line.
KeithAFC wrote: » I looked it up on amazon and it seems to come from baseball?
I am pie wrote: » mufcboy1999 wrote: » I'd give the champions league victory to You in 05 but don't be bragging about that Micky mouse treble and carling cups lol. Try winning the league and come back to me until then ye will always a mediocre team who happen to over achieve every so often. Yawn. Another Liverpool obsessed Manc super fan. Take a number and get in line.
donalg1 wrote: » I don't see how a united fan could be obsessed with Liverpool, probably just enjoy watching them getting worse every year and watching manager after manager failing at the club. If anything it's the lfc fans with the obsession can't really blame them seeing as they are watching united win trophy after trophy year after year. No harm in being obsessed with that they might even learn something about being successful (might bring the operative word if course)
G.K. wrote: » What? This is irrelevant - the point is using the right stats combined with other factors, top quality players could be aquired cheaply. Newcastle are the team closest to applying the strategy, and I mean, they're just failing utterly.
Oranage2 wrote: » It's just basically using stats to field a team ie. player X hits so many runs.
Oranage2 wrote: » Well, they used value in the market - There's nothing to say they wont fall off next season, Ba and Cisse could easily just stop scoring and AFAIK it has already happened to Ba. The only way to win in football is by having the best players playing in a formation that suits them. Tried and tested!
G.K. wrote: » Please read the book so you know what you are talking about. It's not anything as that simple. No. Just no. Btw Ba's been moved to the left flank recently, that's why he's not been scoring.
donalg1 wrote: » Dont think Kenny will be sacked I'd imagine he will walk himself if anything. He is obviously cracking under the pressure and isn't up to the job at all.
Oranage2 wrote: » And do you actually believe that Newcastle is a modern moneyball?
PhlegmyMoses wrote: » There are also tactical systems that players will do well in that the signing team are unwilling to use. For instance, Leon Britton has been excellent is Swansea's patient, passing game where the whole system suits his playing style. If, say, Manchester United recognise that they need a midfielder to replace Scholes, look at Scholes' passing stats and then look at Britton's it would be reasonable to surmise that he would suit United to a tee. But then, United's passing game is different. They need inch perfect passes to the wingers, forward passes to the strikers. They are constantly putting the other team under pressure and need probing passes that bring teammates into play in dangerous areas. Does Leon Britton suit this? Basically, you can look at all the stats you want in football but the most effective analysis is qualitative. It will henceforth be known as Useyoureyesball.
Oranage2 wrote: » That's why I said basically... And do you actually believe that Newcastle is a modern moneyball? I may be a bit older than you because I've seen 100s of strikers have wonder seasons esp ones from African. I've also seen many teams have wonder seasons just to be crap the next one. Moneyball doesnt work in footballFACT
Oranage2 wrote: » Moneyball doesnt work in footballFACT
PhlegmyMoses wrote: » Have Newcastle ever said that they were using a moneyball strategy? They seem to just scout well and take a punt on players that others are wary of due to injuries and attitude such as Ben Arfa and Ba. Cisse shows us another variable not as prominent in the US - the fact that the majority of the world's best baseball players play in the league you are purchasing them to play in. A lot of people had heard of Cisse and had an idea that he was doing well for Hoffenheim. But then, it's hard to know whether this will translate over to the PL. Dzeko was immense for Wolfsburg but has hardly lit up the league. Mame Biram Diouf is now banging them in for Hannover but never really looked that kind of player for United. Cisse could have gone either way. There are also tactical systems that players will do well in that the signing team are unwilling to use. For instance, Leon Britton has been excellent is Swansea's patient, passing game where the whole system suits his playing style. If, say, Manchester United recognise that they need a midfielder to replace Scholes, look at Scholes' passing stats and then look at Britton's it would be reasonable to surmise that he would suit United to a tee. But then, United's passing game is different. They need inch perfect passes to the wingers, forward passes to the strikers. They are constantly putting the other team under pressure and need probing passes that bring teammates into play in dangerous areas. Does Leon Britton suit this? Basically, you can look at all the stats you want in football but the most effective analysis is qualitative. It will henceforth be known as Useyoureyesball.
Dr Galen wrote: » Thats exactly what they said in baseball They were wrongFACT
LuckyLloyd wrote: » Oh so you didn't read it. You should probably shut the **** about it then until you've read it (or at least grasped the basic concepts) tbh.
