LETS ALL LAUGH AT PEOPLE WITH DEPRESSION!!

Oranage2 · 12-12-2011 9:19pm

Wibbs wrote: »

Great opening post and great and welcome thread.

I'd certainly agree with DeV on the depression/intelligence angle. IMHO and IME "thinkers" get it more and more often than less bright people, or bright people who are quite narrow in their focus. Of the cleverest people I know, I honestly can't think of one who didn't get it to some degree or other. Not necessarily requiring treatment, often situational triggered and for the majority thankfully temporary but they got more than a case of the "blues" that's for sure. Stands to reason. The more one sees the world, the more likely one also sees much of the BS of it. Objectively speaking the BS tends to outweigh the good stuff.

This + 1000. It's incredibly common. People who talk about their own "black dog", whether that be a temporary encounter in their past or an ongoing issue in their lives less so, but thankfully that's changing.

I think its very unfair to label depression an intelligent persons disease. Your social circle consists of mainly people you perceive as intelligent i guess.

I've seen depression affect pretty average people to even people that would be considered lower class people, i even chatted to a member of travelling community who said he had depression and tried killing himself because he was gay.

As dev says 25% are affected and if you work off standard deviation it suggests that it can affect anyone.

As for it affecting 'thinkers' well having that much head space with likely insomnia is going to make you think.

irelandspurs · 12-12-2011 9:23pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Are you receiving any sort of help for it?

Yeah just meds currently on effexor but think there doing more harm than good.I need help in a big way but don't know where to turn doc just keeps putting me on different meds.I find it hard to talk to doc as i feel he just wants me out so he can get his next patient in.

Mr Trade In · 12-12-2011 9:26pm

irelandspurs wrote: »

I have suffered with depression since the age of 14 i'm now 27 married with 2 kids and am about to lose my wife and kids because of it.

Give the number below a call if you want to talk to an out of hours GP,failing that go to your local A/E and tell them how you are.

MID DOCC 1850 302 702 Covers Offaly, Westmeath, Longford and Laois

starviewadams · 12-12-2011 9:26pm

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

Have just read the 10 pages of Laugh @ Depression and have ended up feeling very dispirited...I'm a toiler in the Mental Health Services of the HSE.

We do provide free services to the public, but it's not timely enough or general enough. Services that are available in one area aren't available in another. What we do have going for us is that we are multidisciplinary and we are all over the country. When I retire, there won't be anyone to take over from me in my area because there's no funding to train anyone. (I've 20 years of experience, so there's no point waiting till I'm ready to go and then training someone in!)

People don't even know we exist and that we can provide a lot of services - inpatient units, day hospitals, day centres, group therapy, inidividual therapy, medication, meditation etc even including job preparation to help fill holes in CVs.

If only, I think, some of the energy that went into posting in AH went into pressuring the Minister to implement Vision for Change!

Anyway, glumly,
JC

Yeah,I was very surprised when my GP told me that there was a HSE Community Mental Health clinic in my area,I passed by the building everyday and I never even knew it existed til I was actually referred there.And I definitely wasn't expecting their services to be free!

I was picturing some sort of one flew over the cuckoos nest scenario when I went there the first time,but it couldn't have been any more different.

All the staff I've dealt with down there from psychiatrist's to psychologists to the nurse's,were brilliant,and very supportive.

I was seeing a great psychologist there for nearly a year too and was making good progress according to him,but unfortunately he had to return to his home country and the HSE wont be replacing him,which kind of sucks.

The Davestator · 12-12-2011 9:30pm

Just want to say thanks for improving my understanding of depression. Really didn't understand it until tonight.

Earthhorse · 12-12-2011 9:30pm

starlings wrote: »

As someone who has not suffered from depression, but has listened to those who have, I think there's more to the divide between the depressed and the rest of society than ignorance .

It is very hard to listen to someone suffer, especially if you love them. Some of us worry, some suggest practical approaches, others block it out because while depression isn't contagious, sadness is; when none of these work we blame ourselves/the healthcare system and this doesn't help either. In fact it perpetuates the problem.

There are a lot of conflicting theories about the nature of depression (e.g. the correlation with high intelligence - sour grape champagne, anyone?:)) and about its treatment. The "just listen" message is being widely promoted, and it's a start, but it's not enough. What do we do with what we hear? When and how do we suggest professional help? What if the depressed person refuses? There is a world of difference between understanding depression and understanding what to do when someone is depressed, and it is the latter I would like to hear more about.

I appreciate that with all the variables of each individual and their circumstances, and those of their loved ones, there can be no guidelines to suit all cases. Perhaps a process, such as that used in Al-Anon (for families and friends of alcoholics) might help? The goal here would be to support the people who wish to support someone who is depressed because, from what I have read here, a vicious circle of isolation is a frequent experience.

Aware have a lot of literature on their website addressing just what you're talking about: http://www.aware.ie/help/literature/

There is also more info here: http://www.aware.ie/help/information/supporting_a_loved_one/

I think it has to be acknowledged that helping a loved one through depression can be frustrating and draining at times. This isn't to move the focus off the person suffering with depression but I think it's important to acknowledge it.

nesf · 12-12-2011 9:31pm

irelandspurs wrote: »

Is life insurance void if suicide is the cause of death?

It varies. My life insurance used only pay out for suicide if I had insurance for something like 5 years first. Otherwise all it paid out was the premiums I paid in.

That said, I had a premium of around three times the average for my age due to my illness.

flutterflye · 12-12-2011 9:32pm

Benny_Cake wrote: »

Very interesting post JC - the HSE gets a lot of stick but there are a lot of excellent people like yourself working there to make a real difference in people's lives. The hiring ban is having a really negative impact on services though. Anyway, you make a good point, I must take a look at the Vision to Change document.

There's a reason they get alot of stick.
I wish there more people working there like JC.

There a few weeks ago, I told them I was the closest I ever was to commiting suicide, and they discharged me back to my gp, without offering any advice besides getting some book or other.
And she told me to see the psychologist and go get cbt.
It was only my second visit there, and it took alot of courage and motivation on my part to even get myself there, only to be turned away.

When I went back to the gp I asked him about seeing the hse psychologist (it was the psychiatrist I had been previously attending) and I was asking about the hse funded cbt - he told me that I need to be a patient of the hse to avail of these, so he couldn't understand why I had been discharged.

This country is a fcuking joke.

I was advised (well pushed into!) calling up pieta house and making an appointment, which I have done.
I hadn't realised that it was a free service.

But when you have an illness that by it's very nature means that you are most likely unmotivated, apathetic, fatigued, self loathing etc... you shouldn't be turned away from the national healthcare service and have to go seeking your own help.

irelandspurs · 12-12-2011 9:37pm

flutterflye wrote: »

There's a reason they get alot of stick.
I wish there more people working there like JC.

There a few weeks ago, I told them I was the closest I ever was to commiting suicide, and they discharged me back to my gp, without offering any advice besides getting some book or other.
And she told me to see the psychologist and go get cbt.
It was only my second visit there, and it took alot of courage and motivation on my part to even get myself there, only to be turned away.

When I went back to the gp I asked him about seeing the hse psychologist (it was the psychiatrist I had been previously attending) and I was asking about the hse funded cbt - he told me that I need to be a patient of the hse to avail of these, so he couldn't understand why I had been discharged.

This country is a fcuking joke.

I was advised (well pushed into!) calling up pieta house and making an appointment, which I have done.
I hadn't realised that it was a free service.

But when you have an illness that by it's very nature means that you are most likely unmotivated, apathetic, fatigued, self loathing etc... you shouldn't be turned away from the national healthcare service and have to go seeking your own help.

I tried killing my self a year and a half ago,i was taken to the hospital and put in a room and not 1 person came in to see me for 3 hours,then when they did they just asked silly questions and was told to go home and someone would contact me the following day,I had not heard anything for 3 days so my wife made me go to gp,my gp must of heard and seemed to be angry with me and told me to grow up,all i wanted to do then was smash his face in and go kill myself.

ziggy23 · 12-12-2011 9:41pm

DeVore wrote: »

But now you know you arent alone. None of us are. Fnck it, theres enough of us to form an army and stage a coup
I send you a big manly man-hug.

Nesf, I have always admired your near-brutal honesty on the topic. I didnt want to drag you into it, but you are one of the reasons this thread exists. I have watched you talk about tougher things than I and felt shamed into action (a good thing for me, I need that poke sometimes!). Talk soon mate.

DeV.

Aww thank you big womanly hug right back at ya:pac:

Can we all have a group hug please??:p

flutterflye · 12-12-2011 9:41pm

irelandspurs wrote: »

Yeah just meds currently on effexor but think there doing more harm than good.I need help in a big way but don't know where to turn doc just keeps putting me on different meds.I find it hard to talk to doc as i feel he just wants me out so he can get his next patient in.

Go to a different gp?
Ask around locally for recommendations maybe?
One of the best things I ever did was change gps.
I know it may seem like a pain, and people like to stay with the gp they know.
But this is really serious, and if he's just not helping you, it might be worth your while shopping around?

Lady Chatterton · 12-12-2011 9:41pm

irelandspurs wrote: »

Is life insurance void if suicide is the cause of death?

TaxationTheft wrote: »

Generally, yes. This is why death inquests are unwilling to record suicide directly, as it places a financial hit on the family. Most private insurance forms will clearly state that suicide can potentially void the contract.

As a rule most insurance companies have suicide listed as a general exclusion. However, there are some policies that pay out if death by suicide occurs after a specific period of time (i.e 12/24 months, it depends on the policy terms and conditions).

Having being involved in handling these cases in the past, I agree with "TaxationTheft", inquests are reluctant to record a death as a suicide in some cases, particularly where there is a partner and young family left behind who could be adversely affected financially by such a verdict.

Usually insurance companies will pay out for "death by misadventure" but not suicide.

While this may be better (financially) for the unfortunate families, the downside is that our suicide figures are being under reported (486 deaths in 2010). Our figures do not tell the complete story.

flutterflye · 12-12-2011 9:42pm

irelandspurs wrote: »

I tried killing my self a year and a half ago,i was taken to the hospital and put in a room and not 1 person came in to see me for 3 hours,then when they did they just asked silly questions and was told to go home and someone would contact me the following day,I had not heard anything for 3 days so my wife made me go to gp,my gp must of heard and seemed to be angry with me and told me to grow up,all i wanted to do then was smash his face in and go kill myself.

Ok, on reading this - DEFINITELY change gp!!!!

nesf · 12-12-2011 9:42pm

irelandspurs wrote: »

I tried killing my self a year and a half ago,i was taken to the hospital and put in a room and not 1 person came in to see me for 3 hours,then when they did they just asked silly questions and was told to go home and someone would contact me the following day,I had not heard anything for 3 days so my wife made me go to gp,my gp must of heard and seemed to be angry with me and told me to grow up,all i wanted to do then was smash his face in and go kill myself.

That's a ****ing joke. Last time I was suicidal I was kept under observation for a week whether I liked it or not.

Benny_Cake · 12-12-2011 9:43pm

flutterflye wrote: »

There's a reason they get alot of stick.
I wish there more people working there like JC.

There a few weeks ago, I told them I was the closest I ever was to commiting suicide, and they discharged me back to my gp, without offering any advice besides getting some book or other.
And she told me to see the psychologist and go get cbt.
It was only my second visit there, and it took alot of courage and motivation on my part to even get myself there, only to be turned away.

When I went back to the gp I asked him about seeing the hse psychologist (it was the psychiatrist I had been previously attending) and I was asking about the hse funded cbt - he told me that I need to be a patient of the hse to avail of these, so he couldn't understand why I had been discharged.

This country is a fcuking joke.

I was advised (well pushed into!) calling up pieta house and making an appointment, which I have done.
I hadn't realised that it was a free service.

But when you have an illness that by it's very nature means that you are most likely unmotivated, apathetic, fatigued, self loathing etc... you shouldn't be turned away from the national healthcare service and have to go seeking your own help.

That's shocking Flutterflye, sorry to hear you had such a bad experience.I think JC was making that point when he said that services available in one area aren't in another - it really is a matter of pot-luck.Mental health is something which should have been addressed when the resources were available to do so, as things stand, what progress has been made will be undermined by austerity.

irelandspurs · 12-12-2011 9:45pm

nesf wrote: »

That's a ****ing joke. Last time I was suicidal I was kept under observation for a week whether I liked it or not.

I thought thats what would happen and i had my wife and her sister telling me before the ambulance arrived that things are going to be ok now and i'm going to get the help i need,Things couldn't have been further from the truth.

Benny_Cake · 12-12-2011 9:45pm

irelandspurs wrote: »

I tried killing my self a year and a half ago,i was taken to the hospital and put in a room and not 1 person came in to see me for 3 hours,then when they did they just asked silly questions and was told to go home and someone would contact me the following day,I had not heard anything for 3 days so my wife made me go to gp,my gp must of heard and seemed to be angry with me and told me to grow up,all i wanted to do then was smash his face in and go kill myself.

Wow, how some of these people are able to finish school, never mind get a degree and a licence to practice medicine is beyond me. It's disgusting tht you were treated like that.

stupidusername · 12-12-2011 9:46pm

It is my opinion that whatever I have has been caused by my environment. I have been (by 5 doctors) diagnosed with moderate depression and anxiety going by my description of what's 'wrong' with me. Though I don't personally believe that it's something that can be treated. I'm not going to go into detail but in ways I've many reasons for being ****ed up, and so in my opinion, that's why I am.

My tablets have helped with my anxiety, but not so much with depression. and while it is great not having panic attacks, and not worrying in great detail to the point of tears constantly, the depression I have takes over too much.

I've been always very self conscious about my moods, and how I am around people. I'm not allowed have a problem at home with my family, and so this has lead me to make myself be ok around people. In the last year I've been open with my (new) friends about my 'depression' and they've been great. But I still can't be myself around them. It's nothing to do with them, it's just me. I have to act more ok than I am. and if I physically can't do it, then I won't meet them.

I have had problems on some forums on boards where people have taken a disliking to me because of my negativity or something like that, and it's meant I've left a couple of forums because of this attitude. tbh it's hard to ignore it. so while it's great to see some openness in here and understanding, I feel it's somewhat unrepresentative of the way the majority of people actually feel. I really wish people could see that it's not a matter of trying to be positive.

With my friends, the question of 'what can i do' has come up, and there is no answer, for me at least. I've talked myself flat out over the past year, and no it hasn't made anything better. what helps is knowing your friends still want to be your friends with this. For the past few weeks I feel like i've been under this heavier sheet, holding me down all the time, and now it's lifted a bit. that said, me in this mood is still pretty flat. it's flat - slightly low. I haven't been able to read most stories in the thread, because it would really bring me down.

Going on 8 months waiting talk therapy now.... I must look into Pieta house some more. but I feel like a fraud even contacting them. and it's a scary thought.

foxinsox · 12-12-2011 9:47pm

Mr Trade In wrote: »

Give the number below a call if you want to talk to an out of hours GP,failing that go to your local A/E and tell them how you are.

MID DOCC 1850 302 702 Covers Offaly, Westmeath, Longford and Laois

Not sure where in Laois you are, you might be nearer Carlow..

Caredoc - 059 913 4999

If you feel you need to see a doctor out of hours.

I hope things get a bit easier for you soon.

nesf · 12-12-2011 9:48pm

stupidusername wrote: »

Going on 8 months waiting talk therapy now.... I must look into Pieta house some more. but I feel like a fraud even contacting them. and it's a scary thought.

Give the Samaritans a call, they don't just deal with suicidal people they also provide a service for people who just need to talk about their issues.

nesf · 12-12-2011 9:49pm

irelandspurs wrote: »

I thought thats what would happen and i had my wife and her sister telling me before the ambulance arrived that things are going to be ok now and i'm going to get the help i need,Things couldn't have been further from the truth.

It's what should happen. But with overcrowding etc the services aren't there in some parts of the country.

The Princess Bride · 12-12-2011 9:53pm

DeVore- read your posts with mixed emotions, well done, and thanks.

Can't imagine it was easy for you this morning,to write it all down,but if you make a difference to the life of one other person-which you obviously have-then it will have been worth while.

Only other thing I have to say to people is to slow down and listen.
If that friend texts you asking to meet up,maybe say yes instead of giving them the brush off.
We can all be busy in our own little worlds, and sometimes we're busy doing nothing important.
Making a little time for each other shouldn't be the big thing it's become for far too many of us.

Murdstone · 12-12-2011 10:06pm

Oranage2 wrote: »

I think its very unfair to label depression an intelligent persons disease. Your social circle consists of mainly people you perceive as intelligent i guess.

I've seen depression affect pretty average people to even people that would be considered lower class people, i even chatted to a member of travelling community who said he had depression and tried killing himself because he was gay.

As dev says 25% are affected and if you work off standard deviation it suggests that it can affect anyone.

As for it affecting 'thinkers' well having that much head space with likely insomnia is going to make you think.

I agree with the Oranage2^

There is a lot of snobbery associated with different conditions: if you are working class and have a drink problem you are a drunk, if you are middle class and have the same problem you are an alcoholic. If you are argumentative and irritable, and you are working-class, you are an obnoxious pr*ck. If you act in the same manner, but you are middle-class, you are having "emotional problems", and so on.

I think it is generally the case that people in difficult circumstances - low income, living in a isolated, rural area, long-term illness etc. - are more prone to depression. Also, many people are not emotional articulate; they may not understand the problems that they are having, or how to go about getting help.

Also, one of the problems with a lot of discussions on the subject of depression is that there is a focus on successful and/or famous people who suffer from it, which I think can end up glamourising the condition.

Konata · 12-12-2011 10:08pm

I would just like to add in something here about people who have tried counselling and not found it helpful. Please don't be put off my one experience. I'd been to 2 different counsellers (with little or no help) before I found one that I blossomed with.

I think that counselling is an odd sort of profession in that, 2 counsellers might use the exact same methods on the same person but end up with entirely different results. I believe you need to 'click' with your counseller in some sense... it's a bit hard to describe but please don't give up if you've tried one counseller and failed. If you can at all, try another until you find someone you can work it. I'd all but given up on counselling when I started attending a new one but there's no way I could have gotten better without her.

The other thing I would like to say is that counselling is not an immediate cure. Unfortunately, nothing to do with recovering from mental illness is immediate

It takes time, it really does. But that feeling you get when something finally 'clicks' in your mind, is incredible. It took take days or months and although I don't attend counselling at the moment, I'm still drawing on things that I learnt and explored over a year ago.

So basically, don't give up with treatment. I know the facilities in this country are limited but hopefully you can all be lucky and find professionals who you can work with

Johro · 12-12-2011 10:09pm

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

Have just read the 10 pages of Laugh @ Depression and have ended up feeling very dispirited...I'm a toiler in the Mental Health Services of the HSE.

We do provide free services to the public, but it's not timely enough or general enough. Services that are available in one area aren't available in another. What we do have going for us is that we are multidisciplinary and we are all over the country. When I retire, there won't be anyone to take over from me in my area because there's no funding to train anyone. (I've 20 years of experience, so there's no point waiting till I'm ready to go and then training someone in!)

People don't even know we exist and that we can provide a lot of services - inpatient units, day hospitals, day centres, group therapy, inidividual therapy, medication, meditation etc even including job preparation to help fill holes in CVs.

If only, I think, some of the energy that went into posting in AH went into pressuring the Minister to implement Vision for Change!

Anyway, glumly,
JC

The lack of funds is the biggest problem, the refuge where I worked used to get funded by the HSE, now it relies on donations from the public. I got a wage when I started out there but worked on a voluntary basis for the last two years I worked there.
The mental health (or indeed the general health) of the nation doesn't seem to be high on the list of priorities of this or previous governments, not even when times were good.
That doesn't mean there aren't hard working people out there trying their absolute best with whatever they have available, I know that, and people like yourself are greatly appreciated. People generally have a lot of respect for the medical profession, I was in hospital a while ago after a minor accident and the doctors and nurses couldn't have been nicer, overworked and underpaid as they are.
Round here, by the way, if you need to see a counsellor rather than a psychiatrist, there is a long long waiting list and the service is not covered by medical card. It's simply not good enough.

cloud493 · 12-12-2011 10:13pm

After what I did in March, after being being stitched up, and asked 'was it a suicide attempt' and me saying reluctantly telling them it was, nothing happened. Discharged, walked out. I was fairly relieved at the time.

luckyfrank · 12-12-2011 10:17pm

I suffer with depression im on medication id be dead without medication it has saved my life, im a 'normal person' good a football, good personality and good looking depression doesnt discriminate it can affect anyone, never feel embarrased to take medication it is a life saver

stupidusername · 12-12-2011 10:18pm

nesf wrote: »

Give the Samaritans a call, they don't just deal with suicidal people they also provide a service for people who just need to talk about their issues.

my problem is i hate speaking on the phone. besides that, i don't just need to talk about them, i need to progress

Lia_lia · 12-12-2011 10:19pm

Great post!

I have suffered from (suffered from?..hate saying that) a mental illness (borderline personality disorder) for years. Been to counselling/therapy on and off since I was 15. Been on and off different medications since then too. It will always be there, but it comes and goes. I can be perfectly fine and normal for months and then out of nowhere will just turn completely dark and scary and lock myself in my room for days crying and self-harming. And then when I am ok (like right now!) I can't even imagine how I can feel so down. And when I'm down I can't imagine ever feeling happy again. I find it very hard to stay in any kind of relationships too, so I just avoid them.

Do get help if you think you suffer from depression. I use not think councelling helped me at all when I was younger. It was a chore. But thinking back on it it probably saved my life. It's a scary place to be in.

Don't really talk about it much. I have warped opinions on the whole mental health thing that usually just piss people off. So I tend to shut up about it most of the time.

There have been so many people I know (or know of) in the past year that have committed suicide, though. They could have been helped. More awareness needs to be made. Especially in small towns.

nesf · 12-12-2011 10:21pm

stupidusername wrote: »

my problem is i hate speaking on the phone. besides that, i don't just need to talk about them, i need to progress

Want some book recommendations that I've found fairly good?

LETS ALL LAUGH AT PEOPLE WITH DEPRESSION!!

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