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Water Charges

ro09

Did I hear something about water charges being introduced to every household. What a disgusting idea. The lowest of the low.

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old boy

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

But you would agree that the substantial number of rural dwellers who use their own private water supply should not have to pay any state authority ongoing charges for this, right?

in total agreement, but being f.f. they will find a way to do it,

bmmck

well I hope they are going to provide a better water system before they start charging us for it, last year the water where I live got contaminated it was black with dirt, you could see the dirt lying on the bottom of the glass this went on for days! its third world water and they expect us to pay for it now! we live in an area where you have to boil the water before drinking it

interlocked

Raphael wrote: »

Hm, interesting. Like the idea, if it's brought in I may end up buying a barrel to stick under my gutters. That way I won't need to use nice clean water I'm paying for for flushing and the like.

Also, the fact that some people will do this totally makes it a good idea in my eyes. Although carting buckets up to the toilet may piss off my housemates. =/

One solution if you don't want to have to pay for your water is to stick in a rain barrel and buy one of there. Voila, a pretty much unlimited (we do get a lot of rain...) supply of clean water, and all for free. Course, it won't be piped around your house or anything, but think of the money you'll save!

1m3 of water costs on average €2.25 on a metered basis in this country(that includes the sewage charge the actual volumetric water charge would be about €1 per m3). I think by the time you've lugged 1000 litres of water in buckets up the stairs. you may just decide to throw a euro against the bill instead.:D

Raphael

snowfinch wrote: »

You might laugh, but my Mum has been doing this for years! Has a large rainwater barrel with a tap at the bottom under one of the gutters and this water is used for all the garden needs/car washing and whatever else she can think of.

I wouldn't laugh, it's a very environmentally conscious thing to do. I'm just too lazy to do it.

Course, if doing it were to save me money...

Tony EH

[FONT=Calibri, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial]Another tax...simple as. But pretending this hasn't been on the FF shelf for a long time, is deluding yourselves. FF have been dying to get this in.

It's also a delusion to con yourself into believing that a water tax will mean better quality water...it won't.

...And the "carrot" on the end of the stick, the "free units" as it were, won't last. That's just there to ease the stick in. I won't say where the stick is going, but I think you all know.

In addition, this water tax, like the bin taxes before it will only end up getting more expensive as time goes on.[/FONT]

This is a Water Tax...let's call it what it is.

snowfinch

Raphael wrote: »

Hm, interesting. Like the idea, if it's brought in I may end up buying a barrel to stick under my gutters.
....

One solution if you don't want to have to pay for your water is to stick in a rain barrel and buy one of there. Voila, a pretty much unlimited (we do get a lot of rain...) supply of clean water, and all for free. Course, it won't be piped around your house or anything, but think of the money you'll save!

You might laugh, but my Mum has been doing this for years! Has a large rainwater barrel with a tap at the bottom under one of the gutters and this water is used for all the garden needs/car washing and whatever else she can think of.

Son Of A Vidic

westtip wrote: »

If you want to catch water in a bucket and use it free of charge great, if you want a clean reliable public water supply get used to paying for it. Re the infrastructure - yes cities like Dublin, Manchester, London, Leeds, Glasgow have victorian public sewage and water supply infrastructure - guess what it doesn't last forever.

WAKE UP and smell your own farts.

Actually you know what! we are continually paying taxes - so therefore we are constantly supplying our government with the required funds to modernise any degraded infrastructure. So if they manage the money WE give them instead of pissing it away on the banks, we wouldn't need to pay for water.

[Deleted User]

A step backwards in my opinion.
They should have cut a few hundred of the Quangoes instead of increasing the cost of living. Our every move should be to lower the cost of living and regain competitiveness.

Raphael

Hm, interesting. Like the idea, if it's brought in I may end up buying a barrel to stick under my gutters. That way I won't need to use nice clean water I'm paying for for flushing and the like.

Also, the fact that some people will do this totally makes it a good idea in my eyes. Although carting buckets up to the toilet may piss off my housemates. =/

One solution if you don't want to have to pay for your water is to stick in a rain barrel and buy one of there. Voila, a pretty much unlimited (we do get a lot of rain...) supply of clean water, and all for free. Course, it won't be piped around your house or anything, but think of the money you'll save!

snowfinch

I have always been careful with my water usage, and as I frequently travel, the apartment can sit idle for a couple of months a year. I will not mind paying for my own water, and I will stump up for an individual meter if necessary and possible. However, I will not in the least like having to pay for the water usage of my neighbours if the apartment block is treated as a single unit / attached to a single meter. There are many apartments in the building with 4/5 to a 2-bed unit, and those with children and I would guess that their usage is significantly higher than my own. I don't want to have to pay for their water. It's not reasonable.

OldJay

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

That Dublin Airport thing is disingenuous as it involves paying €12 to enjoy that <30 minutes travelling time, just when the delays on the Drumcondra/Swords road would be worst

Not for me. I go M4 then M50 then M1 and I'm there. Nowhere near €12 as I'm in a car.

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

Also, you make no mention of the particularly poor traffic conditions that tend to be found within a km of either side of the two canals as far as say Dolphin's Barn/Cabra. Actually the only place where the traffic would be light in all of that mentioned area is the Grand Canal St./Beggar's Bush area which is usually how one would travel to Landsdowne Rd

I go down quays, take bridge at Customs Hse/IFSC, down quay, across Pearse St towards Shelbourne Rd then onto Lansdowne Rd. 20 minutes.

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

Unfortunately I have no stats, but on the whole most minutes spent driving a vehicle are for local journeys IMO, or at least not intercity

You're ignoring the improved motorways then. I'm not. I can remember how long these journeys took before.

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

Apologies for going off topic. I'll say no more about this.

Me too.

lucernarian

Justind wrote: »

Personally speaking . . . I get to the quays in the city centre in 20-25 minutes on the M4 from Maynooth in the mornings (further 20 mins to Lansdowne rd from the quays). I get to Limerick in just over 2hrs. Belfast in even better time than before. Dublin Airport in less than 30 minutes. Tallaght in even less. Mullingar in no time at all especially compared to before.

That Dublin Airport thing is disingenuous as it involves paying €12 to enjoy that <30 minutes travelling time, just when the delays on the Drumcondra/Swords road would be worst.

Also, you make no mention of the particularly poor traffic conditions that tend to be found within a km of either side of the two canals as far as say Dolphin's Barn/Cabra. Actually the only place where the traffic would be light in all of that mentioned area is the Grand Canal St./Beggar's Bush area which is usually how one would travel to Landsdowne Rd.

Unfortunately I have no stats, but on the whole most minutes spent driving a vehicle are for local journeys IMO, or at least not intercity.

Apologies for going off topic. I'll say no more about this.

OldJay

CamperMan wrote: »

Like we all pay our road tax and what do we get..

Personally speaking . . . I get to the quays in the city centre in 20-25 minutes on the M4 from Maynooth in the mornings (further 20 mins to Lansdowne rd from the quays). I get to Limerick in just over 2hrs. Belfast in even better time than before. Dublin Airport in less than 30 minutes. Tallaght in even less. Mullingar in no time at all especially compared to before.

OldJay

ro09 wrote: »

Did I hear something about water charges being introduced to every household. What a disgusting idea. The lowest of the low.

Its an excellent idea and would raise money to actually maintain and improve the water supply and services around the country.

Wastage of water in this country is disgraceful.

lucernarian

old boy wrote: »

quite a few rural dwellers have meters installed, the council usually does the installation, one has so many free units, when one exceeds this amount one pays, in co tipperary for instance one is charged in excess of 50 euro for having an outside tap, regardless if it is used or not, a relative of mine aged 90 years living alone has a bill of 135 euro, which i payed for him recently.
quite a number of rural dwellers are members of what are called group schemes, a commitee runs the scheme, everyone contributes a set amount, the water needs to be pumped from the scource to the resivour, it requires cleaning filtration, pipes break etc all this has to be paid for,
the commitee always run these schemes on a volantary basis, a reserve fund is required for breakages etc, the co council oversees the quality of the water, thro regular testing,
as all the above costs money while being volantery run, imagne the cost to town and city councils who have to pay ps to run the service, plus the esb bill, people wake up and smell the morning coffee, as our american cousins are so fond of quoting there is no such thing as a free lunch, everything requires payment eventually.

But you would agree that the substantial number of rural dwellers who use their own private water supply should not have to pay any state authority ongoing charges for this, right?

PatHawkins

T-rev wrote: »

Good call by the govt on this one me thinks.

"me thinks" it is a move demanded by the EU, not any independent irish government decision.

Bandit12

CamperMan wrote: »

Like we all pay our road tax and what do we get.. sh!te roads full of potholes causing damage to our motors....

We pay for medical care and what do we get? sh!te medical care, hospitals closing down...

We pay for schools and what do we get?? sh!te schools that are falling down...

when you all start to pay for your water... I guarantee most of the money will be used to pay over inflated wages for the lazy muppets that will be "maintaining" the water system..and you will still be left with a sh!te water service.

Bandit12

ro09 wrote: »

Did I hear something about water charges being introduced to every household. What a disgusting idea. The lowest of the low.

Agreed. FF are going to stealth tax this country back to the dark ages.:(

old boy

quite a few rural dwellers have meters installed, the council usually does the installation, one has so many free units, when one exceeds this amount one pays, in co tipperary for instance one is charged in excess of 50 euro for having an outside tap, regardless if it is used or not, a relative of mine aged 90 years living alone has a bill of 135 euro, which i payed for him recently.
quite a number of rural dwellers are members of what are called group schemes, a commitee runs the scheme, everyone contributes a set amount, the water needs to be pumped from the scource to the resivour, it requires cleaning filtration, pipes break etc all this has to be paid for,
the commitee always run these schemes on a volantary basis, a reserve fund is required for breakages etc, the co council oversees the quality of the water, thro regular testing,
as all the above costs money while being volantery run, imagne the cost to town and city councils who have to pay ps to run the service, plus the esb bill, people wake up and smell the morning coffee, as our american cousins are so fond of quoting there is no such thing as a free lunch, everything requires payment eventually.

Thoie

nietzy wrote: »

It was meant to be ironic and i was referring to other peoples posts about apartment blocks being charged 1 standard rate average spilt for all residents.

Sadly until you pointed out the irony it just appeared racist.

As I was the one who brought up apartments in the first place, yes, I would object to having the water charge split evenly between apartments in a block, as it leaves me with absolutely no control over how I budget.

I have my own electricity meter, and if I feel I'm overspending I can sit the dark, wrapped in a duvet. If I had my own water meter, and felt I was overspending, I could limit the amount of water I'm using. If the meter is shared, it doesn't matter if I sit in the dark, in a duvet, dehydrating and stinky through lack of showering, I'd still end up paying for the neighbour who takes 10 baths a day and turns on every tap in the house when brushing their teeth.

Thoie

Thoie wrote: »

To be fair, a lot of rural dwellers are also on mains water. Of a handful of truly rural dwellers that I'm thinking of, 1 is on their own water supply, 1 has mains to the house, and their own water for elsewhere and the rest (about another 8) are on mains water - though some of those aren't on mains sewerage.

CamperMan wrote: »

so does this mean that because a small amount of people in Ireland have their own water supply it's tough luck... and that they should also pay water rates??

I'm not sure what you thought I was saying, but to clarify, I would feel it fair that people on mains water pay, but people with their own supplies (who are already paying for installation, maintenance and testing) don't. By the same token I don't believe that people with septic tanks should have to hand over an annual fee and get nothing in return. If the council wants to receive an annual fee from a septic tank owner, then the council should send a man out once a year to thoroughly examine the tank and highlight any faults.

What I was replying to was the fact that we can't say all rural dwellers should be exempt.

Contemplative

kwalshe wrote: »

That'll be me getting some rainwater storage tanks to flush the jacks so. Think about the amount of water you use every day on this.
I'm not paying to flush the **** out of my house

What the hell am I paying taxes for.? My water tastes like it even has more chlorine than my local pool. Paying for water.... idiots.

Taxes change behaviour far more effectively than other methods. Hopefully, most people will do the right thing for themselves (i.e. avoid the tax) by doing the right thing for the environment (conserve water).

T-rev

Its a good idea. Water is a limited resource and people waste it. Thats the black and white of it.

Good call by the govt on this one me thinks.

Tilt Gone

I have no poblem paying for water as long as it is of a certain standard. Although saying that it's a known fact that at least 48% of all water running to your house is lost in the pipe work before it even gets to your taps. Can't see how this will improve without first having to pump millions into the scheme to get it to the standard needed. Money we don't have.

CamperMan

GreeBo wrote: »

Fixing the system costs money, which we dont have.
Charging for the service is the logical way to improve it.

Like we all pay our road tax and what do we get.. sh!te roads full of potholes causing damage to our motors....

We pay for medical care and what do we get? sh!te medical care, hospitals closing down...

We pay for schools and what do we get?? sh!te schools that are falling down...

when you all start to pay for your water... I guarantee most of the money will be used to pay over inflated wages for the lazy muppets that will be "maintaining" the water system..and you will still be left with a sh!te water service.

nc6000

Will this be an end to "hard" water then? I'm not paying for the cr@p that comes out of my taps which destroys kettles/showerheads and God knows what else etc.

phasers

Irish Times wrote:

The cost of installing the meters in individual homes will vary with location, nature and size of the dwelling. According to the latest estimates, the cost for each home will be €200-€580.

€200-€580? What happens if you refuse to have the meter installed? There are probably a lot of people who couldn't swing that much

nietzy

amacachi wrote: »

I don't think that he was suggesting robbing apples but growing them oneself. If it works out cheaper (including time spent) then some people would do it.
The amount of money that has to have been spent in this area in the last 15 or so years has to be astronomical, new pumping station and new sewage treatment plant for a town of ~30,000. And the water has to travel from about 25km away. It's a huge operation and it can't be cheap.

the point was that water falls anywhere and usually everywhere in ireland

what he compared it too was going out and picking apples. thats stupid. one takes months to grow, the other happens everyday.

It is a huge operation, but apart from maintaining a few pipes and pumps i dont see how anyone here can think after the ground work is done - pipes, pumps and treatment plants being built, that it needs a special tax (200yos a year was the last i heard) to get some water into their house.

tudlytops

GreeBo wrote: »

Fixing the system costs money, which we dont have.
Charging for the service is the logical way to improve it.

Agree

amacachi

nietzy wrote: »

Reservoirs, pumps etc as you put it, are paid for by previous years of taxes. their maintaince does not need another levy, unless you can show me the figures required? Everyone has to use water, its basic biology 1st year stuff man.

Thank God the government's tax receipts are higher than ever.