Ok. So is Leo **** up?
What about Frawley? Up until last week, he was the prodigal son
Imo I be very surprised if Leo start SP in any important game coming up.
I'd actually be surprised if Leo even benches Sam for the Heineken cup games
rte gave him an 8 in a test match against quality opposition. Of course he will.
Lol
You don't dump all young guys into a single game together. You filter them in with experienced players.
Frawley isn't a 10 imo. He's a 12 who can cover 15 and 10 to an extent, but doesn't have the mentality/ control/ vision to be an elite international 10.
But if we're building a squad and developing players (especially in the autumn games as many have called for in the past) then it's not a case of "dropping" players.
Disappointing to see some of the comments on here about SP.
It was always going to happen. A certain mentality was always going to be hovering over the keyboard waiting for every error.
He played well. Was it perfect? No. Did he need to be perfect? Absolutely not. We just needed to see if there’s something there to build on, and we absolutely saw that. Is Crowley still the better option? I think so. But we absolutely need a competitor who’s capable of pushing him.
Farrell was getting abuse here on the last few days for playing Sexton in the RWC. He only did that because Sexton was so much better than anyone else, regardless of age. The problem wasn’t Sexton’s age, it was the absence of a plan B. And that wasn’t Farrell’s fault. As Crowley continues to develop - and he’s still a long way off the finished article - it’s crucial we have someone else following behind, or overtaking him or whatever. I’d be shocked if Frawley can be that player so SP is the only game in town IMO.
Prendergast played. He maybe lost his way a little towards the end but he definitely showed what he can do before that. Right now after this Autumn I'd say Crowley is probably in pole position to start against England, but we'll see what happens over the next 5 or 6 weeks. The difficulty for Sam is whether he even starts for Leinster in Europe, where as Jack will absolutely be starting for Munster.
Although of the two half back replacements it was Casey that made the biggest difference IMO with his passing and speed at the breakdown.
Australia are improving rapidly and actually will probably now prove a real test for the Lions, that's shows how quickly test rugby can change, in August I'd have said a 3 0 Lions whitewash was a certainty.
Ok let’s accept that as correct and how it should be done
Against the three top tier nations we played who else bar prenedgast got their opportunity.
The attacking shape improved considerably when Crowley came on. Bringing the ball to the line and committing defenders whereas Prendergast just shipped in on behind the gain line. Prendergast needs time as first choice in Leinster to develop and I think he may have the higher ceiling, but as of today the attack and team are better served with Crowley
The next 5 years of Crowley v Prendergast is going to make this board unreadable.
Sexton v Rog was bad enough and that was when one was on the way up and the other clearly on the way down.
Schmidt coached his players brilliantly on Pendergast, there is no running threat so let him take it to the line if he wants but fan out and that’s why our centres looked poor. They were outnumbered. They also looked to run at lanes either side of prendergast knowing they could suck in Aki and other players and then instead go out wide. schnidt also went all out for lineouts and it hampered us big time.
Schmidt did the same to sexton and our lineout in the last World Cup. He is a good coach.
The player Leo will select, Ross, most people will tell you he isn't good enough
You do have an option
The fundamentals of our game have been poor this autumn. We better sort it out.
Lack of pace with our wingers. Sam and Jack are 2 good lads and both will contribute a lot to the Irish team in the future. We're in a dip after the highs of the past 2 years.
I'm very happy for Jack Crowley, his replacing wasn't handled brilliantly. But he answered in the right way.
Ceilings for the 10s. Who knows. Let them develop.
I'm loathe to criticise personally any Irish player. We're anoraks with a very easy armchair job.
At the end of the day the men dug out a win and 3/4 wins is very satisfactory. Gus McCarthy a success. Craig Casey is flying.
The likelihood is we'll lose 2 or 3 6N games. A triple crown in 2022, slam 2023, championship 2024. We're going to drop for a year or two. Very hard to stay at the top.
This argument about outhalves is purely provincial BS.
Munster fans annoyed to see a young Leinster 10 picked ahead of Crowley. That's all there is to it and nobody is going to convince them to see sense. I haven't heard anyone say that Prendergast is the better 10. It's obviously to develop depth and plan for the future.
To see a lad just out of u20s look competent as a senior international is fantastic and we should all be happy to see it regardless of what province we support.
If it’s good for Ireland, who gives a shite?
So is your position that we didn't give enough opertunity to young players or that we shouldn't do it at all because not enough players got the same opertunity. Remember that out half is a crucial position that we have struggled to build depth in forever...
Australia today resourced our ruck with limited numbers to slow it down and the other players just fanned out and matched up. Our lineout is very very poor but the breakdown especially after we win a lineout is also killing us
We need to fix our lineout which will be difficult as the 6 nations is very soon but we also Need to do something as ruck time. Maybe start running forwards from the quick ball close into the ruck and make the opposing team resource our rucks more.
Just reading this thread
This gives another great example of the irish rugby supporter who goes on before every match about throwing in a few players, doesn't matter about the result, give them a chance, if its a bad result we wont complain etc etc etc
Ireland win, not a good performance and now people ripping the new players like McCarthy and Predergast to pieces
it is a crucial positron for us as is props , 9, 6 , 15 and maybe after this autumn locks. my point is give young bucks a go, plural not singular
Our rucks have been easy pickings for Aus and NZ. I don't think any of the 6N have close to the quality of poachers thoes two have so we might not get destroyed there. I'm not sure how good or bad the opposition lineouts will be but they'd all want to be attacking ours every chance they get.
I think Prendergast ran the ball twice today and both times looked like he couldn't wait to get rid of it before someone tackled him. He plays more like a quarterback than an out half at the moment.
Agree 100%
Sam Prendergast, Gus McCarthy, Thomas Clarkson, Cormac Izuchukwu, Jamie Osborne… Not to mention more time for Casey, giving O'Toole a go at LH, Stockdale getting another chance and putting in his best performance in years. What more do you want?
suggest you watch it again, and pay attention to that sequence I mentioned. Was very poor.
now list the players by game time against the three tier nations we played - exclude Fiji.
That's not how it works and never has been. If a load of young lads were thrown in we'd have gotten smashed and you'd be complaining even more about how we played.
Also, who deserves to have gotten caps that didn't? Apart from Timony and C Prendergast?
