Haven’t been on in a while as work is hetic! But reading some post agree with plenty being said.
Lyng needed to drop guys, he needed to put a stamp on things. He hasn’t and now he basically still has Codys panel.
Another point mentioned is chances like Paul Henebry I saw him twice for Kk and no league action that doesn’t make sense.
Who cares about winning the league? Try guys and they will improve with chances.
As a shocks man I have seen plenty of intermediate this year. Some great hurlers worth a go. Now I am in the mindset players being called in should be 20 to max 27/28 so the some I will mention are outside that bracket. But my question is why weren’t they brought in?
Why hasn’t Peter McDonald for example being given a proper chance? So from our group. Conahy none bar who is there already. Bergin hasn’t been fully fit maybe he needs another go?
St Martins. Brian Coady excellent strong pace,surely has been asked?
Danesfort.. Des Dunne wrote off too soon. Rower No one.
Cshock. Eoghan and maybe Jake worth a chance from our end.
Dunnamaggin. Only Denis Walsh he is a great prospect.
Lisdowney. Had Brennan but he is out of position this year and not as good as previous. Mick Kenny excellent surely was asked? Kevin Sweeney same surely asked destroyed us on his own in first game..
Junior hurlers I haven’t seen much I will be honest..
Senior. Ttown boys need a proper chance.
It is a sacrifice and some mentioned above might bauk at what is required.
But I agree players don’t need to leave but a ruthless manager will get rid.
I loved Cillian Buckley but since 2018 he seemed to have lost his legs and probably should have been moved on this is harsh but just an example. I know the efforts he probably put in and how injuries must have affected him. Just an example and as players when they go bad no one is harder than they are on themselves.
Well Ned you are welcome back into the fold . I only saw 5 of those players so far this year, the two Boro lads, the village man, the Ballycallan man and the Glenmore man and I would agree with your pick of all those lads and I would certainly take your word on the others who I hope I will still see some of them. I was very impressed with Billy Reid. On Bill Sheehan I only mentioned him as an example of not getting enough game time , I think a lot of the problem is that they expect to be dropped when they are getting so little game time when given the chance and not performing great they then drop the head.
I would agree with you.
If Lyng came in and culled, the Reids, Scruff, Wally etc , KK supporters would have been up in arms about it! "The greatest hurler ever and he dumps him… Wally , one of best Forwards, some man to catch a high ball, remember his debut … etc etc etc … but instead of that , he kept them, and its the opposite…..
Management is not easy, and management at the very top table is harder.. Whichever way Lyng turned i think he could only 'fail' …. Maybe he was hoping these players would make their own mind up, and save him the decision.. ? And as was said previously , Some of these players enjoy certain perks while the are a KK senior hurler - Theres not many courtesy cars/jobs/freebies handed out to EX KK senior hurlers ….
A lot of the worrying points for me is that some of the names people (not just on here) are talking about are lads who have been on the panel before. Bill Sheehan, for the brilliant club player he is, is probably below the level needed at county level and when he was on the panel lads were giving out that he wasn't good enough! I haven't been to as many games as I usually would be at due to other commitments but the below are a list of lads who I have seen who are worth a call up or more of a chance next year:
Padraig Moylan (Boro)
Martin O'Neill (Mooncoin)
Billy Reid (Glenmore)
Colman O'Sullivan (Tullogher)
Harry Shine (Boro)
Paul Cody (Clara)
Jeff Neary (GBC)
Paul Hennebry (Mooncoin)
Marty Murphy (Tullogher)
Ed McDermott (Village)
Killian Corcoran (Shamrocks)
There are probably more that I haven't seen and some of these are young and we'd be looking to the future with them but as Village87 said we have to start planning for 2/3 time where we could have a very talented settled team but we need to put in the hard work, and maybe take a bit of pain, in 2025 with a view to the having a strong team from 2026 on. We cannot do what we did to the likes of Darragh Corcoran last year of putting him in a central position and then the minute it goes wrong he's taken off and not given much of a chance for the rest of the year. Lads have to be given time to gain experience and make mistakes, we can't be chopping and changing players in key positions like we did last year to in the end go back to the same as we had the previous year.
The conundrum for Lyng or any Kilkenny manager by the way is that we, the supporters, expect Kilkenny to be competing for an All-Ireland every year and we are never too far off. It is very difficult as manager to see past that and think to the future. Lyng is already under pressure and scrutiny for "not delivering" after 2 years so I think the only natural thing for him to do is to put out what he believes is his best team in the here and now. I dont believe his continuance to pick older players is out of some sense of misguided loyalty, it is purely down to the fact he thought those players were his best chance of delivering an All-Ireland for the county and personally I couldnt have too many arguments with that.
It might not be the best long term decision for the team. It may be better to blood younger players and stick with them in the hope they deliver down the line but I'm not sure any inter-county manager has the luxury in waiting for down the line any more. I'm certainly not sure Kilkenny fans are forgiving and understanding enough to allow a manager that luxury.
well Charlie, I don’t think I’m contradicting myself I just feel the end result needs to be a clear out. Derek should have been moving things a bit the first year which he didn’t, he should certainly of been changing it up the second year and he done absolutely nothing.so we are now left with this situation. Wat would you think of that yourself.
How good and not how old should be the bar for playing senior hurling, nothing else
And again the onus is on the manager to move them on if he feels they’re no longer making a contribution. Why would any player retire himself if it’s a huge part of his life and he enjoys what he’s doing? As far as personal gain is concerned, have you any idea of the commitment and sacrifices these players have to make in relation to their time and missed opportunities in relation to travel and social life etc..? Anything they get is well and truly earned many times over.
Personally I’m always disappointed from a totally selfish point of view when a young talented Kilkenny hurler doesn’t want to make that commitment and basically give up his twenties and early thirties to the cause, so I’m certainly not going to come on here and criticise the ones that did.
Show them a bit of respect, it’s the least they deserve.
There is an argument to be made that personal gain is associated with being a member on a Kilkenny squad, players have a higher profile as result, some are self employed, have business/investments on the side etc, some have sponsored cars and there is high commercial value. Best of luck to these lads who profit from but some players don't like losing out on the commercial value imo. All of this is having an impact on the development of younger players who are not getting a chance. As i said above these players have led the charge the last 9 years, have not won an All Ireland are clearly not improving. Lets build a team for 2/3 years that can really be a force. What is happening now is some players are dropping themselves off the panel when not getting a chance and left on the bench to rot. Tom Kenny, Bill Sheehan, Paul Cody are all clear examples of this and probably many more.
Genuinely not having a go at you but I’m confused…. weren’t you one of the posters saying the older players have to move on? You seem to be contradicting yourself.
I was going to post exactly this, it’s up to the manager to decide whether a player is still making a contribution or not, absolutely laughable to say lads are staying on for personal gain.
spot on.It actually looks terrible to read it here about getting rid of players but really that’s not the case everyone here has the utmost respect for the players but that’s the situation, it’s a cruel world.
But it's not the player's job to "move on", being on the team is a life long dream for most of those lads, why would they willingly give it up if they're still enjoying it? It's the managers job to push them out. It's a hard thing to do to a long time servant of the county and all that, but that's the job, and lyng needs to do it. The players have no obligation to make it easy on him. But lyng also needs to place some trust in younger players and persist with them even if things go wrong, rather than wheeling out the same lads every time. Not sure personally about the TJ question, I think he still has a role to play and he's still been pivotal to the attack this past year so I would keep him, but I can see the argument that it's long overdue for Mullen and Cody to step up and take ownership of the forwards.
ye but really village is right . The older players have served us well but they have to move on that’s the way things are, they are not improving with age and if they weren’t there there would be a young player there in stead of them who could develop properly.
Lads like Padraig Walsh,Paul Murphy ,Richie Hogan, Joey Holden, Colin Fennelly Johnjo Farrell etc etc, wouldn't expect any less. Maybe you might enlighten me as to who you are referring to on the current Kilkenny panel that you say is not doing it for their club? I can think of none. Likewise who are you suggesting are only remaining on the panel for personal gain? Better again what possible personal gain ? I personally hope both Reids remain. To be fair to Wally and Conor F their seasons were decimated by serious injury.
clubber this weekend
Jaysus did the three of us just agree on something KK united at last
I agree with you entirely village even on my own club players, as long as those sitting on the bench stay there there will be no room for new talent (which is out there) to come in but either some are being asked to stay or the management are afraid to change and say goodbye to them.
I agree except maybe about TJ, one more year ( someone has to lead the charge)?
I am not just highlighting Fogarty, Imo Walter Walsh, TJ, Richie Reid, Cillian Buckley(gone) and some other fringe player from 2024 panel need to retire or be dropped. We need a total rebuild and the players like TJ staying slow that down, i think TJ's time at inter county is now up. Fair play to lads like Padraig Walsh who go back to club and really drive that on. Some players on the Kilkenny panel really need to look at examples like that. Yes some are great servants but others stay on for personal gain imo.
Probably because he knows full well he's biased and loves the sound of his own voice
I listened back to it..
Yes, he was clearly rattled by those lads 'hacking away on keyboards' , but tried not to be. He failed.
Why though? They seem to be doing great work, made history this year even.
I see the Offaly county board top officers are stepping down instead of playing musical chairs like our crowd. Now that’s democracy.
To be fair they have a point when there's multiple grades on it's very hard to cover everything, I just can't understand how worked up Scally gets over an anonymous forum.
Realistically it would have to determined prior to knock out stages across the board, if 1 game is decided by penalties and the next day another goes to replay that would probably open a whole can of worms with objections etc.
They mentioned comments online and it was clearly stuff posted here
As a neutral, I enjoyed the spectacle. Both teams knew it was finish on the day. Both teams had 3 opportunities to win, in fixed time, extra time and penalties. Inistioge can only blame themselves for throwing away a lead. The winning team in this case will not be at a disadvantage of playing another match while their opponents are rested up
Any matches I saw so far across all grades and underage was of good quality. As was stated above giving young lads and not so young lads a decent shot will have to be done. Without the Walsh cup could we not organise regional teams to play in a mini competition where everybody could be reviewed by the hurling public. This was done years ago at junior level with north v south you could even have that intermediate north and south and senior north and south.at least it would throw up some interesting matches.
Couldn't agree more 👍
