Please use this thread to continue discussing the war in Ukraine.
All mod instructions from the previous thread remain in force here
Original thread:
There is no "path to war".
Macron could literally go stick a finger up Putin's rear end live on TV and nothing would happen. Russia can't take a province of Ukraine so would be scared shttless of a war with the EU.
Because the US does not want Ukraine to do enough damage to cause the Putin regime to collapse with unpredictable after affects. The US are trying to titre the weapons to Ukraine carefully to do a lot of damage to Russia, but not too much damage too fast.
How is it even a “choice” or “dilemma” to arm Ukraine and keep it armed? I just don’t get it
We are already socially imploding under the hordes of migrants Putin and his buddies are deliberately driving into Europe
I rather Ukraine is armed now and wins, while they have the chance and Putin’s war appetite is being held in check, than hope that wind holds back the chaos that could be unleashed if half of the European continent is uninhabitable for next 50,000 years all because European leaders learned no lessons from our not so distant history
Once again, last week “ordinary Russians” not only deliberately targeted a dam but Ukraines remaining nuclear plants
Putins mistress and children live in Switzerland (wonder why there?) so I dont think there will be any nuclear fallout blowing across its borders. The prevailing North Atlantic South Westerlies will be more effective for us than any military initiatives could be.
Belgorod
I’m curious when they can ramp up drone production to such a level that they can carry out these attacks on a daily basis.
Then major damage can be done to the Russian economy, and by extension their war machine.
A lot of them seem to have a dog ready to add barking sound effects.
The world has changed as Putin literally wants to dismantle the post WW2 conventions that made Ireland rich while outsourcing or defence to others
It amuses me that we and Swiss think that neutrality will somehow save us is Putin goes nuclear on our neighbours in UK and Germany respectively (both are top of his list)
Or we have another attack like last week and remaining Ukrainian reactors melt down
Radiation and refugees and economic collapse won’t give two **** about our borders
The sound of the drones will alert the camera-happy people.
I cannot understand why there is nearly always someone ‘on site’ just before the bomb/drone explodes filming the whole thing. Anyone know. I thought that Putin would not allow such thing/anything being filmed /photographed without his permission. Or/ and the local guards/good Russian citizens would beat you up and smash your camera
Yes, economic destruction of Russia is the way to go.
seems like the only way Ukraine can win this war is by drone warfare
Hah!, he died again!? I remember it was reported he died 2 years ago as well
I'd put that source in the same file as when it was widely reported years ago that kim jung un and Putin had weeks to live
....
Seems to have been a big attack
It's just very difficult to see the attacks that would be needed to really make a difference in places like Moscow actually happening. The chances of the people rising up is next to zero with the control Putin and his cohorts have over the country .
I think we’ve all been scratching our heads on that one- I don’t think historians will be kind to the EU country leaders involved .
Surely they realise that Russia taking Ukraine will simply mean millions of displaced Ukrainians rushing the EU borders , countless numbers slaughtered and countless numbers of young children and babies kidnapped and sold to Russian families .
There are a lot of challenges facing Europe right now- but I don’t see this as a small issue and they won’t be able to contain it long term.
Any thoughts from people here or external references if all constraints were lifted tomorrow morning on how Ukraine uses the weapons donated- would it put Europe on a path of war or would it put pressure on Russia to call a truce?
I guess “every little helps”- but given the control he has over the people, I don’t think it will be pressure to end the war that will come- more pressure to bomb back Ukraine to stop the attacks . Yes there are people who want to overthrow the Russian elite but they’re heavily policed and suppressed - we’ve had hope before seeing demonstrations on Russian streets but it hasn’t progressed to anything .
some interesting stats and commentary here - some nice increases in discontentment of the Russian people which is always nice to hear - also including the challenges Ukraine faces in how it uses the same missiles donated from different EU countries -looks like a good website kept up to date daily - apologies if posted previously
https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-august-30-2024 Russian state-owned polling agencies are recognizing limited upticks in Russian domestic discontent towards Russian President Vladimir Putin and Russian authorities amid the Ukrainian incursion into Kursk Oblast.
The Public Opinion Foundation, a Russian state-owned polling institution, published a poll on August 30 that it conducted on August 25 showing that 28 percent of respondents expressed outrage or dissatisfaction with the actions of Russian authorities over the past month.[13] This is up from 25 percent and 18 percent in polls that the Public Opinion Foundation conducted on August 11 and July 28, respectively.[14] Respondents to the Public Opinion Foundation poll have not expressed such high dissatisfaction since polling conducted in November 2022, following the first month of the deeply unpopular partial mobilization in Russia.[15] The Russian state-owned Public Opinion Research Center (VCIOM) noted that Putin's approval rating fell by 3.5 percent to 73.6 percent between August 12 and 18 — a record fall in Putin's approval rating,
not least because the people would get to vote on it. I like living in a country where politicians cant impose their will (thinks back to the debacle of Anglo Irish when living in Ireland). Not a chance Switzerland joins nato etc. Like Ireland we rely on our geography plus unlike Ireland we have a well armed army.
If they could sustain these attacks near Moscow would be good to bring thge reality of war to the Moscovites
Powerplant
And also a powerplant north of Moscow
Oh ,I hadn't seen about the refinery in Moscow having gone up ,
That'll cast a dark shadow over the kremlins war .. 😉😁
Another 25 years at current rates, Donbass is big and Russian gains are tiny
Meanwhile refinery and thermal power plant in Moscow are on fire
At least you took the time to listen to it and actually I don't think our interpretation is so wildly far apart. The message is clearly: Russia is getting around these sanctions, albeit at a high price, and yes the sanctions are having an effect, but more needs to be done because Russia is still getting a lot of the stuff it needs. I hope more action will be taken to try and tackle the problem
Yes it's always hard to tell exactly what's going on. As always, will take time for things to become clear
Unconfirmed reports on various SM sources claim Sergei Lavrov is dead……
Ukraine's Representative to UN hints Lavrov may have already passed away | RBC-Ukraine
How much longer can they keep going losing territory in the Donbass though. If the reports of them sending an elite unit to defend Pokrovsk are true then maybe it shows that they feel that they must not cede that town to Russia given its strategic importance.
But doesn’t a huge amount of frontline logistics flow through Pokrovsk?? It likely won’t mean a collapse in the front line, but it seems it will make things a lot more difficult for the Ukrainians ‘The West’ need to stop insisting the Ukrainians fight with one hand tied behind their backs. The resistance the Ukrainians have put up, against such a much larger neighbour, has been Herculian, to say the least. At an earlier stage in the war, the ‘Real Politik’ might(?) have been understandable, but Russia’s red lines have been proven to be bullshit, multiple times, so let the Ukrainians have at it. They have proven themselves a very impressive force, imagine what they could do if fully tooled up…
And even then, it’s not like Western/NATO troops are being deployed to Ukraine. The Ukrainians have asked for help, and certain countries have chosen to provide assistance. But to send them missiles like the Storm Shadows or ATACMs, and then say you can only fire them so far??? **** that, you’ve asked for help, here it is, off you go.
As has been said on this thread multiple times, if Putin and his cronies (and the 100’s of 1000’s of souls he’s sent to their lonely death) wanted to end the carnage, they could turn heel, and piss off back to the 2014 borders. If they choose not to, they should reap the whirlwind of everything Ukraine can throw at them, whether that be ammo that’s been domestically produced or donated from the West
