How do people feel about this one? Will it be short and sweet?
Mod warning:
https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121425200/#Comment_121425200
There's a big difference between 10% over 1 or 2 years.
Fluent (native) English is why our teachers are valuable abroad.
Spot the FGer. . . . Yes let's raid poorer countries for their teachers (like we do in Health for nurses) because we can't be arsed paying our own teachers properly such that it forces them to emigrate.
Easier to do in health. . . Less so in education.
Our teachers are valued abroad as OECD PISA studies show that we have one of the best eduction systems in the world despite massive underinvestment. Thanks to the teachers.
Wha?
If you have skills shortages immigration fills the gap. From tech, to trades, to retail to manufacturing etc.
It's normal. Teachers aren't special
So why aren't teachers from abroad coming here - particularily at second level? Is it down to qualifications not transferring over?
Is there still an Irish language requirement at certain levels?
You would expect there be influxes of non-irish into the country to take up all of these "extremely" high paid, low hours, low stress roles surely?
I'm not sure. Are they being offered positions or would teaching unions try and keep it a "home grown" only profession.
Places like India and Asia would have an endless number of suitable candidates.
There's nothing stopping teachers from the EU coming to work in an Irish secondary school. The fact that they don't says it all, quite frankly.
There are 650 applications from outside ireland every year
Really?
And there's still massive shortages.
Paddy doesn't like to pay properly.
That is statistically false. Re the pay
Go and tell that to the teachers at the departure gates at Dublin Airport.
I'd rather greet their eager replacements at the arrivals gate.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/why-are-there-so-few-migrant-teachers-in-ireland-1.4666389
They've 64 posts... Focussed on 2 threads taking the stance you'd expect.
Off you go. lol.
They won't be long returning to their own countries when they see how Paddy pays relative to the cost of living in Paddys economy.
Just like our "imported" nurses are, rightfully, rethinking their decision
could be many teachers are only offered 5 or 10 part time hours a week if you are lucky and then you could be gone from that school the following year or your hours cut to 8 hours a week
who in their right mind is going to fly here for that craic
its no wonder teachers are fleeing the country to tax free better more stable and lucrative alternatives
TUI survey from today tells alot:
Some people in the profession may be over estimating the value of their position and the difficulty in carrying out the role.
Would it be accurate to give an example like : A geography or history teacher is repeating the same lines and giving out the same information to students year after year. If they pass or fail if makes no real difference as the teacher performance isn't evaluated or scrutinized.
Not much of a challenge is it.
The salary, the pension and the let's say generous time of is not a bad deal at all for what the job is.
So your answer to the issue of Irish people being pushed away due to bad conditions and less pay than they need to live comfortably considering our disastrous housing/rental market, is to try and exploit immigrants from other EU countries thinking they'll be happy to accept the conditions Irish people aren't? You don't think priority should be given to simply creating a society where newly qualified workers can actually afford to live here and aren't pushed towards emigration?
A major issue here is new teachers aren't getting permanent posts, they're being messed around with different contracts. Do you think someone is going to relocate here without much long-term confidence and reassurance that they'll actually be able to get established in their industry? We're already seeing more people not coming here for tech roles (which pay very well) due to the housing crisis, yet people seem oblivious to the fact that young people are struggling majorly with rents and accommodation, 60%+ are living at home these days
Didn't the entire public sector just get another round of raises and as per the thread title are going into negotiations for another one.
The system of just giving everyone in the public sector a pay rise just because needs to change.
Maybe the graduate teachers could get a raise then but other teachers not. They are already highly paid for their role .
Isn't that fair?
Okay, and now compare salary increases alongside the increases in rents and property prices. Factor in the increased costs of everything involved in living over the last few years also.
It's just less favourable for young people nowadays, the social contract is completely screwed up, and instantly jumping to just wanting to fill vacancies with exploited immigrants is a race to the bottom and kicks the can down the road. Instead of actually accepting that we need to address these major issues in our society for people to at least maintain the quality of life we should expect in a supposedly rich, modern country.
But that's not how it works in the private sector. Increases are based on performance. There are no salary increases 'just because". I'm not sure if you work in public or private but if you do work in the private sector you would know this to be true
Do you accept that?
This is why there is a dislike for the public sector and teachers in particular . It's the perceived sense of entitlement that some may have.
I'm going to bow out here. It's just something the grates on me too much . No offense meant to anyone
This conversation needs to be brought back to basics. Most roles in public sector have a retention problem. Any one commenting should put themselves in the shoes of a young clerical officer, janitor, technician, general operative etc starting out. Try putting a car on the road or rent a room if your lucky on public sector pay at the moment, the figures don't add up. They can talk all they want on Newstalk, but at a time of an enormous cost of living crisis and record tax takes, wages have to go up significantly. This should be looked at in tandem with specific measures to tackle costs such as fuel costs etc.
Absolute bull that pay increases in the private sector are based on performance.
The biggest gobshites you'd ever meet work in the private sector
So if the salary pension and time off aren’t such a bad deal why are there so many vacancies ?
I am not a teacher so no horse in the race .
"The system of just giving everyone in the public sector a pay rise just because needs to change".
Jesus H Christ. 🤦♀️🙄
Which is fair enough but the solutions to all this is rarely "let's give COs a pay rise while HEOs+ get less of one" because you will get moaning about grades being devalued.
You'd have to ditch the twin sacred cows of mandatory Catholicism and the Irish language
...and where are these teachers going to find affordable accommodation within reach of city schools?
No
The entire public sector got another round of pay cuts last time. Try to keep up.
Of course there are cost of living increases in the private sector. Certainly in the unionised parts.
You are posting utter nonsense
Paddy puts experienced teachers into the top 20% of all income earners in the country for the majority of their career.
Paddy gives graduate teachers higher than average starting salaries.
If you have any sources, that contradict these two facts I repeated to you multiple times already, let's see them.
Is this really the calibre of people imparting knowledge and facts to children? Someone who posts bare faced lies, refuses facts as published by Revenue and refuses to provide their own sources? If there was any integrity in any of your colleagues, they'd be calling you out on your lies as well.
Why not have a go at the teachers off on career breaks, blocking the chances of new teachers getting permanent or full-time positions?
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