How do people feel about this one? Will it be short and sweet?
Mod warning:
https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121425200/#Comment_121425200
There's nothing stopping teachers from the EU coming to work in an Irish secondary school. The fact that they don't says it all, quite frankly.
I'm not sure. Are they being offered positions or would teaching unions try and keep it a "home grown" only profession.
Places like India and Asia would have an endless number of suitable candidates.
So why aren't teachers from abroad coming here - particularily at second level? Is it down to qualifications not transferring over?
Is there still an Irish language requirement at certain levels?
You would expect there be influxes of non-irish into the country to take up all of these "extremely" high paid, low hours, low stress roles surely?
Wha?
If you have skills shortages immigration fills the gap. From tech, to trades, to retail to manufacturing etc.
It's normal. Teachers aren't special
Our teachers are valued abroad as OECD PISA studies show that we have one of the best eduction systems in the world despite massive underinvestment. Thanks to the teachers.
Spot the FGer. . . . Yes let's raid poorer countries for their teachers (like we do in Health for nurses) because we can't be arsed paying our own teachers properly such that it forces them to emigrate.
Easier to do in health. . . Less so in education.
Fluent (native) English is why our teachers are valuable abroad.
There's a big difference between 10% over 1 or 2 years.
There needs to be a huge effort put into employing foreign teachers from within the EU and beyond.
If Irish people don't want to teach or leave the country once qualified just bring in people from abroad. Diversity of candidates like we see in other areas of the economy.
Why aren't there more foreign teachers ? Is there a particular reason?
Not that meaningless, we know itll be in parts and over either 1 and 2 yrs.
Totally meaningless to be talking about a percentage without saying what period of time that percentage covers.
Big thing on that...
They also pointed out that while Irish nurses appear close to the top of the list when compared to other nurses around the world, they are not high up when compared with the general average wage of workers in Ireland.
What the data also reveal, when you delve down deep, is that deep inequalities in the private sector, mean that women earn far less there, so the public pay differential is purely down to private sector discriminatory practices.
Irish nurses pay is not too bad, but it is difficult to compare it internationally:
There is somewhat of a PS pay premium at lower earnings, but at higher earnings, PS earnings fall behind the private sector.
I suggest ICT, accountancy and engineering are good examples of where PS salaries fall behind the private sector.
This research paper presents an econometric analysis of the public/private sector pay differential for the period 2015 to 2018 and has been prepared in response to user needs to inform discussions relating to the composition of earnings.
The methodology employed in this analysis is the same as that used by the Central Statistics Office to produce the analysis for years 2011-2014 (see References). A combination of available survey data and administrative data sources has been used. The sources used are the CSO’s Labour Force Survey (LFS) and the Earnings Analysis using Administrative Data Sources (EAADS).
The methods used in these analyses are: Ordinary Least Squares Regression (OLS); and Quantile Regression. For each of these methods, results based on a range of specifications are presented.
Results from the OLS Regression model show a public/private sector pay differential ranging from 6.8% in 2015 to -0.3% in 2018, for the model which includes size of enterprise as a determining factor. Results for the OLS model which deducts the pension levy and excludes size shows a pay differential ranging from 1.4% to -3.4%. See Table 4.1.
Summary results from the Quantile Regression model show a public/private sector pay differential in 2018 ranging from 12.7% at the 10th percentile to -17.3% at the 90th percentile for the model which deducts the pension levy and includes size of enterprise as a determining factor. See Figure 4.1 and Table 8.8. The corresponding model which makes no adjustment for the pension levy and excludes size shows a pay differential in 2018 ranging from 17.6% at the 10th percentile to -13.7% at the 90th percentile. See Table 8.4.
Why the **** do conversations, like this, always descend to teachers pay?
Yes, with full hours they are amongst the best paid especially for hours worked. They can, still, get much more abroad. Government is goong to bloody accept market pressure actually exists.
I'm more worried that our 24/7/365 nurses are burning out for pittance, considering their shift and function.
Same with fire service etc
Graduate teachers get 42,765, but that is if they get full hours
It is typical for a NQT to teach less than full hours.
I suspect that, yes, as you say, 43k is somewhat ahead of average graduate salaries.
And that is exactly how it should be.
We want to attract good quality candidates into teaching.
Also, bear in mind that the teachers scale is very long, so it takes them 20-25 years to reach the top. Whereas an accountant or engineer's salary will rise faster.
The PS pension is good, yes.
It is not as good as it used to be, but it is still good.
However, the pay premium you quoted is false.
There used to be a PS pay premium, yes, but the two/three/four paycuts during 2008-2012 meant that the pay premium is much less now.
I see the mirror have said the unions are pitching for 10% but itll be more than likely 6 to 8%. They have described it as bumper pay hikes haha
I’d say it’s more likely that people can’t be arsed dealing with the kid punching himself in the face for a bit of attention while the adults have a discussion.
Maybe you could provide alternative sources that contradict the sources I have provided and show that I am wrong?
Or is it because I provide facts backed up with sources that you have the problem with?
Why in the name of all that is holy are people still replying to salonfire? Stop feeding for god sake, not even he takes himself serious.
Then you shouldn't be. I've called for a Dublin allowance for all state employees who's workplace is in Dublin multiple times. One that is flexible to go up and down in line with all Dublin salaries according to economic conditions.
I am glad and surprised to see you support the Dublin allowance.
So teaching is so well paid that teachers cannot afford to live in Dublin?
"Would you also like Middle Eastern health and safety standards applied to Ireland as well? Religious freedom?"......WTF has that got to do with it?
"Those that leave, the vast majority return".......Ah the oul FF line of "Sure the Irish like to emigrate".
Your argument is pitiful and a complete joke.
Health insurance...what's that? Can't afford it. Sure we'll have free doctors appointments soon but no GPs.
Teacher shortages are also happening in other areas. We're two hours from Dublin and my own school has been unable to hire an art teacher since last April and the other school in our town are looking for a home ec teacher since September. We have made questionable hiring decisions in recent years due to lack of competition for some teaching posts. My own maternity leave went uncovered for months and I have "common" subjects.
Great! I'm glad you accept that being in the top 20% of income earners for the majority of your career can be considered good. Seems like you were misled in thinking otherwise for some reason.
Shows how weak your argument is when you have to leave the continent to draw comparisons. Would you also like Middle Eastern health and safety standards applied to Ireland as well? Religious freedom? Private education in compounds? Or are you only cherry picking the thing that you might benefit from?
Those that leave, the vast majority return. You seriously haven't heard of emigrants returning to Ireland in recent years?
The teacher shortages are in Dublin and is due to the physical lack of accommodation. Doubling the salary does not make a building magically appear. Plenty of teachers are leaving Dublin to get jobs down the country.
There's always a "guy on Newstalk" . . . . Always!
Newstalk are ISME/IBEC/FG/DOB FM.
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