If it was humorous you might have a point, but endlessly repeating joyless provocations is akin to throwing dirty nappies out the car window. Let's move on.
ah come on, i get the world cup is still a sore topic
but are we really thread banning folk for a joke?
There's been way worse Said about other teams that is let fly
Following on from the first few weeks of URC with the internationals away, who do we see as the highest potential young players who can make the international squad over the next couple of years, and ultimately become mainstays?
From a Leinster perspective I think the most likely candidates are James Culhane, Jack Boyle, Sam Prendergast, Jamie Osbourne and Tommy O’Brien.
For Munster I think there is Tom Aherne, Edwin Edogbo, Brian Gleeson and Ruadhan Quinn.
I haven’t seen much of Connacht or Ulster so far this season, but have heard good reports on Cathal Forde for Connacht, as well as Harry Sheridan and David McCann for Ulster.
I haven’t included the more established young players (e.g. Harry Byrne, Scott Penny, Calvin Nash etc.), who I expect are likely to pick up some caps along the way but may struggle to ultimately become first choice international players.
Obviously not all of these guys will go on to become starters (or internationals at all!), but considering this was the first World Cup for 19 out of our 2023 squad, there is likely to be a number of younger guys coming in to fill the void left by the old guard this time around - so hopefully some of them can live up to the hype and fulfil their potential!
Ireland didn't choke v New Zealand at the World cup. They just gave themselves a lot to do after 13 minutes in the match and couldn't catch Nz. Selection decisions, managing the cards and subs could have and should have been made differently but we were on their line right at the end of the game and had gotten over the line a few minutes eallrlier only to be held up. That is not choking..
For me they did choke v NZ back in 2013.
19 - 0 after 17 minutes. Sexton missed a conversion. Still 22 - 7 up after 33 minutes. Failed to score again.
Sexton missed a penalty to seal victory after 74 minutes and get the lead back out to 8 points.
30 seconds to go then Owens gives a mad peno v Jack mcgrath.
2 minutes later Crotty sneaks over on the corner.. still hurts.
Threadbanned for 2 weeks, do not post in this thread again until 22/11.
It's still affecting me. For example, yesterday I had to take an Ireland jersey off my daughter, it's a choking hazard.
Putting someone on ignore is pointless when everyone is quoting him.
He's clearly swimming against the tide, in everything he has ever written here.
Don't waste your time.
I doff my cap in respect to the above.
Why in the name of fcuk are you still droning on about this crap? Give it a feckin' holiday.
Im a bit of a neutral between the provinces. I support them all and when they play each other I tend to support he underdog or the team that's shooting the lights out. For me Ulster have underperformed spectacularly for many years. They have many decent and some fantastic players and they always have a couple of elite niqs on the books. Im not sure if its coaching or the provincial structure there but Ulster's problems are not in Dublin.
Neil Jenkins was probably the most lethal place-kicker I've ever seen. I've seen 87% listed as his career kicking accuracy and he slotted 44 kicks in a row at club level
Yep, but was still substantially the best kicking option for SA. Can't find the exact article RE: his history, but this was for 2022 to July of this year. With the way the RWC went, you'd imagine they've diverged even further since.
The big difference is in how you want to view the situations. France underperformed against SA and never should have lost that match.
Pollard has some real nightmares and why a lot of Bok fans wanted options for this World Cup. I remember this game and some really terrible kicks
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/south-africa-rugby-team-ripped-21618020
I haven't seen anyone label France as chokers for losing to South Africa. They were a team, like Ireland, who had won their group and were going into a quarter final as favourites. The big difference between France and Ireland is in how both teams performed in relation to their maximum potential. France were generally excellent and came out with all guns blazing. Ireland were the complete opposite.
So, there are plenty of ways to define losing performances. But really, despite lots of people wishing otherwise, the word term 'choker' or 'bottler' is a very accurate way to describe the term 'a team losing while perform well capable their best due to nerves.'
Yep, we can no longer have nuance, subtlety, gradations, context.
Far easier deal in absolutes....
I recall seeing a statistic that Pollard's general kicking stats are actually not great (open to correction on that one!).
I saw something similar recently too. Iirc, they were skewed from his early career, but there was a clear trend of improvement as he got more experience.
I'm not saying we lost because of Sexton. Just thinking of the penalties he's missed that looked standard fare for him.
All kickers miss penalties.
Yes, it's awful. Especially his last match. The stats about lack of running and playing differently than the previous 2 years is the one that really needs investigating. The reasons for that may lead to the reasons he missed the kick.
No handling errors and they took their chances. We lost by a whisker. N.Z did the business and won. It's not like we'd beat them by 20. It wasn't a good day at the office. We underperformed and fair play to the kiwis. 4 more years of agony.
I'm one who thinks that we can win the feckin world cup and could have this time. The disappointment is awful. But we're going to improve, imo. 4 years to develop players and get systems in place. We will be champions in 4 years!!! Believe!
All kickers are prone to missing kicks. You'd be surprised at the overall kicking stats for some kickers. But the bigger the occasion, the more coverage it gets. There's also a huge amount of online coverage and analysis on Irish rugby.
I recall seeing a statistic that Pollard's general kicking stats are actually not great (open to correction on that one!). Ruan Pienaar had a weird reputation as being a great goal kicker when he was anything but. Farrell can be extremely streaky. Wilkinson had some really poor days with the boot.
Morne Steyn was the one guy that genuinely did deliver both in terms of reputation and stats with Carter not far off either.
I don't think anyone has said that!
If you think New Zealand had to play an unbelievable game to beat Ireland and Ireland were just unlucky then fair enough.
It should also be fair enough for others to have the opinion that the occasion got to many of our players and it affected their performance negatively.
There's no point in anyone getting stroppy, strawmanning or any other carry on just because there's a difference of opinion.
Sexton has been prone to missing penalty kicks in the past. It's awful that it happened in this match.
i miss the Zebo debates at this point
New Zealand were required to play a game where they had ZERO handling errors, which is pretty much unheard of in the professional game. They won by 4 points.
it appears the only way to define a winning performance is "perfect" and a losing performance as "chokers"
there is literally nothing in between these two definitions, one or the other, you pick lads.....
In your opinion they 'choked'.
Teams only choke when they are expected to win something.
You had an expectation we would win.
That was never a legitimate expectation, it was always a 50/50 game.
Shane Horgan, Rob Kearney, many supporters, ex players and pundits use the definition of choking to describe Ireland's performance against New Zealand. The stats back it up.
Aloooof stomps his feet claiming the definition of choking is wrong.
That's a bit mad. For me, you can only choke if you have a commanding lead and let it slip, Northampton style. Ireland were never in a position to choke in that game.
Musicrules: "Shane Horgan: This was a choke"
Shane Horgan: "This wasn't a choke".
Do you disagree with all the definitions I've listed for you? If so, take that up with those who made the definition. You may have been unfamiliar with how choking is defined, Shane Horgan may be the same. But his statement and that of Rob Kearney aligns with the definition of choking. Uncomfortable truth, yes but the truth it is.
