How do people feel about this one? Will it be short and sweet?
Mod warning:
https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121425200/#Comment_121425200
Thanks, arrears pay from August to 13/10 doesn't seem correct that case. Will be getting in touch with NSSO.
Hard to see a proposal and a ballot done before the current agreement expires. You would think ICTU would at least put out a statement detailing what is there starting point or demands in the negotiations.
There is no need for a ballot before the current agreement expires. The new deal should take effect early next year. There is plenty of time.
Why would ICTU give their hand away? Issuing a statement does absolutely nothing. It gives the Government a starting point to talk down from. When it comes to convincing members to accept the whatever deal is reached, there will be a huge chorus saying "I'll only accept the deal you said at the start".
I imagine everyone knows what the deal is but there is a necessary song and dance about it until it is announced.
What is the deal so?
Well obviously by everyone i mean those in the negotiations. There's always a smart arse.
I mean obviously those in the negotiations know the deal haha. Or do you mean they all know the end point already?
I mean the end point. I expect the union and the government chief negotiators to have a pretty good idea of what the final percentage will be.
It's just a lot of pagentry for the public on both sides.
Ah yeah I'm sure they always know the expected end point early on. Both sides are used to it. I think they might try something different than a flat %. Might be a mix of things like a couple of one off payments and %s different for different levels. They might try that back dating crack as well , people liked that.
Divide by 10.
The fortnight runs from Friday to the Thursday you are paid
It's a 14 day basis. Here is a worked example using my last 3 payslips which cover the period before, during and after the last raise.
Dividing by 14, and using 2 days (Fri & Sat) at the old rate, and 12 at the new rate gives the same 3614.09 that was actually on my payslip.
Using your 10 day basis with just Fri at the old rate and 9 days at the new comes in at 3616.38, which is wrong.
Great to have a bit of diversity in the service, but if he really wants to attract more talent they are going to have to increase salaries
They could definitely look at more flexibility around what point you start on too
Unions don't care about that as they are non union members. Same as the unions shafted new entrants with 10% off the scale back in 2011
Also would lead to unfair situations for those who had to start at point 1 and take a paycut vs new people coming in who may earn more than them if they can start higher with less experience
Not this again.
The unions never agreed to the pay cuts for new entrants. They were unilaterally imposed by the government.
Also on your first point, a lot of people doing open EO, AO, etc. are already serving civil servants so could be union members.
It's not only the Unions who make changes to the civil service. If the civil service is having trouble getting people , then it's an option to look at.
And I think it's perfectly possible for a number of people to have more experience in an area than some existing civil servants but who won't apply because they'll have to start at point 1.
It depends if the Civil Service is truly having a problem getting people though.
I agree. But is it fair if you started as an AO with 10 years relevant private sector experience on point 1 last year, and somebody new now comes in with 5 years relevant experience ahead of you on point 5 next year earning more?
But it wasn't particularly fair if you started post 2013 and someone got in just before that.
Or you're an AP with no flexitime while it's ring fenced for some APs who had it before the change.
I don't particularly see it happening btw but the Civil Service is still an employer and might have to change things to attract candidates.
Its annoying we havent heard anything
Tbh I imagine it will something close to 10% (but not quite 10) spread out over two years
So another substantial pay cut in reality, then.
Yeah, not even the usual standing still.
Government will come out massively on top, with that amount
You're expectations are ridiculous if you expect to hear anything at this stage.
Maybe they'll bring back age pointing!
Im not that clued in on how it works.
Inflation slowing to 6% this year, 3 next year, lower the year after.
10% would be pretty good imo.
A fair few pay increases after the crash when inflation was in and around zero so swings and roundabouts.
I think you meant restoration of pay cuts after the crash.
Because they certainly weren't increases.
A 10% Spread over 2 years will still have you down, a lot, after years of high inflation
Negotiations take time. It will be weeks before we hear anything.
I don't expect anything concrete till Feb anyway. You'll know when things are progressing when the newspapers start talking about it more as info is leaked.
They were increases alright.
Out of curiosity, when the cuts were implemented did you consider them a 'realignment' to pre-boom levels?
Everyone will have an agenda for their own self interest but there were increases to the rates of public sector pay every year from 2016 onwards.
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