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Niger

lizzyjane

Surprised to see no thread on the goings on the past few weeks in Niger.

Although hardly surprising as the highlighting of western nations wrongdoings against third world countries does seem to be frowned upon in here.

I see Victoria Nuland has recently visited the country to try and tell the Junta in Niger that the U.S doesn't like Coups, perhaps she should have told the truth and said she doesn't like coups that is against her countries interests.

I think its about time African nations are left alone to sort out there own affairs without France, the U.S or Britain sticking their noses in.

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Milominderbender

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121904233#Comment_121904233

Europe should do the same the American empire brings nothing but trouble. Ireland can kick out NGO's who receive American funding to meddle in our affairs.

L.Ball

"We were colonialists and still are in the form of the Catholic Church".

Lol.

Lmao, even.

brickster69

US told to remove it's troops and shut down it's bases in Niger

https://twitter.com/LarryMadowo/status/1769252660308324549

TokTik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121427986#Comment_121427986

Change exportation to importation and you’re talking about the EU, bar Orban and the lads.

HalloweenJack

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-67550481

So these junta lads sound like a nice buch of people: They're legalising the exploitation of desperate people and the exportation of their problems.

brickster69

The president of Gabon has been overthrown in a military coup.

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121018582#Comment_121018582

https://kyivindependent.com/isw-prigozhin-left-africa-in-haste-due-to-russian-interference/

rogber

Will be interesting to see if Prigozhin's death and Wagner's possible break up will affect things in Niger. Russia is main foreign backer if the coup, right?

lizzyjane

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121013150#Comment_121013150

"Military intervention". Does this mean dropping bombs on brown people again.

brickster69

France denied from going through Algerian airspace for a military intervention.

https://twitter.com/AfricanAnalysts/status/1693972852297417039

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121004987#Comment_121004987

I doubt if the 'glorious union soldiers defeating red skin savages' angle is taught in the US anymore. That's not ignoring the appalling treatment of the Native American population by European settlers. Contrast that with the 'Russia has done no wrong' patriotic rubbish that's been introduced into Russian schools under Putin. When you see statues of Stalin reappearing in the country, you know there's something seriously amiss.

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121005651#Comment_121005651

A bunch of military has-been's were about to be forced into retirement so they staged a coup for themselves.

ECOWAS know the score here, they have to get these guys out, but no one wants bloodshed for that, hence the impasse. It's a game of bluff by the new banana military dictatorship to see if ECOWAS will actually go ahead.

Pa ElGrande

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058308839/niger

World war. Why would a Neocon such as Nuland be sniffing around Colonie du Niger, surely this is a French government concern?

Niger Coup Puts $13 Billion Nigeria-Europe Gas Pipeline Project In Jeopardy

The concept of the trans-Saharan pipeline was initially proposed in the 1970s but saw a revival in 2002 when the Nigerian National Petroleum Company Limited (NNPCL) and Algeria’s national oil and gas company, Sonatrach, signed a Memorandum of Understanding to prepare for the project.

Although a feasibility study completed in September 2006 confirmed the technical and economic viability of the pipeline, little progress was made until a new MoU was signed in 2022, reigniting hopes for its realization.

Even before the Ukraine war, EU countries have soldiers in the French colonies, these are characterised by weak governments, separatist movements and of course mercenaries (remember the era of Mad Mike Hoare). The government of Ireland has soldiers in Mali as part of the European Union Training Mission.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydH39HjuFZs

Ardillaun

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120990571#Comment_120990571

It would be a massive gamble to go in. If an insurgency developed you could end up getting stuck there, sustaining significant casualties and triggering a similar event back home. In addition several ECOWAS leaders came to power in coups themselves. I imagine they wouldn’t be too keen to snuff this out and set an awkward precedent.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/8/7/niger-what-are-west-africas-options-to-reverse-the-coup

I suspect what ECOWAS and dare I say the EU want to know is, can the new regime in Niger deliver order?

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121002454#Comment_121002454

Welcome to the thread and indeed Boards.ie.

That was my point. Let’s discuss American imperialism too. The history of the US we in the west were fed is glorious union soldiers defeating red skin savages. Understandably many people find US propaganda more palatable than any other.

rock22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121002454#Comment_121002454

A cursory glance at world history would show that almost every country, including our own, was taken by the sword and the bullet at one time or another.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120972303#Comment_120972303

"Also stating that the Russian landmass was taken by the sword and bullet. Remind me again about the history of Britain, the US, etc, etc."

Whataboutery in a nutshell. Anybody wanting to discuss imperialism, but leaves out Russian imperialism, isn't debating from a position of honesty. And yes, the 'Russian' landmass was taken by the sword and bullet, or should I say the Eastern European/Northern and Central Asian landmass.

TheValeyard

Might sort itself.

The mutineers are facing a mutiny.

https://twitter.com/casusbellii/status/1692891059104231669

Edit: situation seems to have been solved. Payment to troops solved it. Coup leaders live to fight another day.

rock22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120991147#Comment_120991147

I never thought anyone could get things so wrong just from an analysis of a 'User Name' on boards. I am not going to correct you, right now I am enjoying the idea that in at least one persons mind I am a 45 yr old from Blackrock .

I will say though, and the reason for my post, that you seem to spend far more time trying to label and pidgeon hole posters you disagree with rather than discussing the situation on Niger which, after all, is what the topic is about. it had nothing to do with you grammar, I never went to Blackrock so I wouldn't know, but i don't think I have ever criticised anyone's grammar on boards.

The ECOWAS meeting of military heads in continuing in Accra today. They have stated that their preference is for a diplomatic solution but almost all members are willing to join the standby force. But ECOWAS are split, perhaps fatally, and that could see military coups in neighbouring states.

Tell it to me arse

I don’t equate isolationism to colonialism. What I said is that isolationists here claim Irish people had no hand in colonialism of Africa. In fact those very people, often Catholics, who equate our isolation to the Irish being tribal and saints and scholars, support the church who sent men to teach and build schools there. It’s a fantasy that we are blameless in colonising Africa.

I’m reminded of the time recently when Bono went to Uganda and the educated people there called him out saying we don’t want “white saviours” coming to our help.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120990263#Comment_120990263

It proves the danger of jumping to conclusions. You are here for a fortnight and have posters wrongly pigeon holed as pro catholic missionaries.

Africa wasn’t colonised to protect Europe.

Also, I find it difficult to understand how you can equate isolationism to colonialism.

Tell it to me arse

And as for the leave them alone brigade….do these people really think isolating Africa to investment is the answer? Surely they see, as in Irelands case, that opening up the borders is the way to prosperity. But that wouldn’t tie in with their conspiracy theory about liberal United States exploiting them. More Russian disinformation based on anti UN propaganda.

Tell it to me arse

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120976742#Comment_120976742

What are like 15 years old? Geo political games? Do you think even the most naive readers fall for this innocent act? There are numerous factors at play not least Russian imperialism and disinformation about the west which you base your mock innocent act off of. Go ahead take the side of Russia. See how that works out for you.

Tell it to me arse

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120990318#Comment_120990318

Let me guess, with a name like Rock22 you are a 45 year old man posing as a 15 year old like on the rugby forums. Pretending to be juvenile and innocent while being a bestial power, property and money monger in reality?

The post that you quote is perfectly coherent although I do admit my first one (not the one you quote) was written in a rush and the grammar isn’t great. So if you can’t understand the post you quote I suggest the problem is with you and not me.

Now let’s get down to your username. Rock22, is, I assume chosen to play the innocent yet demonic child, but assert you are from Blackrock usually Blackrock college as no one I know who lives in Blackrock calls it Rock. You are no doubt here to advertise you exist and can defend your privileged position and because your portrayal of naïveté and innocence you are blameless like the very isolationists I refer to in my first post.

You undermine me in a mock manner by criticising my grammar which while although obviously written in a rage against the hypocricy of the isolationists, is understandable, long winded descriptions aside. You write in the manner of a juvenile to raise the patronising tone.

Most people I know from Blackrock are De Velera supporters. He taught there and their privileged position and assumption of being morally right in his/their anti colonial political positions is evident by it being drilled into them and them/you perpetuating this moral high ground on our society via their mouthpieces like you.

They assume they are entitled to rise to positions of power because they went to school there and impose it on the rugby field before they take it to the field of life. However, that bondage they visit on most rugby playing schools doesn’t transfer because the results there are appalling and rallying crowds to make up for your lack of results is corrupt.

As to your blatantly anti colonial previous posts, do you think that crimes aren’t inflicted by internal governments just as equally as those crimes inflicted by colonial governments. Ok maybe not as bad but the mass incarceration of mentally sick people, single mothers and workers in De Veleras time are something akin to the worst outcomes a government can inflict on its population. Innocent people.

Maybe not hacking off hands or genocide but an all too evil element that takes away futures of souls because of arbitrary thoughts on things like sin. Maybe you should stick your moral high ground on colonialism and look to what ideology you support yourself. An evil one based on hatred.

Dohnjoe

It's a game of bluff, no one wants bloodshed, but the coup leaders are banking on ECOWAS not doing anything

rock22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120990263#Comment_120990263

I have read your post at least three time. And I still cannot understand a word of it. Maybe i am losing my mind. Any chance you could write it again for those of us you cannot understand what you are on about?

Meanwhile, the African Union and ECOWAS seem to be at odds over a military intervention. ECOWAS military chiefs are meeting in Accra today so it is possible they will issue a statement later on their proposed action, if any.

Germany is calling for EU sanctions, which I imagine will happen sooner rather than later.

Tell it to me arse

And what about pre-empting invasion from lands that vastly outnumbered them population wise?

I assumed you were an Irish isolationist moral supremacist which borrows its anti internationalism slant from Russian disinformation, Marxism (that the lands resources are owned by the people there and that there should be no private property rights,) and finally Irish monk-like isolationist Catholicism, that claims we are blameless in the colonialism of those lands.

Yes, there was slavery, rape, pillage and murder but it was based on protecting their smaller vastly outnumbered homelands. You can cite all the authors you want, but the animus that existed towards Africans was based on those two points mainly. And the fact, Europe was more technologically advanced.

It resulted in a race for those lands and exploitation and murder followed.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120990034#Comment_120990034

A long, confused, rambling post in which you accuse me of defending everything from catholic missionaries to Russian rapists. Neither of which I have done.

If you believe western colonialism in Africa was about “bringing civilisation and democracy” then I believe you are ill informed. Have a read of books such as “King Leopold’s Ghost” by Adam Hochshild or “Land of Tears” by Robert Harms which may lead you to reassess your beliefs.

Tell it to me arse

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120972150#Comment_120972150

You seem determined to condemn European colonialism and American liberalism for no other reason than to align yourself with Russia isolationism/communism/Irish isolationist Catholicism? Can I advise you after there was monks in Ireland there was also Catholic missions into Africa. This moral high ground stance of cavemen catholic Irishmen isolationists who think we are blameless and hold the moral high ground due to not being colonialists are fantasists. We were colonialists and still are in the form of the Catholic Church. Are you telling me those people (the church) only do good abroad and/or that the natives don’t want that western ideology there instead of their tribes’ ideology? Tell me your reasons.

Yes France destroyed what they built when they were booted out of West Africa but their reasons for going there weee more nuanced and complex than rape and pillage. They brought civilisation, democracy and had reasons for protecting their own homelands which were vastly outnumbered. Isn’t it better to pre-empt invasion by going there yourself? And don’t give me this moral high ground scut that Ireland wasn’t protected by potential invasions over the centuries by European powers going there. I suppose you would take the Trotskies stance of let them invade us then we will be victims and blameless line? This tribe like parochial Irish monkist Catholicism?

I suppose you would trot out your already stated Russian disinformation of rape and pillage as reasons they went there when protection of their homelands was the reason. Also exploration and bringing new lands to fruition and out of isolation from the rest of the world due to lack of technology, democracy, engineering and so on. But you will argue these people were better off in tribes inbreeding and dying from disease? Yes there was many ills that resulted in a clash of civilisations, slavery, murder and so forth but those tribes didn’t have any laws to prevent those things in their own communities. A race to the top isn’t what I’m arguing for but condemning the Europeans for going there and what they did is cynicism in the extreme. It’s moral high ground reaching based off fact but most of the crime etc nowadays is of historic Russian origin. You’re aligning yourself with Russia.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120984294#Comment_120984294

So stagnant, the continent produced the pyramids and sphinx and a flourishing, complex culture in a civilisation lasting 3000 years.

Excluding the Greeks, Western invasion of Africa began when Rome invaded Egypt in 30BC and Carthage in present day Tunisia 150 earlier.