A lot is the quick answer. They intend to open some up to use the submunitions in drones too.
Russians claim to have a shell production capacity of 20,000 per month so 240,00 a year the 1 million is nonsense.
"Compared to war demands, Ukraine’s current production capacities appear relatively small. On the other hand, it is significant compared to other states’ capabilities. For example, the US industry currently produces nearly 15,000 155-mm ammunition rounds monthly. According to various estimates, the Russian industry could be making, at best, 20,000 152-mm rounds per month, although the precise data is classified. The US plans to increase ammunition production to 20,000 per month by spring 2023 and 40,000 per month by 2025, given the Russo-Ukrainian war’s intensity and the ammunition consumption speed." reference below
https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/01/10/ukraine-finally-launches-domestic-ammunition-production-how-will-this-impact-the-war/
700 shells a day is all they can produce and I even doubt they meet that.
"Once the stockpile is gone, the only source will be new deliveries. According to Ukrainian estimates, Russia has capacity to produce around 20,000 rounds a month or less than 700 rounds a day. One 152mm gun fires 7-8 rounds a minute, so a single battery of 6 guns will expend that 700 rounds in one 15-minute bombardment – leaving nothing for any other Russian forces anywhere in Ukraine. No wonder competition for shells between different units is becoming intense and Wagner units claim they are not being given any."
It's very simple the Russians will be picking up the bill for the gargantuan clean up
Easier said than done
Even Mr Sunak believes cluster bombs are a bad idea. 123 countries have signed up to the Convention on Cluster Munitions (Interesting side fact that is convention was held in Dublin) Countries such as Iraq, Afghanistan and Ireland have banned them, but apparently they're okay to use in Ukraine because the place is already mined.
Land mines are terrible weapons. I remember visiting Croatia long after their war, and there were still no-go areas where there might be land mines. Every now and again there might be a goat or something blown up. The problem is that once a country is mined, you can never be 100% sure that you've demined it afterwards. There are no maps to refer to.
Cluster bombs are a whole new level of evil. Children get disproportionately killed and maimed by these. Having an area already mined isn't a reason to justify cluster bombs. Hundreds of these things are released into the environment.
They are terrible but they are already in use by Russia already. The Ukrainians have said they intend to use them outside built up areas.
And is Russia one of the countries who have signed up to the cluster munitions convention?
It's always easy to ban weapons if you are a country who doesn't need to use them in the first place. But when you're fighting against someone who is using them?
Neither side should be using them. They are totally unjustifiable.
Yeah but cruise missiles and bombs and tanks are like totally justifiable!!!
This is war, none of it is justified but it is what it is.
Russia have shown no restraint or care for anyone since they illegally invaded a sovereign country.
Fight fire with fire.
If Ukraine want to use cluster munitions on the entrenched Frontlinse (fields, not towns or cities), I don't see an issue.
We might as well just crack open the nukes then🙄
There is one country swinging it’s Mickey about nuking countries and it’s not Ukraine.
If cluster bombs help Ukraine free their land from barbarian raping scumbags then bring them on.
Why shouldn't the Ukrainians also use them in cities too? - after all the Russians did.
Cluster munitions are vile horrible weapons, they should ever be needed.
But you know what? The Russians could leave. They could go tomorrow, they could go this very minute and return to their actual country and put an end to this monstrous nonsense they they put upon Ukraine. They could stop shelling Ukrainian cities, they could stop murdering and raping citizens under their “care”. They could stop stealing children and go the f*ck HOME, and put an end to all of this.
It is on the Russians and not the desperate nation defending themselves for the fact that these vile weapons are in play at all. They don’t need to be be used if Russia would just get a hint and do the right thing.
Because it would potentially be a war crime first and foremost. Secondly, there a difference in danger from UXO in a city (where people will be living) and UXO in a field.
Ukrainians can do what they want in Ukraine in defence of their sovereign nation, in my opinion. They are an independent nation, with the agency that confers.
tariff the russians until reparations are paid up and keep sanctions in place until they start acting civilized
Probably because the targets Ukraine would be launching against would be their own cities and towns. The urge to resist invasion will quickly dry up if the army starts hitting its own population without due caution.
They're an awful weapon but it's a bit weird, and rich, that having seen months of Russian use of these things met with silence - suddenly Ukraine should be ashamed to fight fire with fire, all to clear out some dug-in russian trench locations.
Trenches that appear to exist as a bit of a last line of defence between the south of Ukraine, and Crimea.
I'm a Napalm kinda guy meself but sure we'll go with the clusters. They kill orcs and that's what matters.
Could cluster munitions be used to clear minefields
If Russia had shown some restraint and left their cluster munitions at home we might be having a very different conversation, but they didn't, so they're just going to have to accept that they're going to be on the receiving end now.
Estimates of Russia's artillery shell production capacity vary. British military think-tank RUSI put it at 1.7 million shells per year prior to the war and 2.5 million per year currently. That's 200,000 per month, which is way beyond anything the combined West can do in the short-term. USA is aiming for a mere 80,000 per month by 2028.
Nobody knows the true size of their pre-existing stockpile. Even Russia probably don't know for sure. The Soviets were hoarders, they didn't throw things away, they had massive stockpiles dotted around the USSR in salt mines.
It was widely reported in Dec 2022 that Russia was almost out of shells and were using 40 y/o ammo with high failure rates. That's 7 months ago. They've continued firing tens of thousands of shells per day in the 7 months since that article. They are down from their peak of 50,000 per day but they are still averaging over 10,000 per day.
Looks like the kirsch bridge was targeted earlier today,
No damage reported
Yes.
They reckon russia produces shells 10 times more than what my source says. What is certain is that russia can't get the shells to the front in enough quantities ever and they're grossly inaccurate compared to the Ukrainians.
It's not that, it's just the latest putinbot talking point whataboutery while ignoring their use by russia directly against civiiians (i.e. war crimes).
It also makes it really easy to spot them now.
Russians mistakenly(?) blasted the Kadyrovs
I think you're objecting in the wrong place. Take your complaints to Moscow and see how far you get. Hopefully your demise won't be too slow and painful.
That was a bit much.
My one concern with them using cluster bombs is the potential for unexploded munitions to end up littering the Ukrainian landscape after the war. Would hate to see a potential landmine type situation where kids are picking them up ten years down the line and blowing themselves up.
Russia might be using them already but I suppose the last thing you want to be doing is adding even more unexploded bombs to the landscape.
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