This guys in the news quite a lot recently.
This seems a bit too far. Is primary a bit too young for this ideology? Certainly “endocrine supports” for young kids seems a bit scary as the changes can be irreversible.
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/transgender-issues-should-be-part-of-primary-curriculum-says-childrens-minister-roderic-ogorman-42256827.html
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trans economist deirdre mccloskey knew she was in the wrong body from a very young age, so i guess theres that!
I'm not sure why you think conflating transgenderism and homosexuality makes sense.
In one situation you have someone that is sexually attracted to the same sex, which people are far more accepting of now.
Transgenderism is something quite different entirely, it is someone who believes (at that particular time at least) that they are one gender inhabiting the body of another gender. Completely separate to their sexual preferences and in its most extreme manifestation requires extreme and none reversible surgery.
Well, when you strop making up numbers we could try. And ow mnay times do you have to be told that there's no indoctrination or agendas other than the ones in your head making up statistics and thinking everyone's going to believe you?
Transgender is a feeling people have in there head
You know people said the exact same thing about homosexuality not so long ago, right? And now one of them is your friend!
They accept that about homosexuality now, but they certainly didn't in the past. The idea that people are born gay, or know that they are gay from a very young age, was not at all well accepted in the 70s and 80s. The erroneous argument that children and teens couldn't actually be gay because they hadn't matured yet was also very common. Gayness was wrongly thought of as a choice, a decision or maybe something that "happened" to people because of damaging life experience or influence - we see the exact same attitudes to trans identity today.
Plenty of transgender people say that they knew they were transgender from a very young age - even of they didn't have the word for it at the time or fully understand the feeling. We should listen to them.
"most people" don't like the scientific definition?
Could I get your definition of "most" please?
So it’s already being taught?
or did you just pivot towards the subject during a civics class or something?
im curious because if it wasn’t mandatory for you to do so, the principal of you’re school would have received a call from me had you been filling my kids head with that garbage voluntarily
you mention religion class, like I’ve often said, identity politics and the cult of diversity is the new religion so It being taught in religion class is no coincidence
Fair point: a large portion of people/a lot of people/some people/a large proportion of people; take you pick.. I'm not going to hold a survey on the just becuase you want to be pedantic.
Are you telling me that you don't think people believe this or do you have a point to make?
Ah, so facts are pedantic, good of you to clarify where you are coming from.
Also its a good idea for you not not to hold a survey, you wouldn't want to get blindsided by reality.
The reality is that a tiny percentage of people dont like the scientific definitions and that these definitions impact an even tinier percentage of people.
What we should be teaching (if anything!) is that so called trans issues are in no way related to gay or bisexual issues.
Being gay, straight or bi isn't a decision that people make (or frequently change their minds on!)
'A tiny percentage' don't like the scientific definition?
Could I get your definition of "a tiny persentage' please?
Rhetorical question - you never intedned to make a point, so leaving you here too.
They are different things so comparing one to the other isnt necessarily useful. What you want to avoid is false positives especially considering there are de-tranitioners who regret going down the route.
Scientific fact.
Using science, explain to me how you can tell if someone is transgender? What tests are there?
If there are 2 males in front of a scientist/doctor, one believes he’s a man, the other believes he’s a woman. What science can show the scientist who is who?
Dazzle me with scientific “facts”.
It's not really a current trend is it though? There are a wide variety of examples and evidence of many cultures over the ages who have transgenderism or "third gender". This isn't new.
Homosexuality was common in ancient Greece and Rome, only with the rise of Abrahamic religions was this suppressed, transgenderism the same.
I see loads of people complaining that we'll have more transgender people just like I've seen said before "we have more gays now" or whatever other nonsensical arguement.
No we don't have more. We just have more people who feel secure and free enough to be who they are, society is becoming more accepting and this is a good thing. Poor mental health comes from suppression and oppression of people who are LGBTQ+ rather than education and understanding of who they are.
It’s already taught in SOME schools in Ireland, depending upon the ethos of the school, whether it’s an ET school or a religious ethos school -
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/education/exploring-gender-identity-in-primary-schools-37429108.html
It’ll differ in the way it’s taught, if it’s taught at all, because each and every school is obligated to have a Relationships and Sex Education policy, which is set by the school itself in accordance with the ethos of the Patron of the school.
That’s why all the getting worked up over nothing is a bit silly. Roderic doesn’t have any responsibility for the curriculum in Irish schools. That’s Norma Foley’s responsibility as the current Minister for Education.
Of course one is saying that homosexuality and transgenderism are the same. It's the opposition to them that are the same. Same arguments, same fears, same ignorance.
Either way, I don't think it has anything to do with the broader discussion at hand.
Well i'd wager that there are a lot more MAPs in Ireland than trans folk, so why not learn about them too??
Feel free to start a thread about it rather than derailing this one.
So this kind of teaching is already in place?
thanks for letting me know
It’s not quiet the same I would say. There is a lot of confusion around transgenderism, including inability to provide simple definitions. I think if the language and definitions were clarified then a lot of the issues would evaporate and then teachers would actually have a solid basis to work with.
Just to end this irrelevant diversion, it's already covered in an age appropriate way in the CAPP (Child Abuse Prevention Programme, AKA StaySafe) in primary schools.
very glib statement , each has to be looked separately, and shock horror, parents etc want to protect kid's interests. Remember with the gay issue, it was leave us alone man, we just want to live our lives without the gov interfering, the trans lobby want the government interfering, providing sketchy and often irreversible "medical" treatments
Exactly it really is that simple. No big deal.
What I can't get a clear answer on is how this benefits kids.
They get sex eduction close to puberty for very a good reason, to help understand what they are going through and to educate safe sex.
How is learning about transgender people helping them with education.
If the parents want to discuss it with them fair enough but school teachers should not be doing it.
At a guess, I would imagine that it is an attempt to "normalise" transgenderism by introducing it as not unusual to impressionable children.
Do you know what the term "young adult" means? They're adults aged 18-25. Do you really want to police what books 18-25 can read?
I never once said I taught it during religion class. I said I did not take the same approach as I am expected to take in religion. I covered in in Social, Personal, and Health Education and English.
Can I ask what "rubbish" you speak of? That society is multicultural? That society does not solely consist of heterosexual, nuclear families? That interracial couples exist?
“What Is Young Adult Fiction? Young adult fiction (also referred to as “YA fiction” for short) describes works written for readers between the ages 12 and 18”
So let’s start with the basics: YA stands for Young Adult and it refers to fiction written specifically for teenagers aged (approximately) between 13 and 18. Here’s where it slots into the market as a whole:
These ranges are all approximate.
They benefit from learning about the world around them, like much of what they learn in primary school.
It sounds like you have a problem with the entire curriculum rather than this one potential item.
I really hope you got permission from all the parents and the principal of the school.
These are not part of the primary school curriculum and you spent 3 weeks doing it and the kids missed out on 3 weeks of what you are supposed to teach.
I would say the parents of any Muslim kids were delighted you were telling them about same sex marriage.
How did the parents love the approach exactly I assume they weren't in the class.
Why would any parent love kids coming home after school asking questions about something a teacher should not be telling them about.
Assuming any of this is true which I have my doubts.
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