How do people feel about this one? Will it be short and sweet?
Mod warning:
https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121425200/#Comment_121425200
Well in the context that we are part of the PIIGS countries that I have been referencing with regards to our premium we pay our public sector over the private sector
LIES
and you lot were first one up looking for pay rises
with threats to strike when we had a surplus I think not.
They will see it as being the truth.
Would you stop, seriously.
There is no overpayment in public sector on a like for like comparative basis.
Tell that to the CSO who have the public sector paid a premium of over 20% on average more than the private sector, this premium only really exists in other PIIGS countries. If you have an issue talk to the CSO for having actual facts and data on the discussion.
No, the CSO have already analysed the difference between public and private and have determined that for the majority in the public sector they are payed less than in the private sector, accounting for the different variables.
I presume you have checked the methodology used in all of the other countries to see if they accounted for these differences when comparing the two sectors?
That doesn’t happen anymore. People are getting sucked in time and time again by his efforts and it’s generating the traffic the site badly needs.
Have a look at the weekly pay rate. Here you go - go to table 1A weekly earnings by economic sector and scroll down and look at sectors and look at year 2022 Q2 - Public sector 1043.75 vs Private sector 819.36. That is as black and white as your going to get it. Trying the spin of methodologies or what ever spin you want to try and promote as being the truth. The CSO have the raw data on the subject. The methodology is weekly wage how much more simple do you want this.
https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-elcq/earningsandlabourcostsq12022finalq22022preliminaryestimates/
Got my ballot today and voted in favour.
Hopefully they'll get everyones votes in quick to get tallying.
Not sure why anyone would vote before the budget. Doesn't really make any sense to.
Probably won't make any sense after the budget either!
Well if I was working in the Public sector I would be voting yes and trying to get this through asap. The same conditions that seen you get these rises will not exist in 3/6 months time and any delay could back fire with the government realizing that there will be a lot fire fighting and cost in a lot of other areas in the Irish economy.
Except the data doesn't compare like for like does it? It compares the sectors as a whole which is incorrect. The Private Sector data includes - Accommodation and food services 404 avg/week, Wholesale and retail trade 660 avg/ week, Arts, entertainment, recreation and other service activities 588 avg/week. These are the 3 lowest paid economic sectors in the private sector, none of which have a comparable job in the Public sector yet you are using these figures to lower the average wage of the Private sector as a whole. Stats do not suggest the Public Sector is better paid for a similar job.
You are either being disingenuous or you don't have the intelligence to understand the data, which is it?
By any chance do you work in any of the following areas of the Private sector which have seen massive increases over the past 5 years, far greater than the public sector? Information and communication(34%), Administrative and support service activities(31%), Construction(25%), Professional and Technical(22%), Financial and Real Estate(21.8%)
All before this years pay rises of course but I suppose you have no issue with that.
Wait for it - "How many of these employers are €240Bn in debt?"
Also, on average these sectors of the Private ecomomy increased by 21.8 and 34%
Almost a 33% pay increase for some early childcare professionals.
(Not saying they don't deserve it, they absolutely do).
People should wait to see what's in the budget before voting, in my humble opinion only
I got mine through today too, didn't get a chance to look at it yet. I'll have a look over the weekend. I'll most likely be voting in favour though.
More misunderstanding of facts, figures and statistics.
Question for you: Do you understand the difference between pay (i.e salary) and earnings?
If you do, why are you posting stats about earnings in a post about PS pay?
The average pay in the public sector could actually fall over the next 18 months even with the pay raises due to the demographics i.e. the civil service in particular is still top heavy in terms of those approaching retirement. A significant surge in retirements along with recruitment of young staff on much lower wages is a very real possibility.
Another reason for not relying on averages for comparative analysis without looking behind the figures.
Just joining the civil service this year (still on panel), if the proposed pay increase were to pass through, when would they be implemented? Thanks.
November or December. Most likely December.
Payrolls are usually completed for November/December by mid November and can't be amended. It would have to be input late October/early November to get it before Christmas.
Not true and the civil service does not use monthly payrolls anyway.
I worked in the NSSO payroll helpdesk and faced a number of calls from new starters and the like on emergency tax whose tax couldn't be fixed as the payrun was done for all of December in November. Individual weeks were done in advance, not monthly. You don't have to believe it.
It’s very true that payroll is done in advance for December
If it is actually the case that there is a significant number of people nearing retirement , would it not make sense for the government to incentivise early retirement and recruit younger ( and cheaper ) people ?
Agreed. For Christmas, new year payrolls are done well in advance to facilitate the departments closure and the banks. Added go that new starts where instructions weren't sent in time, emergency tax.. the list goes on... And on and on. 🤣
Not to mention the tears when pay isn't there and they have rent to pay and children to feed and won't be paid for a month...and it's your fault. 😱
twould make sense for everyone to retire, that would actually put payroll down to zero.
do you see any problems with that plan at all
I hope so. God, I hope so.
The major issue is talent and knowledge retention. We know now that if you try to hire people in to the Public Service and offer them 50 percent less of what they would get for doing the same job in the Private Sector it doesn't end well. I'm talking about Clerical Officers getting 25K per annum for example yet in a private company for doing the same job such as data entry they could be on 35-40k.
I don’t think there is a need for the government to intervene and incentivise additional retirements. Spacing it out and ensuring there is sufficient replacement staff on board would make more sense, especially as the economy is in a reasonably good state.
The last incentivised early retirement scheme left so many gaps that services has to be cut to the bare minimum although there was a recruitment embargo in force then also.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/age-profile-of-the-civil-service-a-significant-business-risk-report-finds-1.4373930
new heo is on give or take 50k
retiring heo is retiring on give or take 70k, pension from coffers less coap is 23k.
youve replaced an experienced resource with a new joiner to a role for a nett saving of .... minus 3 grand in year 1, and rising
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