How do people feel about this one? Will it be short and sweet?
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https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121425200/#Comment_121425200
Edit
The people at the top are already on better wages that everyone else doing the same job as them and under the current offer they'd get 3.5% this year too. People in the private sector in the majority of cases get no increases if they are at the top of their wage scale/band.
I'm curious as to why you took a job in the public sector when you could have got twice as much in the private sector?
I’d say 6% over 2 years would be accepted. It’s very likely to happen imo.
Yes 30 years or so and we still refuse anything resembling high rise buildings. In addition we fail to invest in transport infrastructure. The issue of inflation is worldwide but poor governance has made the impact of such significantly greater in Ireland. Increasing pay which is taxed at over 50% anyways is just putting a plaster over the cracks.
Various reasons but having my job taking away from during the lockdowns was an eye opener that security in your role is important.
I THINK 7 OR 8 over 2 tys
To be fair the current offer was 5% + existing 2% promised for 2022 so 7% over 2 years - max it will be is an extra 1% imo - 8% over 2 years (i.e. an additional 3% this year and next on top of the current increases) is good imo
8% would be a good enough outcome. Running to stand still though with inflation. Varadkar and the government seem to understand this too.
We've already received 1 of the 2% for this year back in February haven't we?
So its 1 plus 5 not 2 plus 5 as the government have been claiming.
The people at the top are already on better wages that everyone else doing the same job as them
Yes and? They also have more experience and knowledge, organisational memory is vital. Something the civil service will find out over the next 5-10 years as there is an absolutely massive "bubble" building up of people who wil retire during that period. Actually since covid there seems to be a trend of people retiring a lot earlier than they could have, life is for living after all so if you can afford to retire, why not?
Are you seriously claiming that private sector workers hitting the top of a pay band will never get an increase again? No general across the board increases?
You're right, but it is still a 1% pay rise that has been received this year so needs to be included when calculating the total pay rise received over the period.
When including previous pay agreements don't forget that inflation was 5.5% last year.
Everyone's perspective on these pay talks is different. My OH works in the education sector and her union are still negotiating the 1st Feb 1% pay rise which means no one has got anything! 🤔
A bit like some of the nurses who are still awaiting their pandemic bonus!
They just need to get on with the talks now, the rise will never match inflation and I don't expect it too either. But any raise would be a help, we will take what we get at this point to keep things moving.
The annual average rate of inflation in 2021 was 2.4%
https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/cpi/consumerpriceindexdecember2021/
You are each referring to two different inflation metrics.
What you say is factually true, but everyone's cost of living is different. If you're going to address cost of living issues, then an AP with two kids renting an apartment in or near Dublin has much bigger cost of living issues than a CO living with his Mammy and working in Athlone or Portlaoise or Wexford.
Cost of living issues aren't directly related to salary, in either direction.
Yeah but the CO is probably living with their mammy as they can't afford their own place. They have a bigger cost of living crisis in your example surely.
Maybe. Or they might have inherited the house from their granny and be living in the lap of luxury, with mammy paying all the bills for them. Who knows.
I'm not sure you can structure a pay increase to cover cost of living. They could be working on cost of living issues, including rent, energy costs transport and more as policy issues.
Why havnt the parties involved got together yet, why the delay?
Not to be addressed in this round of pay talks, but longer term i'd like to see the grade structure re-examined. For example and primarily, I think the AO/HEO grades could be amalgamated. As far as I am aware, in a lot of Departments AOs and HEOs are now completely interchangeable. The AO is a yellow pack HEO for the first few years.
A lot of the current AOs wouldn't get through a HEO interview. Also the AO grade has a 2.1 level 8 or above degree requirement, that can't be retained in a new amalgamated AO/HEO role.
Major depts like dper, finance, health, taoiseach badly need AOs so they will never agree to it being removed and being told to make do with HEOs who potentially might not have any college degree.
so 3.5% when inflation at 7-8+% ..... yep that will sell ..
its 2022 and things are totally different nexr year looks like it is going to be even worse when russia cuts off the gas this winter ..
I don't think they should necessarily be hiring new graduates to AO positions anymore as the role is so interchangeable with HEO now. Departments (outside of the Central one's) appear to be looking for either/or when going to PAS/mobility panels.
In my opinion it should be an amalgamated new grade instead of HEO/AO for mid tier management. No degree required, but similar competencies/experience to current HEO requirements.
Green AOs just out of university going in, getting trained and then quite possibly leaving within two years is not good. I'd be curious to see what the current retention rates on new AOs is. I get the impression most APs want a HEO or an AO who came up through the grades rather then the degree.
If an AO is doing the same job as a HEO or comparable responsibility, then they should be paid the same.
There needs to be a fast track graduate route to attract talent in to the civil service.
Perhaps restricting AOs to the central depts would make most sense to stop yellow packing.
Or the reverse could also be true, and the CO is the one trying to pay rent on a home in Dublin with two kids and all associated costs.
There is no way they could do it. Not unless they're shaked up with an AP ;)
But anyway, probably fuel for a different discussion on another thread, as we know that is not going to happen in this round, so I'll park it for now.
Its all gone very quiet, has it totally stalled?
I imagine both sides are waiting for the other to blink first kind of shite.
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