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Boosters

[Deleted User]

We seem to be going in the direction of boosters for the masses. According to this article from today we will need boosters after six months - https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/pfizer-astrazeneca-covid-vaccine-protection-wanes-within-six-months-study-finds-1.4655759

On the other hand two days ago we have the WHO saying we should not be giving boosters because -

wealthy nations stockpiling the vaccine increases the risk that stronger variants will develop in countries with low inoculation rates.
not only could the hyper infectious delta variant become “more virulent,” but “more potent variants could also emerge” if the virus gets “the chance to circulate in countries with low vaccination coverage,”
furthermore, the WHO director called into question whether booster shots are “effective at all,” a comment that comes days after the organization’s chief scientist Soumya Swaminathan said “data today does not indicate that boosters are needed.” Ghebreyesus said boosters should only be doled out to people with weak immune systems.

Article here - https://www.forbes.com/sites/jemimamcevoy/2021/08/23/who-leader-pleads-against-booster-shots-questioning-efficacy-and-highlighting-risk-of-more-potent-variants/?sh=1633c496131b

So should we go ahead against the advice of the WHO or not?

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floorpie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845437#Comment_117845437

You said you had a PhD and related papers in a data science topic, to my recollection. Regardless, I and many others in the thread are also scientists, so your experience isn't exceptional or impressive here such that people should specifically engage with you.

In my experience in the field, it's uncommon to attempt to bully people down on points (e.g. the seatbelt analogy) and it's uncommon to lack intellectual humility. Engaging with such people is a waste of time.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845529#Comment_117845529

No one is bullying anyone. That poster stated my analogy was flawed, as have you, and I constructively replied each time explaining why I believed that was not the case.

Again, I will ask you to demonstrate how my posts are childish.

floorpie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845548#Comment_117845548

Again, I will ask you to demonstrate how my posts are childish.

This is what I mean. It's labouring a minor point whose importance isn't clear, which forces people to disengage. Not because they've "given up", but rather because it's tiresome and fruitless. The repetitive name calling earlier in the thread by Glasso is another example.

I think your data science hat is more useful here than your debating hat.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845664#Comment_117845664

So, you're saying that constructive debate is childish? If someone says something I disagree with, or says my point is not valid, I should just say "ok fair enough"? On a discussion forum? That poster went from saying my analogy was bad to saying "it's just hypothetical anyway". Clearly, my responses were not only not childish, but made sense.

You say that I'm labouring a minor point when I ask you to explain why I'm childish. So I should also just let you insult my posting style and say "ok fair enough" to that too?

There's certainly something childish about some of the last few posts, but it's certainly not my posts.

[Deleted User]

Just heard an interesting quote from an infectious disease expert being interviewed “ The description of Covid as a pandemic must now be qualified, it is a pandemic in the unvaccinated, they are now the people getting sick, dying, and spreading the disease”

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845664#Comment_117845664

You spend your time making up your own conclusions to studies and cherry picking those that align slightly with your viewpoints, it's unsurprising that you can't meaningfully engage with people as you get shown up time and time again.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845739#Comment_117845739

This has been the case for the last while, depending on the country and vax rates.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845760#Comment_117845760

Very much so, particularly here in Ireland, but it was the conciseness and indisputable way it was stated that hit home. Unvaccinated people are going to have to bear the brunt of the effects, and blame for Covid going forward.

Marty Bird

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845739#Comment_117845739

Just like earlier on this year they said the fit and healthy are the vulnerable now, what a load nonsense, then on to the children.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845795#Comment_117845795

What does this mean?

And just before you answer, are you disputing what the expert in Infectious diseases said about Covid now effecting primarily unvaccinated people?

Risteard81

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117841671#Comment_117841671

Just living a normal life perhaps you goose.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845812#Comment_117845812

Doesn't always work out that normal in comparison to those how did get a vaccine tho...

https://www.cnet.com/health/99-of-covid-deaths-are-now-of-unvaccinated-people-experts-say/

Marty Bird

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845803#Comment_117845803

Exactly what it says. I’m not disputing what he says, but what needs to be disclosed is how many of the unvaccinated are going to hospital with breathing difficulties and or pneumonia like symptoms, so we can get a true picture of what the virus is going to these people.

I think this info is vitally important to see the true impact of this virus.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845907#Comment_117845907

I don’t wish to be pedantic Marty, but it helps when you write coherent sentences.

What does severity of the symptoms matter if most hospitalisations are unvaccinated? A quick google throws up quite a few recent articles relating to the vaccination status of those hospitalised in Ireland and particularly those in ICU.

Marty Bird

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845926#Comment_117845926

it matters a lot to see what the virus Is actually doing as opposed to saying that people are in hospital because they’re not vaccinated, they could be in for a farming accident and test positive.

floorpie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845926#Comment_117845926

The infectious disease "expert" is wrong. It is clear now, if weren't obvious from the trials, that vaccines don't prevent infection or transmission. They reduce the likelihood of symptoms arising from infection, from a miniscule percentage to a slightly more miniscule percentage.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117845965#Comment_117845965

Stop spreading lies again, if you're anti-vax at least own it rather than sneak around promoting FUD. You're 100% wrong and have been shown this numerous times.

ceadaoin.

Yeah, a pandemic of the unvaccinated. Except for over the past few weeks (just off the top of my head) Jesse Jackson (hospitalised), Lindsay Graham, Melissa Joan hart, a former newsreader from my local station (who sadly died), golfer Patrick Reed (hospitalised), Oscar de la Hoya (hospitalised), Hillary Duff, Reba McIntyre, Texas governor Gregg Abbott (who said he'd had a booster), a couple of members of Kiss, the guy from slipknot, one of the Foo Fighters and more.

I guess covid really is smart and only targets fully vaccinated famous people. It definitely can't be happening on a widespread population scale among normal people too. No way.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846717#Comment_117846717

Its the reality.

We are all going to get covid.

A vaccine however will take the edge off the infection.

Some people will still die.

Why is covid so dangerous to humans?

its novelty.

A vaccine makes it not novel.

If you want to face covid, do it with a vaccine.

Nobody can hide from covid indefinitely.

ohnohedidnt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846735#Comment_117846735

That's an accurate representation of where the vaccine goalposts currently lie.

The vaccine basically determines personal outcomes only, so there's little point worrying about anybody else's vaccine status.

Lumen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846820#Comment_117846820

That would be basically very convenient for you, if it was true.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846820#Comment_117846820

And that is because the overwhelming majority of non-vulnerable adults are selfless and became fully vaccinated and therefore hospitals are not being overcrowded resulting in restrictions being eased. If every non-vulnerable person was instead as selfish as you are, that would not be where the goalposts currently are.

godzilla1989

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846888#Comment_117846888

If they are non-vulnerable why would they be in hospital?

They are vulnerable then

That’s an even worse statement than seat belts = vaccines 😂

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846925#Comment_117846925

You don't understand the slightest thing about statistics do you?

Why did we not fully open up as soon as all of the vulnerable were fully vaccinated?

godzilla1989

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846832#Comment_117846832

Why is not true?

If vaccines work, then there is no need for vaccine passes

If vaccines don’t work, then there is no need for vaccine passes

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846925#Comment_117846925

Are you vulnerable? It's an answer you'll only be able to answer if you've already had a high viral load dose of SARS-COV2 already.

Luckily most other people understand the seatbelt analogy.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846888#Comment_117846888

You really believe that unvaccinated non-vulnerable adults would be the reason hospitals become overcrowded? The stats from since March 2020 do not show this. The vulnerable are overwhelmingly the ones hospitalised and dying from Covid. Over 5000 deaths here so far, fifty five of them under 45 years old. I would really like to know how many of the fifty five had underlying health conditions. I believe in the UK 78% of Covid deaths have underlying health conditions.

ohnohedidnt

There's a lot of virtue signalling going on around here about why people took the vaccine, it's clear from a lot of people's posts they did it because they are afraid of Covid, and rightly so, some people should be, but it's not out of some heroics for the greater good of society.

The goalposts are moving because the vaccine is failing, the data is clear, countries with very high vaccine rates are seeing surges in cases, it didn't work as expected, it's more of therapeutic really, in the sense that all it reliably does is prevents serious illness in the small fraction of people who would have otherwise experienced serious illness.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846967#Comment_117846967

You are free to do the maths if you wish to prove me wrong.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117846987#Comment_117846987

The main reason I got vaccinated, and the main reason why the friends I asked got vaccinated, was so that society could return to normal as fast as possible.

And your second paragraph will not receive a response from me as it's absolute nonsense.