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Does your club charge members admin fees for casual rounds?

Fourright

So just got notified that our club is now going to be charging €7 if we use the golf Ireland app for casual rounds, to cover "admin fee". Maybe i am missing something but the app appears to calculate everything for you, so not sure what admin fees the club have?

Our weekend comps are generally €7 to enter. Mid week are €5.

So admin fee for casual round using the app is more expensive than mid week comps? Explain that one to me? Pure money grab by the club.

Numbers in comps have been dropping in fairness but that in part is down to very poor prizes if you feature in the prizes. Example i know one member that won a weekend comp with over 100 participants and got €50.

I was hearing nothing but positive feedback on the app from members but now a vast majority are not happy. All the work Golf Ireland put in and now clubs are undoing the work of bringing golf into the the modern arena/

So wondering are any other clubs doing this and charging for using the golf Ireland App?

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Fourright

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117728970#Comment_117728970

Agree club is probably losing revenue but people are playing casual rounds over comps because the prizes for comps are terrible. Club taking to big of a cut from the entry fees.

Seve OB

its a joke, I certainly wouldn't be happy about it.... and I don't even play any casual rounds in my club! It just leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

I'm not sure writing to the GUI will do anything though. maybe ask the club to explain why they are doing it? I've no doubt there is some kind of admin, how much I don't know as I'm not involved at that end. But as the GI app does the business itself, surely it can't be much more than a few computer clicks and they hardly have to sign off every individual score?

would also be interested to know what they would do if you entered a qualifying round at another course through the GUI app... do you have to pay for that also?... similar question to the posted who said you have to return cards for qualifying scores... what happens if you are playing an away course?

if the club have a problem with people playing casual rounds now instead of entering the comp, there is an easy fix for that. if you are playing on Saturday or Sunday or whatever day between the competition hours... then you enter the comp!

If you are playing a quick 9 with your pal on Tuesday evening, then no way in the world should you be charged an admin fee.

finglashoop

play casual rounds very rarely

wouldnt be paying for it either. i jus wouldnt enter a score if they wanted money

slave1

Sounds like Ryanair add on tactics

Rikand

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117737203#Comment_117737203

Because I cant edit the post, I will just quote the whole post. With regard to admin, I just gather up all the cards that were submitted for casual rounds once a week, check to make sure they were added in correctly and try to see if I can see people who didnt submit a card. it takes me about an hour in the evening but I'd be fairly handy on computers. Maybe for other handicap committees with people playing several hundreds or thousands of casual rounds in a week it would take longer. I would wager on average we have about 100 casual rounds played each week, so probably not a lot. I certainly won't be asking our members to pay money for my time. I feel like its just a part of the job that I signed up for

CalamariFritti

Can you not submit a casual round without any involvement of the club? 'Create scorecard' on the golf ireland app?

Rikand

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117740341#Comment_117740341

You can. But when the score is submitted, it appears on the handicap login app for the club through clubireland, so if they want to charge you they can look through that. They are certainly creating more admin work for themselves doing it this way

Seve OB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117740297#Comment_117740297

For a Saturday or Sunday comp do you look at every single card to make sure all the entries are correct?

why bother, especially with the 20 pointers or the casual ones which are not getting prizes?

is there no moving forward with the times and just accepting a score which was entered on a computer/phone/app and also signed off/attested by someone else?

Rikand

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117741207#Comment_117741207

not my department. That's what the competitions committee does. I'm on the handicap side of things so I'm only interested in the casual cards

Rikand

Casual rounds dont get prizes in our place. Do casual rounds get prizes in yours ?

Rikand

Maybe I'm too proactive on the handicap side of things but I feel if you're going to do a job, i might aswell try to do it right.

Seve OB

No of course not. Sorry for confusion, I just meant that you probably really only need to double check the prize winners.

I was just saying that if someone puts their score on the app for a casual round (which also gets attested and signed off by a marker) does it really need to be vouched against an actual card?

DuckSlice

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117742321#Comment_117742321

If there is Golfer of the Year points on offer for the top 20 for example you should be checking those cards too.

blue note

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117741926#Comment_117741926

Fair play for putting in that effort, I'd be amazed if every club does.

I do think clubs have a responsibility to check that those who declare that they're submitting a score do so. If not, they're gaming the system (possibly unintentionally). But as regards putting in the round correctly, I'd be leaving it up to them on golf Ireland. I'd strongly encourage people to do it that way rather than submitting cards for casual rounds. But for the odd older member who doesn't want to use the app, then the club should be facilitating them with manual entry. But I'd be hoping for only a few of these each week.

Is there any reprimand at the moment for people not submitting cards? I'd like to see this, even though the ones not submitting the cards are the ones who want to keep their handicap artificially low. So not a problem for competitions bar the elite ones. And they're nothing to do with me.

Seve OB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117743143#Comment_117743143

Fair point but that’s probably only the top 10 in about 10 comps a year so not excessive.

prawnsambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117742321#Comment_117742321

There are a number of reasons why you should check all cards as a h/cap sec.

To make sure it's completed correctly and signed - This is of benefit to the member because if they're filling out cards incorrectly and don't know, it could affect them badly in a big competition or away.
To make sure the score on the computer matches that on the card - People often mistype a score and could be doing themselves out of a prize. Also could affect their handicap. Entering an 8 instead of a 3 for example. This happens quite frequently.
For the h/cap sec, it gives a general picture on how members are playing and scoring. Keeping in touch with their scores/progression is useful from a handicap monitoring perspective.

KevH1984

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117742321#Comment_117742321

I'm the comp sec in our club and we only ask players to submit their score via our app and not return the cards. This has been the way since Covid kicked off and seems to be working well for us. Obviously during the pandemic handling cards of others poses it's own risk. Personally I'm delighted as it cuts out lots of time spent checking cards. Our captains is this weekend with a 9 hole play off Sunday evening so there would have been lots of pressure to check cards in a short window to ensure all was right. I think the app based way of returning is definitely the way forward in my opinion, it is 2021 after all. Golf is a game of integrity, we trust all play by the rules on the course so we have to trust all will submit a score honestly. Obviously players are asked to double check and have their marker double check prior to submission of the score. Any discrepancies should be noticed at that point and rectified.

Franks12

Apologies for opening up an old thread but just got an email from club saying they are charging €8 now for casual rounds posted on Golf Ireland app. Are most golf clubs doing this now?

spacecoyote

No talk of it at all in my home club, but we're still fairly jammed on comp days and haven't seen any drop off in fees coming in I'd imagine.

Maybe your membership has seen a large drop off in people entering comps?

blue note

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118946286#Comment_118946286

Did they say why? I'd be fairly annoyed about that. Not annoyed enough to do anything about it, but I'd be privately annoyed.

Franks12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118946583#Comment_118946583

No mention of the reason. Sundays are as busy as ever for the competition day so revenue cant be dramatically lower than previously.

I always made sure to declare the casual round when playing outside of competition so that my handicap can be as accurate as possible but with €8 per round I certainly wont now.

callaway92

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118946833#Comment_118946833

Surely there's nothing stopping you just going out and submitting a casual round without saying it to your club?

Golfhead65

I think the answer is in your query as I believe most clubs should have an admin fee to discourage casual rounds for handicap purposes and try encourage people to play in club comps, sure isnt that the reason for joining a club

srfc d16

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118951523#Comment_118951523

It's not the main reason I joined a club anyway. I joined to remove green fees and be able to play as often as my time allows me to. I think if this was brought in at my own club I would most likely leave

Franks12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118951523#Comment_118951523

I dont agree with your statement at all.

I am lucky that I can make time on a Sunday to play a round in the competition but there are many people who are unable to play in competition on a Sunday due to work/family commitments. Would you prefer that this cohort of members are discouraged from playing casual rounds for handicap purposes and as such continue to play from inaccurate handicaps, solely because they can not make the time for a Sunday comp? And no, I didn't join a club solely to play club competitions - I joined so that I can play golf whenever I want and at whatever time I want.

slave1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118951523#Comment_118951523

I think you are correct and if so what is the point of the WHS?

And no, playing competitions is not the reason for joining a club, lots of folk join clubs just to play golf and have zero interest in competitions.

There's been a mini-exodus out of a local club here when at the AGM they introducted an Admin fee for folk playing casual rounds for WHS purposes, talk about a backfire.

OEP

My club has a rule, or had last year anyway, that you can't enter casual rounds on the same day there's a competition. I think that's reasonable enough - I've never actually entered a casual round as I enter lots of comps so I don't know the ins and outs of it - e.g. if you only have time for 9 holes, can you enter 9 hole casual on the same day as a comp. I also don't know how strictly it has been followed

Franks12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118952266#Comment_118952266

That's a great rule and should suit everyone.

DuckSlice

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118952266#Comment_118952266

Yea that is a good idea, but some clubs run comps over multiple days. We run Friday-Sunday, so if i enter comp Friday i cant do a casual on Sunday. I would be interested to know the ins and outs of this as Casual rounds are switched off in my club to encourage people to enter comps as they think casual rounds are affecting competition entry, which is not backed up by any data.

OEP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118955725#Comment_118955725

We don't have multiple day comps - only the Captain's and President's

Can they not have it that once you've played in the competition, you can enter casual rounds the days after that? Does that mean that you can only play one competition a weekend?