RobbieTheRobber wrote: » I haven't argued any such thing. What a ridiculous post. Go and quote a single post of mine saying any of those things. Such nonsense.
RobbieTheRobber wrote: » Sorry I'm confused now. When you say it's the quran saying it, what are you referring to?
jmreire wrote: » Robbie, educate yourself a bit...try reading the Quran sometime, then you won't be so confused. According to Muslims, it has all the answers to any question you might have about Life, from the cradle to the grave, and everything in between. And that means everything and every situation, from here to eternity.
Fandymo wrote: » Last sentence Robbie. And yet you STILL haven’t given an answer to any of the questions. Which would lead any normal person to come to the conclusion that you aren’t totally against any of the above. Edit: we aren’t taking about nukes though, are we Robbie. Your deflector shields are at minimal power if that’s the best you can come up with.
Freight bandit wrote: » We'll end up with anomic societies with little social cohesion...it won't be an improvement on the society we had
MikeOxsgreen wrote: » Baby steps. Is it vile to stone people?
RobbieTheRobber wrote: » You tell me Mike. Its your question. So what is your answer? What if the person being stoned has committed rape of children or murder. Is it still vile in your opinion then to stone to death the person found guilty of such crimes.
MikeOxsgreen wrote: » I think its vile to stone someone, let's keep it simple, for the likes of adultery. What do you think? Simple yes or no...
RobbieTheRobber wrote: » I am an opponent of all forms of capital punishment. The Christian Bible however says adultery is punishable by death by stoning. See leviticus below. Leviticus 20:10 10 “If a man commits adultery with the wife of[a] his neighbor, both the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death
bubblypop wrote: » This seems to be a ridiculous line of questioning going on here now. Pretty sure the majority of people don't agreeing with stoning people as punishment, or throwing gays from really high places or marrying children. What is the point of this?
MikeOxsgreen wrote: » Ironically I'm not entirely. But certain activities are vile. Like stoning someone. For adultery. But you don't view stoning as vile. Imagine being the person who can't condemn stoning someone for adultery as a vile act. (Levicitus has some bat sh1t insane (and vile) instructions. But so what. Unless you're trying to suggest all Christians are vile, which is either bigoted).
RobbieTheRobber wrote: » JM please stop the lying about me and focus on what I have said and not what you feel I have said. As for the bible I am merely pointing out the majority religion of this country has d the same issues you seem so offended by in the Quran. If those things you say are in the Quran are in it and you are offended by it then surely you should be simarly offended by their presence in the Christian bible? Is the Christian Bible vile?
MikeOxsgreen wrote: » Both the Quran and Bible have vile, backward and downright evil texts. They also have some inspirational and beautiful passages. So to your question, are either vile? No. They're inert books of ideas. It's what people do with those ideas is the problem. But it's not a defence to hold a vile opinion, or view an act as vile because of another faith's texts. This seems to be your goto position. You either view stoning a human to death for adultery as vile or you don't. It's a binary choice and it's glaringly obvious you can't bring yourself to answer, as we all know the implications.
MikeOxsgreen wrote: » Are you? Pretty sure...? You can not agree with something, but would you regard it as vile?
WrenBoy wrote: » Im not a big bible expert or anything but even I know the Old testament sure has some brutal stuff in it as it was for people living in a brutal time, luckily the Old Testament isn't an authority for christians today as they are told to emulate Jesus in ethic not live by the Old Testament. The Old covenant was completed and replaced by the New with the coming of Jesus. the Quran however is an authority by which muslims are supposed to live by (many don't much like christianity) according to the Quran and hadiths. I wouldn't say they are the same.
RobbieTheRobber wrote: » If its a simple binary choice answer my previous question on stoning that you ignored. Is it vile if a person who commits murder or the rape of children is stoned to death?
RobbieTheRobber wrote: » I don't think that is true WrenBoy. Your belief in Christianity and the Bible may have waned but to devout Christians the Bible is the literal word of their god. Were the commandments not directly etched to stone by their god for moses. Is adultery no longer one of things warned against by their gods 10 main rules of life? "Thou shalt not commit adultery" Jesus reaffirms in the new testament adultery is still a crime under his god and goes further on what adultery is in the book of Matthew. "But I say to you, anyone who looks on a woman to lust after her has committed adultery with her already in his heart." - Matthew 5:28
The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman accused of adultery. They said to Jesus, “Moses commanded us to stone such women. Now what do you say?” The question was a trap. Jesus said, “If any of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her.” They began to go away, one at a time. Jesus told the woman he did not condemn her but added “Go now and leave your life of sin.”
bubblypop wrote: » Yes, pretty sure most people would regard those things as vile, wouldn't you?
jmreire wrote: » According to the Quran:- Women are less than equal to the man. Gay people should be killed by being thrown from a great height. Adulterers should be stoned to death. Thieves should have a hand or foot amputated. Marriage from 6 years on is permitted. Marriages have to be arranged by the Father. So as to your question of what percentage of Muslims hold these views? Might as well ask how many Muslims follow the Quran? because by definition, every Muslim must hold to what is taught in the Quran. But as to how many Muslims actually carry out stoning, amputating of limbs, and killing of Gay's? Certainly its being done, isis / taliban / Iran / Saudi Arabia etc. being noted for it, even in 2021. In the west at any rate, we do not get much of this extreme version of Islam , the stoning amputations etc. ( suicide bombings, beheadings excepted ) But I'm pretty sure that Muslim families' adhere pretty much to everything as laid out in the Quran when it comes to their families and everyday behaviour.
RobbieTheRobber wrote: » Leviticus 24:16 16 Whoever blasphemes the name of the Lord shall surely be put to death. All the congregation shall stone him. The sojourner as well as the native, when he blasphemes the Name, shall be put to death.
While religious texts often give examples both with and without stoning, the Quran does not prescribe stoning as a punishment for any crime, mentioning only lashing as punishment for adultery
jmreire wrote: » Robbie, educate yourself a bit...try reading the Quran sometime
MikeOxsgreen wrote: » Are you asking me or telling me? I'm pretty clear on my position. Others not so. I'm assuming by your above response you include yourself in the "most people" category.
bubblypop wrote: » Of course, I have already said that. I haven't seen anyone say they agree with stoning people, have you? Weird line of questioning, I'm not seeing your point.
WrenBoy wrote: » Yes but with the coming of Jesus you see a move away from prescribing of punishments like stoning for adulterers to the atonement for sins and more the idea of punishment in Hell.
MikeOxsgreen wrote: » Yet you've seen fit to defend someone who can't condemn is as vile. Very strange position, but not out of character.
bubblypop wrote: » This doesn't make any sense? I've seen fit to defend who exactly?
RobbieTheRobber wrote: » That doesn't actually say anything about the punishment only that those without sin should be the ones to cast the first stone. I remember now reading how crusading knights would abstain from baptismal rites until near death so that they could be without sin as they enter heaven. Seems the Christian god loves a loophole.
MikeOxsgreen wrote: » Here you go
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