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COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

Masala

Today being Paddy Day 2020... when do you think we will have a ‘flu jab’ / pill / syrup that we can take to make us immune/ les likely to catch this 19 virus?.

Mod: The purpose of this thread is baked into the title - COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures - it's not a platform to push an anti vaccination agenda. If posters wish to discuss the perceived cons of vaccinations, or push various theories regarding 'the agenda' (whatever that is supposed to mean), open a thread elsewhere on it.

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hmmm

Cork2021 wrote: »

I suppose the 11th of December vaccine plan was in line with the EMA not having a decision until the end of the month.

Moderna signed off for 875,000 doses

What's nearly more important I think at this stage is how quickly they will arrive. We've ordered 2 million Pfizer doses, so that's 1.4 million people. That seems to be very similar to the figure we are told is the total "vulnerable" population

Intuitively I assume that the impact from the first 10% of vaccinations in crowded locations like hospitals & nursing homes with lots of vulnerable people will have a much bigger impact on reducing spread and mortality than the final 10% to get vaccinated. Even the first injection should provide a small bit of extra protection. I'm hopeful that things start to get better faster than we might expect in late Spring as vaccination numbers grow.

brisan

Micky 32 wrote: »

.

I’m sure they’ll be on proposing restrictions for other issues when Covid is gone no doubt.

Well if Tony gets his way alcohol will be the next virus to crush

CruelSummer

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

I guess the journalists should stop asking questions about the vaccines then?

If McConkey is asked about a vaccine his response will be that he hasnt been shown data and cant make conclusions.

Why would you say that? What a peculiar response. McConkey stated last night it would be very ‘helpful’ for the data to be published. He was implying that access wasn’t being given to it. I’m not a supporter of McConkey and just asked about his comments here re data and where it was being shared.
Why is the vaccine argument so supercharged? We should all ask questions especially as all should be done to avoid a Pandemrix type of fall out. I’ve stated before I’m not anti vaccine, I’ve had plenty in my life including yellow fever. But the desire for some to rush out the vaccine and rely solely on it to deal with Covid is my main concern.

ceegee

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Find it strange that the EMA is taking longer than the FDA despite the EMA starting 'rolling reviews'

I'd imagine having to approve the SPC and PIL in 20 odd different languages slows things down slightly. A lot more scope for minor issues that need to be amended.

[Deleted User]

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Find it strange that the EMA is taking longer than the FDA despite the EMA starting 'rolling reviews'

Europe often take longer than FDA for approvals

Cork2021

So adding up all the probable approved vaccines, how many doses will we get in January?

timsey tiger

hmmm wrote: »

What's nearly more important I think at this stage is how quickly they will arrive. We've ordered 2 million Pfizer doses, so that's 1.4 million people. That seems to be very similar to the figure we are told is the total "vulnerable" population

Intuitively I assume that the impact from the first 10% of vaccinations in crowded locations like hospitals & nursing homes with lots of vulnerable people will have a much bigger impact on reducing spread and mortality than the final 10% to get vaccinated. Even the first injection should provide a small bit of extra protection. I'm hopeful that things start to get better faster than we might expect in late Spring as vaccination numbers grow.

If we coud knock out the spread in the health sector in January, that would really take the edge off.

brisan

Pasteur. wrote: »

And do what

Logistics ,that's what they are good at and a proper chain of command
All the things the HSE have proved themselves to be incapable of
The army will be able to get it where it needs to be when it needs to be there

ixoy

CruelSummer wrote: »

But the desire for some to rush out the vaccine and rely solely on it to deal with Covid is my main concern.

But it's not really rushed. All phases so far have been done in the standard fashion and of course that's the role of the EMA here, to confirm that and ensure there's no short cuts taken. The 10 year stuff that we keep seeing elsewhere is false equivalency.

That's the point that needs to be hammered home though - not just on boards, but to a wider public and that's up to the government to inform or maybe even have it an EU level. There aren't shortcuts here taken at a safety level and really, vaccines are the sole way to get out of this mess right now.

brisan

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

I base it on common sense. I think the British are silly for publishing their plans when they haven't got any clue

Cheap sound bites thrown out here by you. What do you base the idea that they could have protected nursing homes and hospitals significantly better?

Do you think nursing homes could have told their staff to move out of their homes and into a hotel where they wouldn't be allowed leave except for work? Do you think nursing homes could have banned 100% of visits including compassionate visits in end of life cases?

That's what protecting nursing homes mean.

There are more people in our hospitals with covid who went into hospital without covid than those that went into hospital with covid
Covid free hospitals ,daily tests for all HCW and nursing home residents, its not rocket science

[Deleted User]

I hope the report on the 11th is public and contains some figures, even if they are provisional.

E.G. we expect to recieve X amount of each vaccine in each month of 2021 and we expect to vaccinate X amount of people in each month

Realistic to expect that or no?

iguana

eigrod wrote: »

I think the easing of restrictions will happen in parallel with the vaccination programme, ie as elderly, vulnerable & front line are vaccinated, things will then be eased and monitored. I think 5-6 months.

Restrictions eased back very significantly in July with no vaccines at all. In spring 2021 as infection and hospitalisation figures go down, possibly after a second winter lockdown in January/February and vaccine roll out starts, restrictions will be eased. But hopefully, as more people are vaccinated, there will be no tightening of restrictions again after each loosening. So I suspect we'll have a much closer to normal life by Easter, with it getting more and more normal in stages every few weeks after that.

ixoy

AdamD wrote: »

I hope the report on the 11th is public and contains some figures, even if they are provisional.

E.G. we expect to recieve X amount of each vaccine in each month of 2021 and we expect to vaccinate X amount of people in each month

Realistic to expect that or no?

I'd hope to see that too but I've a feeling they won't commit to any such targets either out of fear they won't get the shipments then or covering their collective asses in case they bungle it.
Certainly, it's something they should aim for or at least explain why they can't set such goals. Those goals are important for getting public buy in and showing us there's an end in sight - even RTE used the phrase "glimmer of hope" which, for them, is the most positive thing they've said all year around this...

CIARAN_BOYLE

CruelSummer wrote: »

Why would you say that? What a peculiar response. McConkey stated last night it would be very ‘helpful’ for the data to be published. He was implying that access wasn’t being given to it.

McConkey is a scientist. He is well regarded internationally about the topic of vaccines.

If they want to know about vaccines he will be brought on.

However he is a scientist and wont make guesses.

As such he cant really add much to the conversation about vaccines. Everyone knows the way an interview with Mcconkey will go. It's happened a few times already.

Is the vaccine good?

I need data on that. They haven't published any. It would be nice if they did.

Will the vaccine get us back to normal?

Well we need a lot of people vaccinated to get herd immunity. That will take a long time. We still dont have data on how well the vaccine works. It wont be a silver bullet in January or February.

Micky 32

ixoy wrote: »

But it's not really rushed. All phases so far have been done in the standard fashion and of course that's the role of the EMA here, to confirm that and ensure there's no short cuts taken. The 10 year stuff that we keep seeing elsewhere is false equivalency.

That's the point that needs to be hammered home though - not just on boards, but to a wider public and that's up to the government to inform or maybe even have it an EU level. There aren't shortcuts here taken at a safety level and really, vaccines are the sole way to get out of this mess right now.

Because of my work i deal with the public a lot. I’m getting a lot of this “ but it’s rushed and not safe” if i bring up a discussion about the upcoming vaccine. To be honest it’s a bit worrying how misinformed people are about the vaccine. As i said earlier i hope the vaccines prevent people from being contagious aswell as preventing illness because at least people who want normality back will just take the vaccine and the ones who don’t let them stay locked up as far as I’m concerned.

[Deleted User]

Cork2021 wrote: »

I suppose the 11th of December vaccine plan was in line with the EMA not having a decision until the end of the month.

Moderna signed off for 875,000 doses

https://twitter.com/maryeregan/status/1333753291155632130?s=21

Its funny how yesterday the perceived wisdom on here was excoriating our officials for delaying while everyone else was progressing, but it now appears our plan is aligned to the European timelines

Gael23

Is Moderna 2 shots?

CIARAN_BOYLE

Gael23 wrote: »

Is Moderna 2 shots?

Yes.

ShowMeTheCash

I have tuned out of this thread for a few weeks...

Has there been any plan mentioned yet in terms of the roll out?

Gael23

eigrod wrote: »

I think the easing of restrictions will happen in parallel with the vaccination programme, ie as elderly, vulnerable & front line are vaccinated, things will then be eased and monitored. I think 5-6 months.

Would agree with this with rational leadership but not with NPHETin charge

What Username Guidelines

Deleted User wrote: »

Its funny how yesterday the perceived wisdom on here was excoriating our officials for delaying while everyone else was progressing, but it now appears our plan is aligned to the European timelines

We need to try to remember we've been in this for 9 months, in another 9 months we know we'll very likely be in a much better position. At the beginning we had no idea how long it would go on at all, how it would go, etc. I'm sure people are ready for it to be over, but a few weeks delay here and there should be measured in the context of the whole thing. We're close

Gael23

What Username Guidelines wrote: »

We need to try to remember we've been in this for 9 months, in another 9 months we know we'll very likely be in a much better position. At the beginning we had no idea how long it would go on at all, how it would go, etc. I'm sure people are ready for it to be over, but a few weeks delay here and there should be measured in the context of the whole thing. We're close

I don’t want to keep living like this for as long as NPHET will force us to

ixoy

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

We still dont have data on how well the vaccine works. It wont be a silver bullet in January or February.

No it won't be but the overwhelming narrative from somewhere like RTE is that there'll likely never be a silver bullet, that there's no end in sight, etc. There's a fair chance this will be the silver bullet for Christmas 2021, or even Summer 2021, but you'd never get that impression from our state broadcaster.

ShowMeTheCash

ixoy wrote: »

No it won't be but the overwhelming narrative from somewhere like RTE is that there'll likely never be a silver bullet, that there's no end in sight, etc. There's a fair chance this will be the silver bullet for Christmas 2021, or even Summer 2021, but you'd never get that impression from our state broadcaster.

I was thinking the same. Spring - Summer we should see the same down turn in numbers like we do with seasonal flu, I hope some kind of normality may return and we have a window for the roll out spring - summer which effectively means we do not need to go into lockdown come Oct 2021.

It is going to be a long winter!

funnydoggy

ShowMeTheCash wrote: »

It is going to be a long winter!

It's the last push really. This is all so depressing as f*ck, but we got this

Gael23

funnydoggy wrote: »

It's the last push really. This is all so depressing as f*ck, but we got this

It would help to see a plan for rollout along with removal of restrictions. Nit just a wait and see and make it up as we go along approach.

Russman

I think summer '21 is a reasonable expectation for something approaching semi normality. I also think most people accept that.
What I'd hate to see happen or fear might happen, is that we find out Ireland is getting, say, 500k doses of vaccine per month, but we only have the capacity to distribute 100k per month. That would really p1$$ people off I think.

funnydoggy

ShowMeTheCash wrote: »

... summer which effectively means we do not need to go into lockdown come Oct 2021.

It is going to be a long winter!

Adding to this - if we did go into lockdown come October 2021, it would be seen as one of the biggest failures in the history of the state, IMO. It's political suicide. They want it out, and out quickly

marno21

If other countries, especially counties run by leaders that a large proportion of the public in Ireland perceive as imbeciles, such as the US and the UK, get this done and return to normal before us there will be unrest in this country.

Absolutely no excuse and no reason not to throw the kitchen sink at getting this done ASAP. It’s costing the country a small fortune and it’s demoralising the country rapidly.

The last lockdown just in PUP payments cost half the projected cost of the Dublin MetroLink, for one 6 week lockdown!! And that’s just PUP, let alone all the other costs involved.

funnydoggy

marno21 wrote: »

If other countries, especially counties run by leaders that a large proportion of the public in Ireland perceive as imbeciles, such as the US and the UK, get this done and return to normal before us there will be unrest in this country.

Absolutely no excuse and no reason not to throw the kitchen sink at getting this done ASAP. It’s costing the country a small fortune and it’s demoralising the country rapidly.

The last lockdown just in PUP payments cost half the projected cost of the Dublin MetroLink, for one 6 week lockdown!! And that’s just PUP, let alone all the other costs involved.

Great point. I don't claim to know the logistics of things but surely they can flake these vaccines around like nobody's business sooner rather than later when other countries are doing it?