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COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

Masala

Today being Paddy Day 2020... when do you think we will have a ‘flu jab’ / pill / syrup that we can take to make us immune/ les likely to catch this 19 virus?.

Mod: The purpose of this thread is baked into the title - COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures - it's not a platform to push an anti vaccination agenda. If posters wish to discuss the perceived cons of vaccinations, or push various theories regarding 'the agenda' (whatever that is supposed to mean), open a thread elsewhere on it.

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Russman

Goldengirl wrote: »

Not suggesting GPs should be involved in anything except referring their high risk patients ..I think you have misread my posts .

Apologies, I probably did.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Russman wrote: »

Thanks,

Ohh I know there are other groups etc., I just wanted to get an idea of the numbers.

I belive it might be 31k in nursing homes.

25k in private nursing homes and 6k in public nursing homes or viceversa.

stephenjmcd

Small piece on the vaccine task force in the Independent today essentially the job of MacCraith is to make sure the HSE and dept of health don't make a mess.

"Former DCU president Professor Brian MacCraith will convene a meeting of the Government's vaccine task force this week and told RTÉ yesterday a strategy for inoculation will be dealt with "urgently and comprehensively".

One senior government figure sees Prof MacCraith's role as keeping the HSE and the Department of Health on their toes. Another insider involved in many of the key discussions taking place in recent weeks optimistically predicts: "This will be all over by the summer. We'll be talking about something else."

jackboy

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Small piece on the vaccine task force in the Independent today essentially the job of MacCraith is to make sure the HSE and dept of health don't make a mess.

"Former DCU president Professor Brian MacCraith will convene a meeting of the Government's vaccine task force this week and told RTÉ yesterday a strategy for inoculation will be dealt with "urgently and comprehensively".

One senior government figure sees Prof MacCraith's role as keeping the HSE and the Department of Health on their toes. Another insider involved in many of the key discussions taking place in recent weeks optimistically predicts: "This will be all over by the summer. We'll be talking about something else."

Will the HSE take any notice of him though? They may treat him with the same disdain as they do the government. At the end of the day there will be no consequences for the HSE if there are issues but MacCraith will be hung out to dry.

Russman

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Small piece on the vaccine task force in the Independent today essentially the job of MacCraith is to make sure the HSE and dept of health don't make a mess.

"Former DCU president Professor Brian MacCraith will convene a meeting of the Government's vaccine task force this week and told RTÉ yesterday a strategy for inoculation will be dealt with "urgently and comprehensively".

One senior government figure sees Prof MacCraith's role as keeping the HSE and the Department of Health on their toes. Another insider involved in many of the key discussions taking place in recent weeks optimistically predicts: "This will be all over by the summer. We'll be talking about something else."

You know, with the right bounce of the ball, I can see this being almost true.
If AZ/Oxford comes through and maybe even J&J in the New Year, along with Pfizer and a small bit of Moderna, potentially we could be vaccinating 400k/500k adults per month. Six or seven months of that and we’d have the back of it broken.

nannerbenahs

Why is everyonme here so sure about the Pfizer vaccine?
Pfizer is the second-largest drug and biotech company in the world and the fourth-highest earner of vaccine revenues. It has seen a 7% increase in its share value this year. However, though it claims to be a standard-bearer for “quality, safety and value,” it has a corporate rap sheet a mile long, routinely mired in controversies involving alleged price-fixing, bribery, kickbacks, tax avoidance, regulatory misdirection and other unsavory practices and it has also repeatedly paid fines for environmental violations at its research and manufacturing plants.
It had to pay the largest-ever criminal fine at the time — $2.3 billion — for fraudulent and illegal promotion of four drugs in 2009
In 2016, British regulators levied a 106 million dollar fine for gross overcharging on its anti epilepsy drug which was responsible for a one year / one drug 60 million dollar national health service increased spend.
Have we forgotten 2009 and the swine flu vaccine swindle? And let´s not forget the 700 plus (30 in Ireland) young people who acquired life long narcolepsy. Dr Holohan was in charge then too.

stephenjmcd

Russman wrote: »

You know, with the right bounce of the ball, I can see this being almost true.
If AZ/Oxford comes through and maybe even J&J in the New Year, along with Pfizer and a small bit of Moderna, potentially we could be vaccinating 400k/500k adults per month. Six or seven months of that and we’d have the back of it broken.

Yeah was thinking about it myself. When other EU countries like Spain and Germany have plans to have the majority vaccinated by then why shouldn't we aim to do the same given our population size.

Now I find the UK plan slightly too ambitious saying April, but I dont see a reason why we couldn't aim to have a large amount of the population vaccinated by say June / July

Necro

nannerbenahs wrote: »

Why is everyonme here so sure about the Pfizer vaccine?
Pfizer is the second-largest drug and biotech company in the world and the fourth-highest earner of vaccine revenues. It has seen a 7% increase in its share value this year. However, though it claims to be a standard-bearer for “quality, safety and value,” it has a corporate rap sheet a mile long, routinely mired in controversies involving alleged price-fixing, bribery, kickbacks, tax avoidance, regulatory misdirection and other unsavory practices and it has also repeatedly paid fines for environmental violations at its research and manufacturing plants.
It had to pay the largest-ever criminal fine at the time — $2.3 billion — for fraudulent and illegal promotion of four drugs in 2009
In 2016, British regulators levied a 106 million dollar fine for gross overcharging on its anti epilepsy drug which was responsible for a one year / one drug 60 million dollar national health service increased spend.
Have we forgotten 2009 and the swine flu vaccine swindle? And let´s not forget the 700 plus (30 in Ireland) young people who acquired life long narcolepsy. Dr Holohan was in charge then too.

Mod:

You seem intent on ignoring the mod warning in the OP.

Do not post here again

nannerbenahs

Necro wrote: »

Mod:

You seem intent on ignoring the mod warning in the OP.

Do not post here again

Mod:

* Incoherent ramblings snipped*

Banned

[Deleted User]

nannerbenahs wrote: »

*Mod snip*

There's a conspiracy theory forum for these type of paranoid ravings.

froog

sure is a lot of headbangers around recently.

Strumms

jackboy wrote: »

Will the HSE take any notice of him though? They may treat him with the same disdain as they do the government. At the end of the day there will be no consequences for the HSE if there are issues but MacCraith will be hung out to dry.

MacCraith hugely revered in education anyway for his contributions and leadership even beyond education...

A bit more about him...

https://www.dcu.ie/president/presidents-office-professor-brian-maccraith

He’s very much a ‘can do, will do’ guy. His name as reverberates in DCU is extremely positive amongst students, and staff alike.

froog

Strumms wrote: »

MacCraith hugely revered in education anyway for his contributions and leadership even beyond education...

A bit more about him...

https://www.dcu.ie/president/presidents-office-professor-brian-maccraith

He’s very much a ‘can do, will do’ guy. His name as reverberates in DCU is extremely positive amongst students, and staff alike.

i'm sure he's great at what we does but what does he know about managing a large scale vaccination program?

Beanybabog

Miike wrote: »

70-80k nurses. 20-25k doctors. NHI claim there is 25k nursing home residents.

Now what about the people who are at home not included in those numbers plus all the other healthcare workers

I imagine they’ll have to prioritise certain types of healthcare workers. From what has happened to date I imagine people working in any capacity in a nursing home will need to be first in line.

Russman

froog wrote: »

i'm sure he's great at what we does but what does he know about managing a large scale vaccination program?

That’s fair comment.
You’d imagine that he would have the delegation skills and experience, and the knowledge to know what he doesn’t know, to be able to be the
lead man. It’s essentially a big logistics operation, albeit with very specific requirements, and I’d guess that he’ll basically have both a blank cheque and the authority to cut through some of the bureaucracy. It really is one of those “the world is watching” moments, in Irish terms anyway.

hmmm

froog wrote: »

i'm sure he's great at what we does but what does he know about managing a large scale vaccination program?

Who does though? We haven't had anything like this in the country for a long time.

We need someone who can get things done, is not afraid to make decisions and will call out people and government if they are getting in the way. They also need to have a thick skin because you're inevitably going to have people complaining.

Strumms

froog wrote: »

i'm sure he's great at what we does but what does he know about managing a large scale vaccination program?

What does anybody know about it though? We are not sitting on a fountain of knowledge regarding this pandemic. He’ll have access to the greatest medical, logistical and wellness minds out there... he’s a majorly intelligent dude with the ability to lead. He has connections everywhere...

froog

hmmm wrote: »

Who does though? We haven't had anything like this in the country for a long time.

We need someone who can get things done, is not afraid to make decisions and will call out people and government if they are getting in the way. They also need to have a thick skin because you're inevitably going to have people complaining.

Strumms wrote: »

What does anybody know about it though? We are not sitting on a fountain of knowledge regarding this pandemic. He’ll have access to the greatest medical, logistical and wellness minds out there... he’s a majorly intelligent dude with the ability to lead. He has connections everywhere...

as has been noted a few times, this is a logistics exercise. someone with high level logistics experience for example would be a good bet. i'm just not sure what the point of putting a university president as the lead is.

[Deleted User]

The main thing we need to sort in the next week is can we store it if we get it? You can figure out it's distribution after that but we need to be sure as supplies are made available to us that we can take them and have somewhere to keep them as the roll-out plan kicks into gear.

It'd be shameful if Pfizer said we have 200 cases, 1,000 doses each ready for ye and we weren't able to take them off their hands straight away.

Russman

Deleted User wrote: »

The main thing we need to sort in the next week is can we store it if we get it? You can figure out it's distribution after that but we need to be sure as supplies are made available to us that we can take them and have somewhere to keep them as the roll-out plan kicks into gear.

It'd be shameful if Pfizer said we have 200 cases, 1,000 doses each ready for ye and we weren't able to take them off their hands straight away.

Just going back and checking that WSJ article that was posted previously, it seems the dimensions of the storage boxes is 15.7” x 15.7” x 22” and each one can hold 5,000 doses. I’ve no idea how big a freezer capable of the low temperatures actually is, but 50 of those boxes doesn’t seem too burdensome. God help us if it is !

JTMan

Moncef Slaoui, chief scientific adviser of the US government’s Operation Warp Speed programme has said:
- Vaccinations likely to begin 11 December or 12 December.
- US to vaccinate 20 million people in December and another 30 million per month thereafter.
- Normality to resume by May 2021.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/22/us-vaccine-expert-life-could-be-back-to-normal-may

Hmmzis

For the Pfizer vaccine you need only dry ice storage and not all that much of it, there are at least three companies (in Ireland) on the first page of google results alone. You can even by dry ice from an online shop for household use. One of the companies has also Pfizer as a customer listed.

Strumms

froog wrote: »

as has been noted a few times, this is a logistics exercise. someone with high level logistics experience for example would be a good bet. i'm just not sure what the point of putting a university president as the lead is.

He’s one of the most revered leaders in education in fact in a broad field of education in the country...

He’s not going to be in it on his own though... he’ll have access to truckloads of expertises, access to logistical experts of which there is an absolute tonne of in this country being an island...

It’s not simply logistical, it’s medical, it’s health and safety there will be a lot of stakeholders... playing a part to ensure success.

ACitizenErased

The US announced today they plan to start vaccinations on December 12th.

Cork2021

Good article by Kingston Mills in the IT

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/will-covid-19-vaccines-pave-path-back-to-normality-1.4414915?mode=amp&fbclid=IwAR3VSR45DwYRcThU-PlwoBYXZ-6nAcsS8_3iV5VT3oQuiZpcFTGrObJMjbs

Deeper Blue

I don't see many "vaccines won't end the pandemic" articles anymore.

I take it the general consensus is that vaccines will provide a return to normality in the next 12 months?

ACitizenErased

El Sueño wrote: »

I don't see many "vaccines won't end the pandemic" articles anymore.

I take it the general consensus is that vaccines will provide a return to normality in the next 12 months?

Many expected the vaccine to have 50-60% protection like the flu vaccine. I think the 90+ for all three we know of has changed things.

Chris_5339762

And once vaccinated people start pushing for the ability to go on holiday without testing, or go to events, and once the absolutely inevitable "you can only go to this event if vaccinated" stories start hitting the press, there will be a completely unstoppable push to get back to normality and over 2021, Covid will slowly fade out of the news... perhaps with the occasional cluster here and there which gets sorted quickly.

timsey tiger

Cork2021 wrote: »

Good article by Kingston Mills in the IT

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/will-covid-19-vaccines-pave-path-back-to-normality-1.4414915?mode=amp&fbclid=IwAR3VSR45DwYRcThU-PlwoBYXZ-6nAcsS8_3iV5VT3oQuiZpcFTGrObJMjbs

"The efficacy was estimated only seven days (Pfizer) or 14 days (Moderna) after the last of two vaccinations."

I didn't think it was a good article. Take this sentence as an example. If it read "The efficacy was estimated from only..." it would be accurate. It is both inaccurate and given what follows in the article seems to imply the vaccines only give short term immunity.

The all or nothing nature of the discussion on sterilising immunity is also not the full picture there either.

Breaston Plants

JTMan wrote: »

Moncef Slaoui, chief scientific adviser of the US government’s Operation Warp Speed programme has said:
- Vaccinations likely to begin 11 December or 12 December.
- US to vaccinate 20 million people in December and another 30 million per month thereafter.
- Normality to resume by May 2021.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/22/us-vaccine-expert-life-could-be-back-to-normal-may

Wow! That's absolutely fantastic news. Very positive.