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COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

Masala

Today being Paddy Day 2020... when do you think we will have a ‘flu jab’ / pill / syrup that we can take to make us immune/ les likely to catch this 19 virus?.

Mod: The purpose of this thread is baked into the title - COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures - it's not a platform to push an anti vaccination agenda. If posters wish to discuss the perceived cons of vaccinations, or push various theories regarding 'the agenda' (whatever that is supposed to mean), open a thread elsewhere on it.

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funnydoggy

Ronan Glynn sh*tting on the vaccine.

Edit: he changes his course halfway through talking. He's optimistic.

TBH I think he's better than Tony.

[Deleted User]

funnydoggy wrote: »

Ronan Glynn sh*tting on the vaccine.

Edit: he changes his course halfway through talking. He's optimistic.

TBH I think he's better than Tony.

To be fair I think he was just trying to temper expectations but realised he was coming across negatively. Hence the change in tone.

funnydoggy

Hardyn wrote: »

To be fair I think he was just trying to temper expectations but realised he was coming across negatively. Hence the change in tone.

I think so too. Hopefully he'll be there more often than Tony to answer questions because he did offer some hope.

Fr_Dougal

It’s time to close the Irish mink farms.

Deeper Blue

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

It’s time to close the Irish mink farms.

Is there something new on the mink thing? I've heard nothing about it for over a week at this stage

Water John

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

It’s time to close the Irish mink farms.

The total of 5. Are they talking to the mink in Denmark? Think it's a red herring.

Marhay70

El Sueño wrote: »

Is there something new on the mink thing? I've heard nothing about it for over a week at this stage

Luke O'Neill last week was saying that because the Pfizer and now, by extension, the Moderna, were MRNA vaccines, it might be possible to adjust the chemical make up to cope with mutations.

Deeper Blue

Marhay70 wrote: »

Luke O'Neill last week was saying that because the Pfizer and now, by extension, the Moderna, were MRNA vaccines, it might be possible to adjust the chemical make up to cope with mutations.

I heard that also, I was just thinking that when someone mentioned it something new had been mentioned. Obviously that's not the case.

[Deleted User]

https://www.jnj.com/johnson-johnson-initiates-second-global-phase-3-clinical-trial-of-its-janssen-covid-19-vaccine-candidate

J&J commencing a second trial. This time involving a two dose regimen.

Hmmzis

Marhay70 wrote: »

Luke O'Neill last week was saying that because the Pfizer and now, by extension, the Moderna, were MRNA vaccines, it might be possible to adjust the chemical make up to cope with mutations.

It's almost trivial to adjust an mRNA vaccine for whatever antigen drift might be happening. Though it would be even better to just add another set of strands to the formulation that cover the target mutations. It's been researched already quite a bit:

https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/82_2020_217 (table 4)

The mRNA construct makes designing and producing multivalent vaccines orders of magnitude simpler. You don't even need separate facilities or equipment for it. Just throw all the plasmid DNA versions in the PCR machine and get a 50-valent flu vaccine out the other end.*

*Though I'm not sure the plasmids themselves can be made this way in a single reactor.

ixoy

RTE have a new headline for us!

BBC is positive:
Covid vaccine shows nearly 95% protection

RTE:
Warning over 'vaccine hesitancy' amid 'promising' Moderna results

Warning is the first key word. Double down with 'hesitancy' to give you pause. And slam it home by wrapping "promising" in quotes to make you question. What a dark headline, when it could be spun much more positively.

theoneeyedman

ixoy wrote: »

RTE have a new headline for us!

BBC is positive:
Covid vaccine shows nearly 95% protection

RTE:
Warning over 'vaccine hesitancy' amid 'promising' Moderna results

Warning is the first key word. Double down with 'hesitancy' to give you pause. And slam it home by wrapping "promising" in quotes to make you question. What a dark headline, when it could be spun much more positively.

I have a question.
What are they claiming when they say 95% effective, does that mean for every 100 people exposed to the virus, that 95 are effectively protected, but that 5 will catch the virus/develop the illness??

Stark

theoneeyedman wrote: »

I have a question.
What are they claiming when they say 95% effective, does that mean for every 100 people exposed to the virus, that 95 are effectively protected, but that 5 will catch the virus/develop the illness??

That was my understanding. For every 100 people in the placebo group who caught the virus, 5 people in the vaccine group caught it.

St.Spodo

Timistry wrote: »

There will definetely be restrictions next summer. There are huge logisitical and storage challenges with administering the Pfizer vaccine. Say if 50% of the population is vacinatied by next summer (very very ambitious) then the other 50% are still as vunerable as they are today. The only way to protect them is to socially distance, limit numbers of people congregating ect.

I want this to be over too but the reality is we are probably about half way towards having our old way of life back.

The most vulnerable 50% of the population make up about 98% of the people who end up in hospital with covid. If they are not getting sick, I can see a situation where most social activity can once again take place by mid 2021, with the exception of large gatherings.

Gael23

St.Spodo wrote: »

The most vulnerable 50% of the population make up about 98% of the people who end up in hospital with covid. If they are not getting sick, I can see a situation where most social activity can once again take place by mid 2021, with the exception of large gatherings.

What would be classed as a large gathering?

Water John

Large indoor gatherings would be the last to open. Lets get the people vaccinated first. That could be a 5/6 month range from start to finish IWT. Mostly to do with availability.

Away With The Fairies

When they say, the vaccine is 90-95% effective, what does that mean? Will it give sterilising immunity?

hmmm

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

When they say, the vaccine is 90-95% effective, what does that mean? Will it give sterilising immunity?

That data isn't available yet, the 94% is protection against the disease and not infection.

I saw an interview earlier with Moncef Slaoui who is the head of operation warp speed in the US. If I heard him right, his view was:
- If they're seeing 94% protection against the disease, it's likely it may provide or come close to providing sterilising immunity. Gottlieb said something similar, that it should reduce the infectious period significantly at a minimum.
- The antibody response will fade over time, so this will probably not provide long-term protection against infection
- However, it will probably provide long-term protection against disease.

Irish Stones

hmmm wrote: »

That data isn't available yet, the 94% is protection against the disease and not infection.

I saw an interview earlier with Moncef Slaoui who is the head of operation warp speed in the US. If I heard him right, his view was:
- If they're seeing 94% protection against the disease, it's likely it may provide or come close to providing sterilising immunity. Gottlieb said something similar, that it should reduce the infectious period significantly at a minimum.
- The antibody response will fade over time, so this will probably not provide long-term protection against infection
- However, it will probably provide long-term protection against disease.

In my opinion, it's weird that no more certainties can be given about this vaccine. Lots of probably, likely, and so on.

Wouldn't these terms instill too many doubts in people who are already unsure about taking this vaccine?
I think that nobody could blame them if they are hesitant.

Le Bruise

Irish Stones wrote: »

In my opinion, it's weird that no more certainties can be given about this vaccine. Lots of probably, likely, and so on.

Wouldn't these terms instill too many doubts in people who are already unsure about taking this vaccine?
I think that nobody could blame them if they are hesitant.

Just to quote hmmm ‘that data isn’t available yet’. It will be soon.

Irish Stones

It seems that there's no deal between EU and Moderna, so each State should seek an own agrement with them

The good news is that Moderna vaccine is not only protective but give sterilising immunity as well.

Thierry12

Irish Stones wrote: »

It seems that there's no deal between EU and Moderna, so each State should seek an own agrement with them

The good news is that Moderna vaccine is not only protective but give sterilising immunity as well.

Sterilising against the disease, not the infection?

Are you contagious with the disease or infection?

Why the difference and separation now?

We have an all in one test since the start.

Le Bruise

Irish Stones wrote: »

It seems that there's no deal between EU and Moderna, so each State should seek an own agrement with them

Where are you seeing this?? EU are currently in the process of securing a deal with Moderna.

[Deleted User]

My main concern is how the vaccine is distributed. I have no doubt that pretty much all developed countries will be able to roll this out, granted there will be mistakes and hiccups along the way but it'll get done.

Developing nations, especially those in a state of flux and instability are going to be a much bigger problem. This is a highly sought after commodity and it is extremely likely that piracy/theft/etc will happen. What then? To attempt to eradicate the virus it will take as many people as possible on the planet to vaccinate but I just can't see it working out like that.

Irish Stones

Le Bruise wrote: »

Where are you seeing this?? EU are currently in the process of securing a deal with Moderna.

Here
https://www.lastampa.it/topnews/primo-piano/2020/11/17/news/magrini-con-moderna-l-accordo-europeo-non-c-e-l-italia-pronta-a-muoversi-da-sola-1.39548272
It's an article on what you call it an unreliable newspaper ridden with fake news coming from uncertified sources.

I know that you don't trust Italian newpapers, but it's what we have here, and it seems to me they're right most of times.

stephenjmcd

Irish Stones wrote: »

It seems that there's no deal between EU and Moderna, so each State should seek an own agrement with them

The good news is that Moderna vaccine is not only protective but give sterilising immunity as well.

Ehh that was announced yesterday, 160m doses contract due to be signed shortly

EU states are collectively part of the EU vaccine purchase fund so they can't go doing their own deals.

And again there is no data available on sterilising immunity with Moderna so not sure where your getting that certainty from.

Edit: the negotiations with Moderna actually finished in August, it was said by EU commission yesterday when announcing CureVac deal yesterday that the Moderna deal would also be formally signed in coming days.

Irish Stones

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Ehh that was announced yesterday, 160m doses.

EU states are collectively part of the EU vaccine purchase fund so they can't go doing their own deals.

And again there is no data available on sterilising immunity with Moderna so not sure where your getting that certainty from.

See my post above. The source is always that fake newspapers that publishes absolute rubbish, but so far it's always proven right for what concerns us.

stephenjmcd

Irish Stones wrote: »

See my post above. The source is always that fake newspapers that publishes absolute rubbish, but so far it's always proven right for what concerns us.

You can throw out that line as much as you want to try and be smart but ultimately the source is wrong on this yet again.

A simple Google will tell you the deal that was done yesterday with curevac during which is was mentioned moderna deal just needs to be formally signed now for 80m doses initially and another 80m once safety trials are passed, preliminary talks finished in August, terms now agreed just the contract to be signed now. As per reuters "discussions were mostly focusing on the legal wording of the contract, but faced no major hurdles on issues such as price or liability."

Irish Stones

stephenjmcd wrote: »

You can throw out that line as much as you want to try and be smart but ultimately the source is wrong on this yet again.

I told you, that's a fake newpapers. Who knows there is behind that website.

stephenjmcd

Irish Stones wrote: »

I told you, that's a fake newpapers. Who knows there is behind that website.

Which you followed by saying they're right most of the time.

I'm not sure how many times you've to be told the opposite before accepting it. Almost a daily occurrence of a post featuring something about Italian media for it very quickly to be proven inaccurate.

A simple Google search tells you all you need to know about the EUs current deals be it Pfizer, CureVac or Moderna.