Pete_Cavan wrote: » Casement (like most things up north) has been distorted by politics and other nonsense, soccer and rugby got stadiums redeveloped and the GAA was happy to take the NI Exe money to get a new stadium for themselves. The plans were over the top and again influenced by other factors (GAA needing a big/better stadium than soccer and rugby, etc.) I don't think you would find anyone who wouldn't say the whole thing is a cluster**** from start to finish but the same situation doesn't exist anywhere else. I really don't thing there are stadiums "many in the pipeline to be redeveloped, most with completely illogical and completely useless plans", that pipeline ended a long time ago. You refer to a plan for CP in Ennis but that is long dead and a more modest redevelopment happened. Nobody is trying to justify the money spent on the stand in McHale Park but unless you have a time machine, we can't change it. This is what I was talking about with the "I wouldn't start from here" answer. Unless you want to knock the lot and rebuild like some Bundesliga stadium, we have live with what we have. In the majority of cases, replacing a stand is all that can realistically achievable in terms of big investment and patching up whatever else is there. Whatever else is generally a terrace and once it complies with basic standards it will suffice. You seem fixated on capacity, in most stadiums the capacity comes from the terraces, demolishing a terrace to rebuild a smaller terrace just to get to a capacity you agree with is madness. The existing capacity costs nothing, even if it isn't used. The likes of Semple and GG have the capacity they have and reducing them would involve tearing down the stadium, the very thing you said you weren't advocating. Both could do with replacing a stand in the next decade but that wouldn't make a big difference to overall capacity. I am saying any new stand should focus on providing top facilities at the expense of capacity but either would still be 40+. If you want to substantially reduce capacity, you are rebuilding almost the entire stadium, that makes absolutely no sense. I think most County Boards have moved on from the big project plans of the Celtic Tiger years, you don't seem to have. You are the one talking about new professional team stadiums which cost €20m. The reality is smaller investments on individual stands are what will be happening going forward.
TCDStudent1 wrote: » One thing that I really dislike about the Gaelic Grounds is the absence of a 'back' on the seats in the stand. I think it might be the only stand I have seen that in. A small thing but irritates the hell out of me!
kksaints wrote: » Most of the main stand in Wexford Park is benches with no back and the uncovered stand is just concrete benches. Some GAA stadiums do not provide much in the way of comfort with regards to seats.
kksaints wrote: » Not necessary true, as there can be maintenance costs even if they are not used. Interestingly some football clubs have actually reduced capacity in their stadiums to improve atmosphere and provide a better quality stadium to their fans. Juventus have done this with their new stadium and Inter and AC Milan are planning to do this with the San Siro redevelopment/New Stadium. Roma and Lazio also have plans for new smaller stadiums then the one they're currently in.
threeball wrote: » How do you explain the bolded bit. If I have any existing stand thats crappy and holds 15000 people, surely when I renovate it I should build a smaller stand with better facilities, as the ground evolves if there is a sound plan in plan you end up with a properly sized stadium with proper infrastructure. Its not rocket science.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » I don't think there are any 15,000 seater stands apart from CP and PUC, the main stand in Semple might be close but any others will be a good bit smaller. Yes capacity could be reduced when replacing a crappy stand but if it is the main stand in a stadium you will want to accommodate a certain number. If you are providing player facilities, medical area, media facilities, CB office space, etc. you need a structure a of a certain size. What time period are you talking about the ground evolving over? In most stadiums terracing provides the bulk of the capacity. Terraces are basically large masses of concrete, they last a very long time and can be repaired or sections replaced at low cost if necessary. Most terraces will continue to suffice for a very long time to come. The sound plan you refer to will be on the go for a very long time before you get to your properly sized stadium, in the meantime the existing size will do with facility upgrades. Properly sized stadium with proper infrastructure will cost a lot more than existing size with proper infrastructure. Its not rocket science.
cson wrote: » Parc Y Scarlets was built in 2008 for £23 million. 15k seats, hospitality and good facilities.That shouldn't be beyond us, I don't think anyone is expecting Leitrim to throw up a SoFi Stadium equivalent as you're suggesting.
cson wrote: » Parc Y Scarlets was built in 2008 for £23 million. 15k seats, hospitality and good facilities. That shouldn't be beyond us, I don't think anyone is expecting Leitrim to throw up a SoFi Stadium equivalent as you're suggesting.
Boom__Boom wrote: » Since Pairc Ui Chaoimh reopened the highest attendance at a GAA match there has been 34,607 at Cork v Limerick in 2018. There's only been 2 other GAA games in PuC where the attendence has been over 30,000 - 31,753 at Wexford v Waterford in 2017 and 30,274 at Cork v Tipperary in 2017. Capacity is 45,000 since the re-development and it's been open almost 4 years at this stage. How much would Cork GAA have saved if they built a 35,000 seater as opposed to a 45,000 seater?
BloodyBill wrote: » The Gaelic grounds has 12,000 seats in the uncovered stand. Terraces are perfect for the GAA. The revenue generated from food and drink and merchandise needs to be developed in all GAA stadiums. However if we think we ll ever be able to match billion dollar stadiums in the USA then get real.. Weve toncut our cloth to suit
CrabRevolution wrote: » They'd hardly have entertained the notion, considering they were talking about hosting yearly sellout concerts and All Ireland Semi Finals.
threeball wrote: » Building a stadium to cater for the once in a blue moon event is the way things are done. Lads are denying its happening here yet its still going on.
BloodyBill wrote: » Has anyone even mention Croke Park. It's getting old and starting to look abit tatty. I'd rather see money being put into its upkeep rather than we let it deteriorate and rebuild it in 20 years.
threeball wrote: » Or even a 25k stadium. Its obvious it wasn't needed. Building a stadium to cater for the once in a blue moon event is the way things are done. Lads are denying its happening here yet its still going on. Cork shouldn't even have built a 20k stadium in my opinion given the use it gets. 90 million pissed away and a county that's struggling to get back to the top table in hurling never mind football. Absolutely nuts. There is no divine right for every fair weather supporter to get a ticket for big matches. It would generate more interest and revenue if there was a scarcity mindset and people actually had to plan to get tickets rather than rocking up on the day on a whim. Meath building 20k is another waste of money. When has there ever been 20k at a meath league game. 10k is more than big enough. Kildare too.
Boom__Boom wrote: » I'll be shocked if the same thing doesn't end up happening with Casement in the North - it's a complete mess already and there are clearly people on the Ulster Council who want capacity as big as possible no matter what.
The reformation of the Northern Executive has already put Casement Park back in the spotlight as it awaits a grant of planning permission. With inevitable increases in this stadium’s construction cost base, the Association’s ability to meet this project's financial demands will require further debate on the use of our finite resources.
threeball wrote: » Casement gets the go ahead. Another white elephant and mill stone round the GAA's neck. Absolutely banana that they would commit funds to this project. When was the last time there was 30k at an Antrim GAA match never mind building a stadium that will be used even less than PUC. At least other counties don't mind playing in PUC, nobody in Ulster wants to travel to Belfast for a game. The last place didn't go to rack and ruin because it was overused.
Pogue eile wrote: » Luckily enough the hierarchy in our organisation realise that the GAA is for all its members and not just the elite and the big traditional counties in the 26 counties. Pumping money into existing powerhouses while ignoring others achieves nothing only a tiered and divided organisation.
The 2019 numbers continue to show the 15 year write down of our €20m investment in Páirc Uí Chaoimh. As mentioned in more detail in the Ard Stiúrthóir’s report, Páirc Uí Chaoimh’s completion presents a significant financial risk for the Association. Built significantly over budget and with current bank borrowings of €21.5m, the repayment of this loan will prove challenging for the Cork County Committee and its stadium companies. ... This new loan support funding currently stands at €10.5m and is fully repayable by Cork. Combined with the above referenced bank borrowings, both loans total €32m and repayment of loans at this level is unsustainable by any county without some very hard and what may seem unpalatable measures, having to be put in place. ...The reformation of the Northern Executive has already put Casement Park back in the spotlight as it awaits a grant of planning permission. With inevitable increases in this stadium’s construction cost base, the Association’s ability to meet this project's financial demands will require further debate on the use of our finite resources.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » Despite comments from Horan yesterday, I don't think the GAA are interested in having a big stadium in Belfast and the costs involved after what happened with PUC. Last years Annual Report, under Capital Investment & Grants; That was before yesterdays announcement and before Covid hit the fan. I'd say the GAA would be quite happy for the Casement project to quietly disappear as they don't want that millstone around their neck as well. I can't see Casement going ahead anyway, yesterday's announcement is meaningless really, costs nothing to say you support a project but it will be very different when time comes to write the big cheque. The GAA would be better off building a new main stand at St Tiernachs Park, similar to that planned at St Conleths.
threeball wrote: » So the hierarchy in their wisdom are just as capable of pissing money up against the wall in the 6 counties as they are in the 26 is what you're saying.
