Cycling on paths and other cycling issues (updated title)

let's take that as given then. how come then there's no corresponding irrational hatred of motorists, despite pretty much everyone agreeing that lawbreaking is rampant?
you know yourself that an article on a road death on the journal, for example, might gain 3 'RIPs' in the comments.
if it's an article about cycling, the comments will number in the hundreds.

xckjoo

TaurenDruid wrote: »

"Irrational hatred" is maybe a bit strong, but I get what you mean.

I wonder why that might be?

Possibly, just maybe, the number of cyclists very obviously and visibly ignoring the rules of the road, running reds, cycling the wrong way up one-way-streets, cycling in pedestrian zones and footpaths, all the time? And the whataboutery and deflection when people complain about it?

I get ya. I don't like people cycling on the footpath either. My front door opens straight onto the footpath and have had my kid nearly hit by cyclists many times as they left for school in the morning.

But it's frustrating if you cycle (or walk) regularly and are constantly nearly hit by assh0les who shouldn't be let in charge of a wheelborrow and think nothing of barreling through red lights or passing you at high speeds leaving inches to spare. It feels like everyone else is playing with matches and you have a torch. Every time you point out that fire is dangerous, they scream about how sometimes a torch shines in their eyes and that's equally as bad.

Thelonious Monk

TaurenDruid wrote: »

"Irrational hatred" is maybe a bit strong, but I get what you mean.

I wonder why that might be?

Possibly, just maybe, the number of cyclists very obviously and visibly ignoring the rules of the road, running reds, cycling the wrong way up one-way-streets, cycling in pedestrian zones and footpaths, all the time? And the whataboutery and deflection when people complain about it?

Yes but people driving cars do all these things too - and it results in death, every few days. Cyclists doing these things doesn't harm anyone, we've been through this. So why aren't motorists despised the way cyclists are?

TaurenDruid wrote: »

"Irrational hatred" is maybe a bit strong, but I get what you mean.

I wonder why that might be?

Ignorance.

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Yes and it's not like we don't see pedestrians doing stupid risky things all the time. It's all proof that there's an irrational hatred against people on bikes.

Hardly irrational.

No issue with the man killed yesterday. Seems to be thieves in a stolen car. Hope they get caught.

The reason for "hatred of people on bikes" as you put it, is firstly that the bicycle lobby together with the Greens and Owen Keegan are forcing people who do not want to be stuck on a bicycle to cycle. That in itself is going to generate hostility. Add in the related policy of road closures, capacity reductions and the general "war on cars" being pursued. The latest being the crazy 30kph speed limit

Secondly many cyclists cycle slowly in the middle of the road in a deliberate effort to provoke car drivers (always with the helmet cam to record the conflict they are hoping for) Plus even where cycle lanes are provided about 10% of cyclists make a point of not using them - again to annoy drivers.

So you may be right but it is not "irrational". Not expecting any "likes" for this as I know Boards is infested with Greens/ cyclists. Might even get a ban from the mods as any criticism of cyclists or the green agenda is routinely banned here. But if I am wrong why do you think there is a "hatred of people on bikes"?

well, that proves the 'irrational' part of the hatred anyway.

magicbastarder wrote: »

well, that proves the 'irrational' part of the hatred anyway.

Says the man/women who banned me from another thread for pointing out the reality of what is going to become the normal commute.

So I'm" irrational" which handily deal with me

The question remains why does everyone hate cyclists?

kenmm

Truthvader wrote: »

Hardly irrational.

Secondly many cyclists cycle slowly in the middle of the road in a deliberate effort to provoke car drivers (always with the helmet cam to record the conflict they are hoping for) Plus even where cycle lanes are provided about 10% of cyclists make a point of not using them - again to annoy drivers.

So you may be right but it is not "irrational". Not expecting any "likes" for this as I know Boards is infested with Greens/ cyclists. Might even get a ban from the mods as any criticism of cyclists or the green agenda is routinely banned here. But if I am wrong why do you think there is a "hatred of people on bikes"?

Ok. I will allow for the fact that I think they're are a number of drivers/cyclists that like to get those juicy clips up loaded to YouTube as soon as possible. But I guarantee that's not to say that all those cycling in the middle of the lane (I assume you mean leave and not road) nor why a lot don't use cycle lanes (just search boards for the real reasons why).

If you go about with that sorta chip on your shoulder where by you are looking for problems everywhere, then sure as hell you will see them. But your version of these so called problems may not coincide with reality.

kenmm wrote: »

Ok. I will allow for the fact that I think they're are a number of drivers/cyclists that like to get those juicy clips up loaded to YouTube as soon as possible. But I guarantee that's not to say that all those cycling in the middle of the lane (I assume you mean leave and not road) nor why a lot don't use cycle lanes (just search boards for the real reasons why).

If you go about with that sorta chip on your shoulder where by you are looking for problems everywhere, then sure as hell you will see them. But your version of these so called problems may not coincide with reality.

Question remains - and I did not ask it.

kenmm

Truthvader wrote: »

Question remains - and I did not ask it.

Ah I don't care about that tbh (I don't think it's the case) just saying that you are making a lot of assumptions there.

Truthvader wrote: »

The question remains why does everyone hate cyclists?

they're jealous of our sex appeal.

Stark

Truthvader wrote: »

Hardly irrational.

No issue with the man killed yesterday. Seems to be thieves in a stolen car. Hope they get caught.

The reason for "hatred of people on bikes" as you put it, is firstly that the bicycle lobby together with the Greens and Owen Keegan are forcing people who do not want to be stuck on a bicycle to cycle. That in itself is going to generate hostility. Add in the related policy of road closures, capacity reductions and the general "war on cars" being pursued. The latest being the crazy 30kph speed limit

Secondly many cyclists cycle slowly in the middle of the road in a deliberate effort to provoke car drivers (always with the helmet cam to record the conflict they are hoping for) Plus even where cycle lanes are provided about 10% of cyclists make a point of not using them - again to annoy drivers.

So you may be right but it is not "irrational". Not expecting any "likes" for this as I know Boards is infested with Greens/ cyclists. Might even get a ban from the mods as any criticism of cyclists or the green agenda is routinely banned here. But if I am wrong why do you think there is a "hatred of people on bikes"?

And I thought people were concerned about the poor pedestrians. Finally we're getting closer to the truth of the matter.

jackofalltrades

magicbastarder wrote: »

a cyclist has also died following a collision on monday, the one on north wall quay. it was a hit and run.

RIP, really hoped he was going to pull through.

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Yeah but they wont that's my point.

Feel free to start a thread on it yourself.

Pinch Flat

Truthvader wrote: »

Hardly irrational.

No issue with the man killed yesterday. Seems to be thieves in a stolen car. Hope they get caught.

The reason for "hatred of people on bikes" as you put it, is firstly that the bicycle lobby together with the Greens and Owen Keegan are forcing people who do not want to be stuck on a bicycle to cycle. That in itself is going to generate hostility. Add in the related policy of road closures, capacity reductions and the general "war on cars" being pursued. The latest being the crazy 30kph speed limit

Secondly many cyclists cycle slowly in the middle of the road in a deliberate effort to provoke car drivers (always with the helmet cam to record the conflict they are hoping for) Plus even where cycle lanes are provided about 10% of cyclists make a point of not using them - again to annoy drivers.

So you may be right but it is not "irrational". Not expecting any "likes" for this as I know Boards is infested with Greens/ cyclists. Might even get a ban from the mods as any criticism of cyclists or the green agenda is routinely banned here. But if I am wrong why do you think there is a "hatred of people on bikes"?

Have you thought of talking to anyone about this?

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Have you thought of talking to anyone about this?

Well, you.

How do you explain "the hatred for people on bikes"?

Tea drinker

magicbastarder wrote: »

they're jealous of our sex appeal.

Self ban for 24 hours please :pac:

Truthvader wrote: »

Well, you.

How do you explain "the hatred for people on bikes"?

It’s irrational...the only explanation is that some people are just gob****es!

Charles Babbage

breezy1985 wrote: »

Grand I'll make sure to tell that to all the 8 year olds.

If they have responsible parents then tell them, but of course many have irresponsible parents.

A nice tribute.

https://twitter.com/alandub13/status/1301200489279782912?s=21

micar

Truthvader wrote: »

The reason for "hatred of people on bikes" as you put it, is firstly that the bicycle lobby together with the Greens and Owen Keegan are forcing people who do not want to be stuck on a bicycle to cycle. That in itself is going to generate hostility. Add in the related policy of road closures, capacity reductions and the general "war on cars" being pursued. The latest being the crazy 30kph speed

Have you had a look at the make up of DCC

63 seats

The Green Party hold 10 seats which is 16%

FF 11, FG 9, Labour 8 and SF 8.

Quite evenly split

Any changes made recently including the 30 km ph limit is an multi party decision.....not just the greens

The vast majority of people critical of this wouldn't be aware of the DCC make up.

Pinch Flat

Truthvader wrote: »

Well, you.

How do you explain "the hatred for people on bikes"?

Hard to know where to start but it seems to boil down to a few key issues. Drivers think we should share the burden of the roads by paying "road tax". Drivers seem to think we should be insured, ignoring that thousands are and uninsured drivers that they're funding are a much bigger problem. Drivers seem to think they have exclusivity to use the roads. Drivers have an opinion on what we should and shouldn't wear. Drivers have an opinion on where we should and shouldn't cycle.

I think most of it though boils down to just plain jealousy of it being a cheap and convenient way to get from a to b that offers immense freedom and choice. Weather doesn't matter. Schools on or off doesn't matter.

[Deleted User]

Truthvader wrote: »

Hardly irrational.

No issue with the man killed yesterday. Seems to be thieves in a stolen car. Hope they get caught.

The reason for "hatred of people on bikes" as you put it, is firstly that the bicycle lobby together with the Greens and Owen Keegan are forcing people who do not want to be stuck on a bicycle to cycle. That in itself is going to generate hostility. Add in the related policy of road closures, capacity reductions and the general "war on cars" being pursued. The latest being the crazy 30kph speed limit

Secondly many cyclists cycle slowly in the middle of the road in a deliberate effort to provoke car drivers (always with the helmet cam to record the conflict they are hoping for) Plus even where cycle lanes are provided about 10% of cyclists make a point of not using them - again to annoy drivers.

So you may be right but it is not "irrational". Not expecting any "likes" for this as I know Boards is infested with Greens/ cyclists. Might even get a ban from the mods as any criticism of cyclists or the green agenda is routinely banned here. But if I am wrong why do you think there is a "hatred of people on bikes"?

So let's just review the facts.

1) No-one is being 'forced to cycle'. Never. It has never happened. Not once.
2) There is no 'war on cars'. The Daily Heil invented it as a catchy headline to distract people from what's actually going on. When you've enjoyed the privilege of have the world designed and built around your personal choices, it might seem like a 'war' to have some of that privilege removed. It is actually just a very small amount of rebalancing of facilities in some small, restricted locations.
3) The number of cyclists with helmet cameras is tiny. It is a growing number, but it is still tiny, in the context of the 56k cyclists that commute by bike each day. So any suggestion that anything is happening 'always with a helmet camera' is a gross exaggeration.
4) Cyclists really don't cycle in the middle of the road. It would be a crazy place to cycle with traffic passing you closely in both directions. Some cyclists do cycle in the middle of the lane. It's not a pleasant experience, but it is sometimes necessary to prevent dangerous overtakes. No-one looks to generate conflict with a 1-3 tonne lump of metal.
5) Some cyclists don't use some cycle lanes, because those cycle lanes are designed like these ones https://irishcycle.com/2015/11/05/images-25-reasons-why-cyclists-dont-use-cycle-lanes and poorly maintained, covered with parked cars, mushy leaves, broken glass or dog walkers with extended leads.

So there is no element of rational logic in any of the positions you've suggested.

Stark

Turning right

This somehow comes as a surprise to some motorists, but people cycling need to turn right and to do so they usually need to cross traffic lanes…

This is the usual situation where I get abuse from motorists for not being in the cycle lane or "being in the middle of the ****ing road".

Tea drinker

Stark wrote: »

This is the usual situation where I get abuse from motorists for not being in the cycle lane or "being in the middle of the ****ing road".

That's ignorance on the drivers part? As long as none of you or bike is crossing over the lane divider surely you are good to go?

breezy1985

magicbastarder wrote: »

they're jealous of our sex appeal.

We all have lovely bottoms

Tea drinker

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Hard to know where to start but it seems to boil down to a few key issues. Drivers think we should share the burden of the roads by paying "road tax". Drivers seem to think we should be insured, ignoring that thousands are and uninsured drivers that they're funding are a much bigger problem. Drivers seem to think they have exclusivity to use the roads. Drivers have an opinion on what we should and shouldn't wear. Drivers have an opinion on where we should and shouldn't cycle.

I think most of it though boils down to just plain jealousy of it being a cheap and convenient way to get from a to b that offers immense freedom and choice. Weather doesn't matter. Schools on or off doesn't matter.

There's a lot wrong with this - IMHO.
I think being insured is the right thing for cyclists, a minor trafic incident can be come an expensive personal injury claim against you (for example)
Just because some gippo doesn't insure his car has no more bearing on my life than being pissed that some work shy are taking our tax for decades.
I share the road with other road users, giving and and expecting courtesy.
Wear whatever you like, as long as you are visible rock on.
I do have an opinion on where you should and shouldn't cycle we are sharing the road :-)

What pisses me off is pig ignorant behaviour, I have mentioned a few incidents in this thread, won't trot them out again, use your imagination :-)

Tea drinker wrote: »

That's ignorance on the drivers part? As long as none of you or bike is crossing over the lane divider surely you are good to go?

as mentioned earlier, there are many roads where the cyclist has to leave the cycle lane to take a right turn. including one i often take about 100m from my house. i'd say the normal chance of me being blown at or gestured at for being in the wrong lane (i.e. not in the cycle lane) is maybe 5-10%.
i could cross at the pedestrian lights, but i'm not a pedestrian in that scenario.

and this is why many - not all, but many - people cycle on paths. because there's a certain cohort of people in cars who will try to intimidate you out of their way.

here's something to try - stick an L plate up in your car, if you're a driver. you will see an immediate change in how many other drivers behave around you - stupid overtakes (MGIFs, in cycling terms), other intimidatory behaviour, general dickishness. now take that intimidatory behaviour, and multiply it by (plucks figure out of air), a factor of three, and allow for the fact that they're intimidating you when you're on a bicycle, not in a car.

this evening, a van driver passed me with less than 50cm to spare on a country road, doing easily north of 50km/h. if someone was to try to convince me that he'd try the same if i'd be driving a car, let's just say i'd take a lot of convincing.

regarding the L plate thing, possibly the most lunatic manouevre i've seen in a car was when my wife was learning to drive, and had just entered a roundabout, in the correct lane to go straight on (i.e. entering at 6 o'clock, leaving at 12).
a chap in a BMW overtook us and turned left across us - as we were entering the roundabout - to take the 9 o'clock exit. we came within a foot of him; or maybe it's better to say he came within a foot of us.

i've driven through that roundabout in the exact same manner literally hundreds of times, probably more than a thousand times - several times a week for nearly ten years.
i won't accept it's a coincidence that the time i saw *by far* the worst stunt pulled was one of the ten times out of that thousand, when there was an L plate on display.

[Deleted User]

Tea drinker wrote: »

I think being insured is the right thing for cyclists, a minor trafic incident can be come an expensive personal injury claim against you (for example)
Just because some gippo doesn't insure his car has no more bearing on my life than being pissed that some work shy are taking our tax for decades.

Do you think it's the right thing for pedestrians to be insured, given that they can cause collisions by walking out in front of vehicles or cyclists?