Jessica Swift Bearded wrote: » Ok, we have a different way of working. I would cite the source and quote the exact reference. You mean this :-https://www.statista.com/statistics/525353/sweden-number-of-deaths/ And does this report say that Sweden had 4,000 excess deaths on top of the reported covid deaths? So, 9000 extra deaths compared to other years.
FintanMcluskey wrote: » Demographics meant it would be unlikely to have a repeat of what happened in Northern Italy in Ireland. The region in northern Italy that had overcrowding issues had an elderly population, one of the oldest in Europe, of 10m in an area the size of Munster.
charlie14 wrote: » I don`t know what you believe that proves, but I have a feeling it`s not what you think it does. Over 65 deaths in Ireland 1,644. Over 65 deaths in Sweden 5,202. Do the maths and it is exactly the figure I gave you. 62% more deaths in Sweden of over 65`s than Ireland. If HIQA`s figures are correct the same applies. 2.4 times more deaths of over 65`s in Sweden than Ireland.
charlie14 wrote: » We asked people to social distance here before the lockdown and not have large gatherings in pubs, clubs and public spaces. All were jammed the weekend before lockdown.
charlie14 wrote: » It has also been covered in the Swedish paper The Local SE. If there is a second wave that hits the country evenly the estimate from the Swedish Public Health Agency is for a further 5,800 deaths.
tobefrank321 wrote: » You do know the population of Sweden is twice that of Irelands? And they have 50% more over 65? Fintan's point is correct. You are as likely to die of covid19 in Ireland as Sweden if you are over 65. Pro rata there's no difference in rates.
tobefrank321 wrote: » Projections don't equal fact. Sweden was projected to have 100,000 deaths in a couple of months if it didn't lockdown. It now stands at 5750.
charlie14 wrote: » You do know that Swedish deaths per 100,000 of population is 56.01 and based on HSE figures Ireland`s is 35.97 ? On HIQA figures Ireland`s death per 100,000 would be as low as 25.
tobefrank321 wrote: » Yes because some Irish people can't be trusted to follow public health advice. Far more Swedish people can obviously hence no reason to impose strict rule. Its been said Swedes are less sociable than Irish so less of a need to impose lockdown.
FintanMcluskey wrote: » Charlie I can requote bit cynicals graph but I dont think it will help. Bottom line is, with the official figures, a Swedish citizen over 65 is as safe as an irish citizen.
charlie14 wrote: » You can quote whatever you like Fintan. It will not change the fact that Sweden had anything from 62% to 2.4 times greater deaths than Ireland. Much greater again when compared to their neighbours.
CalamariFritti wrote: » You need to take into account how many over 65s there are in each country. You cant just say 'over 65s'. Sweden 2m Ireland 650k. Comes out pretty much at the same rate. The way you wrote it up its flawed.
charlie14 wrote: » It`s only flawed if you consider those over 65 expendable.
FintanMcluskey wrote: » Charlie sorry to offend to you but this is waffle
charlie14 wrote: » It`s only flawed if you consider those over 65 expendable. I don`t so the facts are, as I`ve said, Sweden has anything from 62% - 240% more death than Ireland. Greater again on a like for like basis with their Nordic neighbours.
CalamariFritti wrote: » I don't agree with you in that it makes a statement as to anyone's expendability. Its been said that Swedens approach has 'extra deaths' over Ireland and is therefore debunked. This is saying that there aren't any extra deaths. This is saying that the vast vast majority of deaths occur over 65 everywhere and Sweden has disproportionally more of those compared to Ireland. It's simply lining up the numbers more correctly when trying to compare the success or not of one approach over another. It's not trying to imply expendability.
CalamariFritti wrote: » Its not playing with numbers. Sweden has 2 times our population but 3 times the number of our 65s. So when almost all deaths occur in that age group wouldn't it make sense that Sweden has 3 times our deaths, too?
charlie14 wrote: » You and Fintan can play around with numbers all you like but if you do not consider over 65`s expendable then the figures speak for themselves. Sweden has a much greater rate of deaths than Ireland. Even more so when compared to their neighbours
tobefrank321 wrote: » You are just going to ignore the fact Sweden has 50% more over 65s and therefore logically should have 50% more deaths, arent you?
charlie14 wrote: » That was the source and the exact reference. Now there is nothing I know of that would be the case of excess deaths in Sweden in the first half of a year more so than the second half. Covid-19 deaths in Sweden until end of June were around 5,500. So working from that, do your own calculation for excess deaths for the first half of this year and let me know.
greyday wrote: » Sweden has close to 50% single person households, how many have we?
Jessica Swift Bearded wrote: » Honestly, I'm struggling here to understand what you are trying to say. You refer to first half and second half of a year so, best I can come up with is that you added deaths for Jan - Jun 2020 and compared them to Jul - Dec 2019?? If so, give us the exact numbers, compare them to other year's in Sweden and do the same for Ireland. But to answer your question, I would assume deaths are influenced by weather, and perhaps variations of the regular flu. And of course in this year by covid 19. And exact reference? No, that's not what you did.
