Masks

odyssey06 wrote: »

You are the one dodging the question.
You made the claims about infections in health care workers and wearing of masks being more risky than not. Back it up. The point is not whether PPE make you 100% safe but whether their use is safer than not.
I linked my source about the drop in infections since mask policy changed.

Its an old chestnut cos its a defence mechanism against nonsense.

You linked to the journal, it's hardly what i'd consider peer reviewed gospel.
Your missing my question why are they still getting infected over 50% of today's cases were health care workers. The general public haven't the same level of equipment, how can a mandatory mask policy expect to control the virus?
We let prisoners out of jail, if masks were so effective why didn't we leave them there and just make them wear masks.
Masks weren't invented this year, medical professionals even on NEPHT aren't all on board with masks and have stated so on national TV
Like the guards why can they stay indoors in a crowded room with no masks yet we can't buy a loaf.

timmy_mallet

odyssey06 wrote: »

Nobody knows when it comes to community transmission re the starting patirnt. So we are trying to eliminate an unknown.
You will have to tell us which nightclubs are your source of community transmission given they are shut.

Well you lot seem to do because yer saying its happening in shops with no evidence for it.

None today obviously. And the supermarkets are open with extremely little mask usage or social distancing, and guess what...

drunkmonkey wrote: »

You linked to the journal, it's hardly what i'd consider peer reviewed gospel.
Your missing my question why are they still getting infected over 50% of today's cases were health care workers. The general public haven't the same level of equipment, how can a mandatory mask policy expect to control the virus?.

You linked to nothing. Not a single source. And you are objecting to the journal article which covered an Oireachtas committee?
Come off it thats nit picking hypocrisy.
Where are your peer reviewed articles.

Cases for a single day mean nothing.
Have 50% of new cases since April been healthcare workers?

I repeat. Infections dropped in healthcare workers with the rollout of general mask policy.
If some are still being infected it does not show that mask use is riskier than not wearing them. It shows how infectious the virus is.

Besides masks for the general public are not about protecting the wearer directly, but stopping them from infecting others by containing their coughs and sneezes.

fr336

Its not Ireland but i saw a UK statistic that shop workers are 75% more likely to die of Covid. A horrible number.

odyssey06 wrote: »

If some are still being infected it does not show that mask use is riskier than not wearing them. It shows how infectious the virus is.

Besides masks for the general public are not about protecting the wearer directly, but stopping them from infecting others by containing their coughs and sneezes.

Yes the virus is incredibly infectious. I'm pretty sure Cillian De Gascun stated it's 50/50 on masks. It should be an individual choice I believe from listening to a lot of experts.

Where are people with coughs and sneezes meant to be, out wearing a mask? Or at home isolating not wearing any mask. See what I'm getting at. We both know people with symptoms won't stay at home if we say masks will prevent them from infecting someone else. It's not true they can still infect people and the worse the mask the higher the risk.

timmy_mallet wrote: »

Well you lot seem to do because yer saying its happening in shops with no evidence for it.
None today obviously. And the supermarkets are open with extremely little mask usage or social distancing, and guess what...

About three posts back you used the fact that social distancing was happening in aldi to make your point.
Now you contradicted yourself.
Not for the first time in this thread you will post nonsense you dont even believe from one post to the next. Your posts are just exercises in sowing confusion and misinformation.
You are more than wrong.
You arent sincere.

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Yes the virus is incredibly infectious. I'm pretty sure Cillian De Gascun stated it's 50/50 on masks. It should be an individual choice I believe from listening to a lot of experts.

Where are people with coughs and sneezes meant to be, out wearing a mask? Or at home isolating not wearing any mask. See what I'm getting at. We both know people with symptoms won't stay at home if we say masks will prevent them from infecting someone else. It's not true they can still infect people and the worse the mask the higher the risk.

They should be at home in my opinion. The reason this virus is so bad is asymptomatic spread and that is wear masks come in.

And I don't think it's up to each person. It's part of the social contract.

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Yes the virus is incredibly infectious. I'm pretty sure Cillian De Gascun stated it's 50/50 on masks. It should be an individual choice I believe from listening to a lot of experts.
Where are people with coughs and sneezes meant to be, out wearing a mask? Or at home isolating not wearing any mask. See what I'm getting at. We both know people with symptoms won't stay at home if we say masks will prevent them from infecting someone else. It's not true they can still infect people and the worse the mask the higher the risk.

If it was on the mask... well if they werent wearing a mask what would have happened?
Infected through inhalation.
I am not seeing these scenarios where no mask is safer.

Some people cough and sneeze... hayfever. Allergies. Smokers cough. They dont know they have the virus.
And some people will go out even if symptomatic.
You really think there are more ppl in your cohort than in those groups?
People who know they are sick and only go out cos of mask?
I dont think so.
Plus they can do that regardless if masks arent mandatory. I dont see how it can be raised as an objection to masks on buses etc

Mandatory masks limit the spread of their infections if they do go out.

fr336 wrote: »

Its not Ireland but i saw a UK statistic that shop workers are 75% more likely to die of Covid. A horrible number.

That's been widely disputed, M&S had 126 cases out of a work force of 78,000 and 3 deaths.
Retail is risky but I don't believe it is in Ireland right now. It's not necessary for mandatory facemasks for entering a shop.

fr336

drunkmonkey wrote: »

That's been widely disputed, M&S had 126 cases out of a work force of 78,000 and 3 deaths.
Retail is risky but I don't believe it is in Ireland right now. It's not necessary for mandatory facemasks for entering a shop.

Where is the harm in them? If going to the supermarket is a special event for people they need to get a life.

drunkmonkey wrote: »

That's been widely disputed, M&S had 126 cases out of a work force of 78,000 and 3 deaths.
Retail is risky but I don't believe it is in Ireland right now. It's not necessary for mandatory facemasks for entering a shop.

It could be that larger supermarkets are low risk as more scope for distancing.
And the real concern is smaller retail outlets especially where ppl browse like clothes shops.
But not possible to have different rules.
So mandatory masks for all.

odyssey06 wrote: »

If it was on the mask... well if they werent wearing a mask what would have happened?
Infected through inhalation.
I am not seeing these scenarios where no mask is safer.

Asymptomatic transmission is rare. There not a major risk. People with symptoms shouldn't be out mask or no mask, your correct if they have it, it should lessen the spread but by no means is it going to stop it.
I can only comment on what I'm seeing every day, people pulling them down by the front to talk to you, not putting them on or taking them off proper and not disposing of them properly.
People with seasonal allergies especially bunged up noses have natural facemasks there unlikely to inhale it that's Like O'Neills words not mine.
Improper use is the danger and an obvious one to anyone who understands what procedures are required for safety with them.

odyssey06 wrote: »

It could be that larger supermarkets are low risk as more scope for distancing.
And the real concern is smaller retail outlets especially where ppl browse like clothes shops.
But not possible to have different rules.
So mandatory masks for all.

It's not possible to have different rules for different shops, but it's possible to have different rules for different pubs

Shops were open throughout the pandemic with no requirements for face masks. They're not going to magically become death traps at the stroke of midnight.

What's the plan when people increasingly catch the virus through the improper use of face masks?

Common issues like:
not covering their nose
wearing it on their chin so it's not covering their nose or mouth
fiddling with it because they are uncomfortable so they potentially contaminate their hands

Elderly and vulnerable people in particular are being put at risk by this nonsense.

GazzaL wrote: »

Elderly and vulnerable people in particular are being put at risk by this nonsense.

You finally got something right.

Deleted User wrote: »

You finally got something right.

There was an article in one of the newspapers about the new mask requirements which showed a picture of two elderly men wearing their masks arseways and one of them was touching the front part of the mask. There was another picture in the article of a middle aged person wearing an incorrectly sized mask because it didn't cover their chin. All the gear but no idea.

Anyone who's been out in public has seen countless examples of this.

I haven't. I've been in a school of 5,000 students and not one was wearing a mask incorrectly. It's incredibly easy so just teach people.

ExMachina1000

Day on day record new case increases globally.
14 million total cases and rising at a rate of above 200k a day

425 new cases in Australia yesterday after weeks of tiny figures

Over 1 million cases in India
2 million in Brazil
3.5 in the Us

Ireland will see an increase again. The HSE said yesterday that they are not prepared to handle a second wave of cases.

If and when we start to see another uptick in cases and deaths remember those who had the power yet refused to stop flights coming into Ireland.
As flights have increased it has been quoted that it is only possible to follow up call less than 10%. This figure will get smaller and smaller as the numbers continue to grow.

Ireland as an island nation had a chance. No longer the case. By October we will be in serious trouble

Deleted User wrote: »

I haven't. I've been in a school of 5,000 students and not one was wearing a mask incorrectly. It's incredibly easy so just teach people.

I see different people wearing masks incorrectly every day. I've seen medical professionals wearing masks incorrectly. Even the photos in Irish newspapers encouraging people to wear masks show people wearing them incorrectly.

Infini

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Ireland will see an increase again. The HSE said yesterday that they are not prepared to handle a second wave of cases.

To be fair it was on the radio this morning and they were referring to a scenario where the wouldnt be able to handle a surge if it happened in conjuntion with an outbreak of the flu during the middle of winter. Thats the real threat. They can handle one but 2 at once is the danger.

https://twitter.com/AliNouriPhD/status/1283925161801121792

GazzaL wrote: »

I see different people wearing masks incorrectly every day. I've seen medical professionals wearing masks incorrectly. Even the photos in Irish newspapers encouraging people to wear masks show people wearing them incorrectly.

And what? People wearing them under their chin just don't want to wear right.

Stopping everyone wearing them because some people are mongs isn't good public policy.

MadYaker

timmy_mallet wrote: »

Masks are about potentially stopping a case or two and making the ultra nervous happy.

It’s so depressing to read posts like this. There’s no excuse for this level of ignorance with all the information that’s at our fingertips these days. I think the human race is going backwards. We’re getting dumber not smarter.

wadacrack

MadYaker wrote: »

It’s so depressing to read posts like this. There’s no excuse for this level of ignorance with all the information that’s at our fingertips these days. I think the human race is going backwards. We’re getting dumber not smarter.

Well that's actually true. We're devolving as it isn't survival of the fittest anymore and the weak are helped to survive and have kids.

As for the muppets who believe crap they read on Facebook, that's just part of the human condition. They want to feel right and will disregard all evidence that could impact that.

MadYaker

GazzaL wrote: »

There was an article in one of the newspapers about the new mask requirements which showed a picture of two elderly men wearing their masks arseways and one of them was touching the front part of the mask. There was another picture in the article of a middle aged person wearing an incorrectly sized mask because it didn't cover their chin. All the gear but no idea.

Anyone who's been out in public has seen countless examples of this.

Never mind all the scientific evidence, you saw a picture of 2 guys wearing them wrong so clearly, masks are useless. Is that the point you’re trying to make?

It’s lockdown or masks. Pick one.

ExMachina1000

Infini wrote: »

To be fair it was on the radio this morning and they were referring to a scenario where the wouldnt be able to handle a surge if it happened in conjuntion with an outbreak of the flu during the middle of winter. Thats the real threat. They can handle one but 2 at once is the danger.

That's correct . October is when the danger is