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Will you travel? [Mod Note in Post #1 - Travel Discussion Only! Megathread]

Mrcaramelchoc

Are you traveling outside of Ireland in the next few weeks?will you go now because the coronavirus is getting worse or will you cancel?
Im due to go to prague in 2 weeks and i don't know if i should?

Mod: It has been suggested to merge this with the main Corona thread, but I think a dedicated thread about travel has merit. If it becomes too much like the main thread, I'll just merge the two.

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DebDynamite

copeyhagen wrote: »

we're already open for travel, im in swords and have seen loads of Spanish/Italian looking people walking around with suitcases in the last few days.

I know we’re open but we’re not “officially” open as we’re down as a country who require incoming travellers to do a 14 day quarantine, which will deter a lot of people. Also, I guess with the no non-essential travel advice for us here (as wishy-washy as it is), it will absolutely put a certain percentage of people off travelling abroad

theoldbreed

Aw lads my head is just wrecked and the person I'm most annoyed at is myself! Crete booked since January, they have had very low cases, due to fly mid August. I'm annoyed at myself as I've allowed myself to be shamed! A friend told me I was selfish to consider travelling, wrote a comment on the journal in defence of travelling, won't make that mistake again. My brother works for the HSE as a carer in a big hospital and he was told if where he's going is on the green list no problem but if not then he'll have to take two weeks when he comes back. I appreciate that. A good few of his colleagues who have all worked hard throughout this time are heading away and deservedly so!

My only concern would be another lockdown while I'm there and having to stay in Crete for however long.

Limpy

theoldbreed wrote: »

Aw lads my head is just wrecked and the person I'm most annoyed at is myself! Crete booked since January, they have had very low cases, due to fly mid August. I'm annoyed at myself as I've allowed myself to be shamed! A friend told me I was selfish to consider travelling, wrote a comment on the journal in defence of travelling, won't make that mistake again. My brother works for the HSE as a carer in a big hospital and he was told if where he's going is on the green list no problem but if not then he'll have to take two weeks when he comes back. I appreciate that. A good few of his colleagues who have all worked hard throughout this time are heading away and deservedly so!

My only concern would be another lockdown while I'm there and having to stay in Crete for however long.

Just travel back from a country on the green list, or travel back to Belfast airport and continue on home unchecked.

Damiencm

Hi all

I just posted this in another thread but thought it was worth sharing further

I have just come off the phone with my travel insurance provider (chill)

They confirmed that they have changed their terms and conditions.

If I travel while the government travel advisory is in place I am still insured!

[My policy is due to expire before I travel and the operator advised that their terms and conditions applied to both new and existing customers!

The only caveat being that the insurance excludes Covid19.

Break a leg - insured Get robbed - insured

I have to say that this is huge news to me, from what I had read in the media and here nobody was insured for travel.

Contact your insurer and ignore any other information you see elsewhere!

Perhaps not all insurers are the same but the chill operator I spoke with stated that they had to adjust their terms and conditions otherwise travel insurance would cease to exist as product.

I'd be curious to know what other insurers are saying. Is this again a case of the media trying to scare people into not travelling??

faceman

theoldbreed wrote: »

Aw lads my head is just wrecked and the person I'm most annoyed at is myself! Crete booked since January, they have had very low cases, due to fly mid August. I'm annoyed at myself as I've allowed myself to be shamed! A friend told me I was selfish to consider travelling, wrote a comment on the journal in defence of travelling, won't make that mistake again. My brother works for the HSE as a carer in a big hospital and he was told if where he's going is on the green list no problem but if not then he'll have to take two weeks when he comes back. I appreciate that. A good few of his colleagues who have all worked hard throughout this time are heading away and deservedly so!

My only concern would be another lockdown while I'm there and having to stay in Crete for however long.

Lockdown in Greece and Cyprus seemed pleasant enough for these Irish folks

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/abroad/irishwoman-in-athens-being-stuck-in-greece-isn-t-exactly-a-hardship-1.4293562

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/health-family/irish-family-stuck-in-cyprus-we-hope-our-flights-home-are-cancelled-1.4288423

charlietheminxx

Damiencm wrote: »

The only caveat being that the insurance excludes Covid19.

I would have thought that this was obvious? Or else they would have had to refund everyone!

Still the insurance is the pretty useless if you have to quarantine or change dates or your return flight is cancelled or whatever, because you won't get a penny from them.

copeyhagen

just went down and got the E111 (EHIC) renewed for myself and one of the kids.. this day next week we will be in the sun in my mams apartment..

wife a bit of a sheep and still doesnt feel like going, so she might not. ill be going either way.

facehugger99

charlietheminxx wrote: »

You may have vulnerable or high risk coworkers - whatever about taking the chance for yourself, it's not on to hide it from your employer and put your coworkers unknowingly at risk.

Are you worried about knocking a co-worker down when you drive into the staff carpark too?

It's absolutely no business of my employer where I choose to go on holiday and I have no intention of discussing the matter with them.

d15ude

charlietheminxx wrote: »

You may have vulnerable or high risk coworkers - whatever about taking the chance for yourself, it's not on to hide it from your employer and put your coworkers unknowingly at risk.

If traveling is really that dangerous, why is the self isolation only advice and not a mandatory and enforced requirement by law?

I do take Corona serious, but traveling in the EU (ex Sweden) I see no more risk than traveling in Ireland.

Damiencm

charlietheminxx wrote:

I would have thought that this was obvious? Or else they would have had to refund everyone!

charlietheminxx wrote:

Still the insurance is the pretty useless if you have to quarantine or change dates or your return flight is cancelled or whatever, because you won't get a penny from them.

True. But if return flight is cancelled you will at least be entitled to a refund.

We don't know how the next 3 months/ 3 years will pan out with respect to Covid, second waves, flare ups.

I'm in a position to get on with things but I appreciate not everyone is in the same boat.

josip

DebDynamite wrote: »

To be fair, maybe we do know something. We’re doing the best in Europe at the moment with no further localised lockdowns. We’re practically fully opened up again internally. Maybe we should aim for a full opening up of the country, try and get kids back to school, which will in turn allow parents to get back to work. Would that not helping the economy more than the small amount of tourists we’ll get into the country compared to the usual numbers, and the amount of Irish holiday makers leaving the country to go to the sun.

We should concentrate on getting the kids back to school first and see how we fare with all pubs open, and then we should open up for travel

Deb, do you think reopening pubs should be prioritised over allowing people in Ireland to visit family abroad ?

Acosta

theoldbreed wrote: »

Aw lads my head is just wrecked and the person I'm most annoyed at is myself! Crete booked since January, they have had very low cases, due to fly mid August. I'm annoyed at myself as I've allowed myself to be shamed! A friend told me I was selfish to consider travelling, wrote a comment on the journal in defence of travelling, won't make that mistake again. My brother works for the HSE as a carer in a big hospital and he was told if where he's going is on the green list no problem but if not then he'll have to take two weeks when he comes back. I appreciate that. A good few of his colleagues who have all worked hard throughout this time are heading away and deservedly so!

My only concern would be another lockdown while I'm there and having to stay in Crete for however long.

I'd say you will be able to judge well in advance of your trip if there's going to be another lockdown. I know a lot of people had a bad time in Spain in the March, but the writing was on the wall that a lockdown was imminent both in Spain and in Ireland, and they should not have travelled.

Surely the HSE will test staff that return from abroad until a vaccine is found? It seems ridiculous that they wouldn't unless it's a case of them wanting to be purposely pig headed in a lame attempt at setting an example for other sectors. They may start doing it once the government change their travel advisory policy. Health care workers definitely deserve a holiday.

charlietheminxx

facehugger99 wrote: »

Are you worried about knocking a co-worker down when you drive into the staff carpark too?

It's absolutely no business of my employer where I choose to go on holiday and I have no intention of discussing the matter with them.

What is that car park analogy about? It's hardly comparable.

If you really want a driving analogy, how about driving after a few pints - not recommended, dangerous to yourself, dangerous to others (especially more vulnerable road users) and while it's outside work, employers tend to have an opinion on it.

Plenty of people disclose private medical conditions to their employer, so they might be aware if someone in your workplace is higher risk. You're not affording them the opportunity to implement measures to protect staff members it may affect.

By all means, go on your holiday if it's what you want to do - I'm not here to tell anyone not to but at least be honest so others can behave accordingly. My office were required to prepare a health & safety plan specifically for Covid19 and this is in it - if your workplace has implemented the guidelines, it probably does too.

d15ude wrote: »

If traveling is really that dangerous, why is the self isolation only advice and not a mandatory and enforced requirement by law?

I do take Corona serious, but traveling in the EU (ex Sweden) I see no more risk than traveling in Ireland.

I can't answer that, I think the half measure requirements are pointless.

One thing with travel though is that the airlines are not adhering to social distancing guidelines, so being on a plane in close contact for an extended period of time surely brings with it increased risks? Sweden also has a higher rate than here.

spockety

Ok, I think it's fair to say that we're at the point now where everything that can be said on this topic has been said.

People have made up their minds by now and will either travel, or will not travel.

acequion

DebDynamite wrote: »

To be fair, maybe we do know something. We’re doing the best in Europe at the moment with no further localised lockdowns. We’re practically fully opened up again internally. Maybe we should aim for a full opening up of the country, try and get kids back to school, which will in turn allow parents to get back to work. Would that not helping the economy more than the small amount of tourists we’ll get into the country compared to the usual numbers, and the amount of Irish holiday makers leaving the country to go to the sun.

We should concentrate on getting the kids back to school first and see how we fare with all pubs open, and then we should open up for travel

Firstly, not everyone has children so this whole getting the schools back open thing does not affect everyone. Perhaps a majority of summer travellers are parents and families, but I thought we had reached the stage in our social evolution that we give equal consideration to minorities, all minorities. So what about those who are childless?

Secondly, with respect, I find your way of thinking and this new increasing way of thinking very dangerous. It's the stuff of totalitarianism and police states where the principle is that the greater good must come before the individual. World history will have taught us how negatively such experiments have turned out and lest anybody thinks I'm exaggerating, just look out at all the other countries! Many declared a state of emergency during the crisis and that is fair enough. But now that the crisis has passed people have been given back their civil liberties. Except here in this nanny state where they try to stop us travelling and ministers are muttering vague threats about future restrictions and threats too about curtailing pub activity if young people don't behave themselves. It's very undemocratic at worst, patronising at best and it makes me very uneasy.

Will this be the hallmark of the Govt nobody voted for and nobody wants?

DebDynamite

josip wrote: »

Deb, do you think reopening pubs should be prioritised over allowing people in Ireland to visit family abroad ?

Until around September, yes. A friend of mine in Dublin only got to visit her family in the west of Ireland at the weekend, as that was the first weekend it was permitted since lockdown. For the good of the nation, and possibly getting back to normality quicker, I’d hold off on international travel for at least another 2 months.

facehugger99

charlietheminxx wrote: »

By all means, go on your holiday if it's what you want to do - I'm not here to tell anyone not to but at least be honest so others can behave accordingly.

Why would anyone need to be "honest " about their holidays?

It's my private life, away from work and nobody's business but my own.

You may have swallowed the guilt-trip propaganda that RTE and the politicians are peddling but hopefully not everyone is so minded.

Dangerous road we're heading down, civil liberties and personal freedoms are willingly being traded away by some on the promise of "safety" - it's already apparent how difficult it is to win these liberties back.

facehugger99

DebDynamite wrote: »

Until around September, yes. A friend of mine in Dublin only got to visit her family in the west of Ireland at the weekend, as that was the first weekend it was permitted since lockdown. For the good of the nation, and possibly getting back to normality quicker, I’d hold off on international travel for at least another 2 months.

Cool - what happens in 2 months?

Is the virus gone by then?

DebDynamite

acequion wrote: »

Firstly, not everyone has children so this whole getting the schools back open thing does not affect everyone. Perhaps a majority of summer travellers are parents and families, but I thought we had reached the stage in our social evolution that we give equal consideration to minorities, all minorities. So what about those who are childless

I’m childless myself, so i have no skin in the game per se, however I believe getting the kids back to school is vital to getting back to some kind of normality and getting the economy back again. Can you believe the absolute sh!tshow there’s going to be come mid/late August when there’s a spike in numbers and the schools are trying to reopen

Micky 32

facehugger99 wrote: »

Cool - what happens in 2 months?

Is the virus gone by then?

As long as the virus is around ( which could be years) and if no vaccine we will be told not to travel indefinitely, we really have nothing to look forward to.

That’s the way it looks at the moment anyway.

It will be a treehuggers/begrudgers paradise.

josip

DebDynamite wrote: »

Until around September, yes. A friend of mine in Dublin only got to visit her family in the west of Ireland at the weekend, as that was the first weekend it was permitted since lockdown. For the good of the nation, and possibly getting back to normality quicker, I’d hold off on international travel for at least another 2 months.

So you think that people in pubs after a few drinks will still be socially distancing better than someone who landbridges in their car to Europe?

I'm not anti-pub, but I've spent enough time in them to know what people are like by the end of the night.
Most people remember the Earthcam from Temple Bar when they were supposed to be socially distancing at the start.

DebDynamite

facehugger99 wrote: »

Cool - what happens in 2 months?

Is the virus gone by then?

Open travel up. If it contributes to a large spike in numbers which we can’t sustain, bring back restrictions to travelling

DebDynamite

josip wrote: »

So you think that people in pubs after a few drinks will still be socially distancing better than someone who landbridges in their car to Europe?

If there’s virtually zero cases in the community here, we’ll be safe even if social distancing goes out the window by some people. They only thing that will spike the numbers in a short space of time is international travel in large numbers from counties performing worse than us .

bladespin

DebDynamite wrote: »

If there’s virtually zero cases in the community here, we’ll be safe even if social distancing goes out the window by some people. They only thing that will spike the numbers in a short space of time is international travel in large numbers from counties performing worse than us .

Like, say the US??? Just checked the arrivals for Dublin airport there, plenty coming in tomorrow morning, also lost and lots from England too.

Arrivals

Clonmel1000

So are the anti travel mob saying

1. No international travel until a vaccine?

2. Quarantine on arrival in the country if you do for 14 days until there’s a vaccine?

DebDynamite

bladespin wrote: »

Like, say the US??? Just checked the arrivals for Dublin airport there, plenty coming in tomorrow morning, also lost and lots from England too.

Arrivals

Ah I know. Well that’s bonkers anyway. Whatever about the EU, that needs to be stopped immediately

bladespin

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

So are the anti travel mob saying

1. No international travel until a vaccine?

2. Quarantine on arrival in the country if you do for 14 days until there’s a vaccine?

Pretty much, there was also a suggestion of a sinus swab (whatever they wanted that for - fetishists).

Tenzor07

DebDynamite wrote: »

Maybe we should aim for a full opening up of the country, try and get kids back to school, which will in turn allow parents to get back to work. Would that not helping the economy more than the small amount of tourists we’ll get into the country compared to the usual numbers, and the amount of Irish holiday makers leaving the country to go to the sun.
We should concentrate on getting the kids back to school first and see how we fare with all pubs open, and then we should open up for travel

Like others have said, not everyone has kids or kids of school going age so the notion the Govt. seems to have of keeping the quarantine in place is unfair to 10's of thousands of people who want to go visit their families abroad or take a well earned break.

The other issue is that if you're keeping the country all but closed to tourism and keeping the airports running at a very low capacity, then all those peoples jobs are on the line, so the issue of "allowing the parents to get back to work" won't be an issue at all as the parents won't have a job to go to very soon.

charlietheminxx

facehugger99 wrote: »

Why would anyone need to be "honest " about their holidays?

It's my private life, away from work and nobody's business but my own.

You may have swallowed the guilt-trip propaganda that RTE and the politicians are peddling but hopefully not everyone is so minded.

Dangerous road we're heading down, civil liberties and personal freedoms are willingly being traded away by some on the promise of "safety" - it's already apparent how difficult it is to win these liberties back.

I've explained how it is other people's business. If you infect "Mary" in work, and she ends up on a ventilator, do you not think you're responsible?

Saying I'm swallowing guilt-trip propaganda while ranting about your civil liberties to sit on a beach in Spain, spare me your self-centered diatribe. You can take your holiday and choose to ignore the requirement to self-isolate but it is not a big ask to at least inform your employer if you're going to do that, rather than you making the decision for everyone. Do you not think that infringes on their personal freedoms to not work beside someone who is just off the plane?

I knew someone who died of this illness, so maybe I just take it more seriously than you. I can't even begin to see from your perspective, it just seems so selfish and ME ME ME and MY RIGHTS and MY PRIVACY and MY CHOICES - if you live in a society you should understand your choices affect other people.

DebDynamite

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

So are the anti travel mob saying

1. No international travel until a vaccine?

2. Quarantine on arrival in the country if you do for 14 days until there’s a vaccine?

I’m saying hold off until September. If we can open up the economy safely and get the schools back, open back up. As I said above, if it contributes to a spike in numbers which isn’t sustainable and will put pressure on our services, bring back the restrictions. Hopefully by then the rest of Europe will have caught up and be at the same level as us and we can have travel between equally safe countries.

Re quarantine, if travelling from counties who are managing just as well as we are, no need. If travelling from unsafe countries, 14 day quarantine, or two negative Covid tests over 5 days and and you can go on your way