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Will you download the contact tracing app?

jetsonx

I know privacy is very important to people but I fear that drastic times call for drastic measures.

Let's say the Irish Government introduced a smartphone app tomorrow to prevent the spread of COVID-19. The app would record all your movements and triage the data against the movements of those infected with COVID-19. An app which could save thousands of lives.

Would you allow this app to be installed on your smartphone?

(The data would be solely used by health authorities)

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Comments

Idioteque

average_runner wrote: »

Bluetooth is on all the time on my phone and battery lasts a full day easily. Depends on your quality of phone and age

I think usage plays a big part - how many calls you make, videos you watch, moving around etc.

GarIT

El Weirdo wrote: »

In the app.

In the app is showing as 200k for me.

GarIT

Idioteque wrote: »

I think usage plays a big part - how many calls you make, videos you watch, moving around etc.

Bluetooth 4 introduced low energy Bluetooth which uses almost 0 battery.

[Deleted User]

GarIT wrote: »

I hate these nutters that think this app is sending off a load of data. It has been throughly reviewed by the public who know how to and are the most privacy concered along with Apple and Google for compliance with their no tracking requirements to be allowed to be listed as the official covid app in a country.

They're usually the uninformed and will argue that "I have nothing to hide" if they use the likes of Facebook, Google etc or when you highlight that even without accounts these companies create profiles on you based on trackers on the vast majority of websites.

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

I have made the choice not to download the app.

Just heard both Michael Martin and Stephen Donnelly speaking on covid and other related issues.

Varadkar and Harris did it better

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

I don't think that you are a "sheep"
Do whatever you want . Enjoy

Maybe you should do whatever you want instead of making up nonsensical excuses to not do something.

_Brian wrote: »

Downloaded it yesterday
No big deal.

If you think your phone isn’t tracking you already or the hse doesn’t have your details already your delusional.

This, the likelihood of something on your phone not tracking you is extremely slim. I've gone out of my way to reduce tracking on my phone but I know it's still happening.

Regardless of how much this app actually tracks (I don't think it's anywhere near as much as FB/Google/Amazon etc) it is, at the very least, beneficial to society and doesn't line the pockets of gargantuan, largely unaccountable data mining companies.

Curtis Cuddly Marsh wrote: »

I bet the fools who won’t install this app for privacy fears have Google Maps installed.

And WhatsApp, Facebook, Instagram, Snapchat and the best tracker of the lot, TikTok.

is_that_so wrote: »

So people who don't do as I do are fools. Very open-minded of you!

This app is much less of a data security concern than the likes of Google maps. It's not a case of "people who don't do as I do are fools" but a case of actual facts. Like empirical data instead of feelings.

El Weirdo wrote: »

And will let everyone know that they're not installing it on Facebook.

Then they'll slowly get more and more "Just a flu" or "It's a hoax" news stories on their FB feeds. Guarantee that.

Downloaded it this morning. Nice app, well put together and runs smoothly. Well done to the developers, it's easy to use for those who are less technically savvy.

GarIT

Idioteque wrote: »

Yeah I think this could be a problem. With most modern Smartphones barely lasting a day, Bluetooth usually eats your battery so if you're out and about and you need your phone, usually the first thing to turn off is Bluetooth.

Hopefully there's some sort of low-power Bluetooth state if it recognises you're not moving around etc. otherwise I think many will uninstall it if their phone lasts half its usual time due to BT being on constantly.

There has been for several years. Bluetooth using battery is an old wives tale now.

s7ryf3925pivug

Yes I'll download it today.

Failing to install it might result in unnecessary suffering and death as a result of me personally spreading the disease when I might have been made aware I might have it.

Installing it is very unlikely to result in any bad effect for me whatsoever.

So I'll install it because it is in line with my philosophy of not being a cnut.

plodder

Idioteque wrote: »

Yeah I think this could be a problem. With most modern Smartphones barely lasting a day, Bluetooth usually eats your battery so if you're out and about and you need your phone, usually the first thing to turn off is Bluetooth.

Hopefully there's some sort of low-power Bluetooth state if it recognises you're not moving around etc. otherwise I think many will uninstall it if their phone lasts half its usual time due to BT being on constantly.

It uses Bluetooth low energy (BLE) which a lot of people are already using constantly with smart watches etc. The good thing is that the background battery usage is entirely the responsbility of Apple and Google, rather than the app creators. So, if there is a problem with it, it will affect all countries apps and you can be sure that Apple and Google will work to fix it.

[Deleted User]

Kayla High Molding wrote: »

Yes I'll download it today.

Failing to install it might result in unnecessary suffering and death as a result of me personally spreading the disease when I might have been made aware I might have it.

Installing it is very unlikely to result in any bad effect for me whatsoever.

So I'll install it because it is in line with my philosophy of not being a cnut.

No way to convince you to join in on the Tinfoil Hat Train?

KyussB

Ya privacy is so passé these days.

So judging by how this works, if any private person can identify your unique id, they can track where you are in person by pinging your phone - possibly requiring a bit of extra tech to do this, for range and directionality, but nothing as complicated as e.g. the stingray networks for mobile phones.

So it seems rather like it's only a matter of time before someone writes an app for that, in short order.

[Deleted User]

1. Bluetooth uses negligible battery.
2. Nobody from Google, Apple, or the HSE is going to empty your bank account or tell your boss you were 2 minutes late back from your lunch.
3. Download the bloody app.

Stark

I see the source code for the app is open source for those people super paranoid that there might be secret tracking stuff in there https://github.com/HSEIreland/

bennyc

In my opinion everyone should be using this , you give up very little personal data to use the app, you don't even need to give up your pone number to use it as it will just let you know if you have been in close contact by an alert, you can then opt to give your number if you would like to be contacted by the HSE.
The Data Protection Impact Assessment (DPIA) is written in plain English which is nice and answers a lot of the queries people would have about data privacy.

plodder

KyussB wrote: »

Ya privacy is so passé these days.

So judging by how this works, if any private person can identify your unique id, they can track where you are in person by pinging your phone - possibly requiring a bit of extra tech to do this, for range and directionality, but nothing as complicated as e.g. the stingray networks for mobile phones.

So it seems rather like it's only a matter of time before someone writes an app for that, in short order.

The ids change every 15 to 20 minutes and they are random. So, good luck with identifying someone that way.

B.A._Baracus

How does the app work?
You simply add who were in contact with that day or something?

Van.Bosch

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

How does the app work?
You simply add who were in contact with that day or something?

You do nothing. The app knows if it was in contact with others. If one of them gets Covid, then your app will be notified and you’ll be recommended to get tested.

GarIT

KyussB wrote: »

Ya privacy is so passé these days.

So judging by how this works, if any private person can identify your unique id, they can track where you are in person by pinging your phone - possibly requiring a bit of extra tech to do this, for range and directionality, but nothing as complicated as e.g. the stingray networks for mobile phones.

So it seems rather like it's only a matter of time before someone writes an app for that, in short order.

Thats simply not possible. For someone to identify your unique ID they would need to be within 2m of you and nobody else. Or stay within 2m of you for a long time.

Assuming someone can identify your unique ID they person would need to keep within 2m of you to track you. At that point I suggest you just use your eyes to follow where the person is going, or maybe even hold their hand might be more effective at tracking them from within 2m.

And to add to all that access to those services is blocked, you'd need a hacked Operating System or to design a physical device.

El Weirdo

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

How does the app work?
You simply add who were in contact with that day or something?

No.

The app looks for other apps in your vicinity using Bluetooth. You have to do feck all after switching it on.

murpho999

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

How does the app work?
You simply add who were in contact with that day or something?

No,that's not the idea at all.

The app does all that once other people have the app as well.

If somebody gets COVID they upload a HSE code and people who were in the vicinity of that person with their phones will get notified.

murpho999

Idioteque wrote: »

Yeah I think this could be a problem. With most modern Smartphones barely lasting a day, Bluetooth usually eats your battery so if you're out and about and you need your phone, usually the first thing to turn off is Bluetooth.

Hopefully there's some sort of low-power Bluetooth state if it recognises you're not moving around etc. otherwise I think many will uninstall it if their phone lasts half its usual time due to BT being on constantly.

Sorry but most modern smartphones last more than a day.

Bluetiooth barely eats into the battery and it can be used without worries. I have bluetooth on my phone all day with constant connections to a watch and headphones and the battery impact is negligible.

Battery anxiety is not a valid reason to refuse to use the app.

I would say you're wasting more of your battery by turning bluetooth on and off constantly rather than simply just leaving it on.

ELM327

I will not be downloading this.

[Deleted User]

Pauliedragon wrote: »

No. Ill try again later.

Are you connected to Wifi? Possibly at work? My company uses a UK server, so anytime I connect to Wifi at work they think I am in the UK

Get Real

Having initially been reluctant when I heard of the idea of such apps back at the start, downloaded this one today.

Don't need to give phone number, data used for covid purposes only and also, interesting to look at the stats and contribute your part.

Anyone with privacy concerns, I'm sure you use one of Tinder, Facebook, Google maps, Instagram, Gmail, Duolingo, any mobile games, Snapchat, weather apps, YouTube, appstore, play store. By downloading this app, you're at no more risk of any real or percieved danger if anything negative happening imo.

We give alot of information up by using the internet every day, including on boards.ie.

KyussB

plodder wrote: »

The ids change every 15 to 20 minutes and they are random. So, good luck with identifying someone that way.

Where does it say this?

KyussB

GarIT wrote: »

Thats simply not possible. For someone to identify your unique ID they would need to be within 2m of you and nobody else. Or stay within 2m of you for a long time.

Assuming someone can identify your unique ID they person would need to keep within 2m of you to track you. At that point I suggest you just use your eyes to follow where the person is going, or maybe even hold their hand might be more effective at tracking them from within 2m.

And to add to all that access to those services is blocked, you'd need a hacked Operating System or to design a physical device.

It's not hard to greatly extend the range with added equipment. If your anonymous code is updated in as short a time as 15-20 minutes, though - then that would make it a lot harder.

listermint

KyussB wrote: »

It's not hard to greatly extend the range with added equipment. If your anonymous code is updated in as short a time as 15-20 minutes, though - then that would make it a lot harder.

Ugh

Just Ugh

So much ugggggggggggggggggh

GarIT

KyussB wrote: »

It's not hard to greatly extend the range with added equipment. If your anonymous code is updated in as short a time as 15-20 minutes, though - then that would make it a lot harder.

It is actually, Bluetooth range drops on a logarithmic scale. You would need a device 10 times more powerful with a 10 times larger antenna to double the range.

eldamo

downloaded and installed

I AM A PATRIOT!

or BAAAAA! whatever floats your boat

brianomc

KyussB wrote: »

Where does it say this?

https://covid19-static.cdn-apple.com/applications/covid19/current/static/contact-tracing/pdf/ExposureNotification-FAQv1.1.pdf

FAQ Point 5. It changes every 10-20 minutes

blackbox

Just downloaded and activated it.

It seems to be OK. My only concern is battery usage, so I'll see how that goes over a few days.

ibarelycare

I've an iPhone 11, using iOS 13.3.1, and when I download the app it says to enable Contact Tracing, you need to upgrade to the latest version of Apple iOS. But there are no more up to date versions available

Anyone else having this issue?