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Child Item

How will schools be able to go back in September?

shoppergal

Just wondering if anyone can give any insight into how schools could safely re-open in September?

Everyone I'm talking to is saying they won't be back until September but in my head I'm wondering how they'll re-open even in September? The virus will still be there with a vaccine still months away at that stage.

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History Queen

Scoondal wrote: »

For Primary Schools its 50 missed days. If I did that Tusla would be notified.

Yes they would.

wirelessdude01

Scoondal wrote: »

For Primary Schools its 50 missed days. If I did that Tusla would be notified.

Well in our school there have been no missed days. Teaching is going on as is learning. Not as what we consider normal but it is happening.

Not our fault that our buildings are off limits for our children.

downthemiddle

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

I think you'll find some fallout from this when the schools are back open and children are so used to having months of one to one tuition with parents.

It's going to be a tough few weeks to get them back into a classroom learning environment.

I think you will find that no matter how well the parent has done the expertise of the teacher will shine through despite the fact that they will, in many cases, be dealing with up to thirty times that number.

The first month back is always spent establishing routines. It is nothing new for a teacher.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

downthemiddle wrote: »

I think you will find that no matter how well the parent has done the expertise of the teacher will shine through despite the fact that they will, in many cases, be dealing with up to thirty times that number.

The first month back is always spent establishing routines. It is nothing new for a teacher.

Yep big classes here are going to add to the headache, 33 pupils in our primary one.

It started out with 23 pupils in junior infants and classes split up and merged etc as the years progressed.

Scoondal

Treppen wrote: »

What? this is what all parents have to deal with in all schools... or some parents... or just you?

I am stating my experience. Four months later, asking for a note to say that a school absence is registered as "unexplained".
Obviously, if my son missed two days school without a note ... it is "unexplained". The school wanted me to send a note confirming my son's two days unexplained absence. Anyone who does not see the idiocy of this should not comment.

Scoondal

Only in Ireland would someone have to send a letter explaining an "unexplained absence". This is the stuff that I have to deal with in my son's school.

FishOnABike

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

Children under 14 make up just about 2% of all cases worldwide.

This is despite their propensity for closer contact with peers and their maybe less than exemplary hygiene.

There are plenty of reports online in relation to the ace receptors in children and the reasons why they aren't superspreaders and the illness doesn't really affect them badly in most cases.

There's not many children in nursing homes or working in meat factories. Many studies span the period when restrictions had been implemented and schools had shut down so children would not have been circulating outside their own household. Little, if anything, can be inferred about the susceptibility or infectivity in 'normal' circumstances.

As the criteria for testing includes displaying symptpms, having less severe symptoms may make it less likely that a child would be tested. Some countries only test hospital admissions, again less severe symptoms mean less likely to be hospitalised, means less like Kelly to be tested.

While children haven't been shown to be super spreaders they have not been shown to be any less infectious than adults either.

I've linked to two large scale studies which indicate children should be considered as succeptable and as infectious as adults.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(20)30287-5/fulltext
https://zoonosen.charite.de/fileadmin/user_upload/microsites/m_cc05/virologie-ccm/dateien_upload/Weitere_Dateien/analysis-of-SARS-CoV-2-viral-load-by-patient-age.pdf
If there are other large studies which support a different view I'd like to see them.

downthemiddle

Scoondal wrote: »

I am stating my experience. Four months later, asking for a note to say that a school absence is registered as "unexplained".
Obviously, if my son missed two days school without a note ... it is "unexplained". The school wanted me to send a note confirming my son's two days unexplained absence. Anyone who does not see the idiocy of this should not comment.

They asked you to explain what was unexplained. Why is that such a big issue?

History Queen

Scoondal wrote: »

I am stating my experience. Four months later, asking for a note to say that a school absence is registered as "unexplained".
Obviously, if my son missed two days school without a note ... it is "unexplained". The school wanted me to send a note confirming my son's two days unexplained absence. Anyone who does not see the idiocy of this should not comment.

All this rather than send a one liner email to the school to resolve the issue?

The school is duty bound to follow these protocols.

So you are purposely causing an issue because you don't like the system. A system while flawed, admittedly, was not imposed by your school, and is designed to try flag potentially vulnerable or at risk children. Mind you don't get altitude sickness up on that high horse of yours.

History Queen

Scoondal wrote: »

Only in Ireland would someone have to send a letter explaining an "unexplained absence". This is the stuff that I have to deal with in my son's school.

It is marked as unexplained until note received.

wirelessdude01

Scoondal wrote: »

Only in Ireland would someone have to send a letter explaining an "unexplained absence". This is the stuff that I have to deal with in my son's school.

Why do you have such an issue just writing the note? Not achieving anything from it.

wirelessdude01

History Queen wrote: »

It is marked as unexplained until note received.

But sure that is just too simple. Easier to just cause a stink about writing it.

Beasty

Beasty wrote: »

This thread is about Coronavirus and its impact on schooling. Do not bring your irrelevant anecdotes into the discussion

Any questions PM me - do not respond to this warning in thread

Scoondal wrote: »

For Primary Schools its 50 missed days. If I did that Tusla would be notified.

Scoondal wrote: »

I am stating my experience. Four months later, asking for a note to say that a school absence is registered as "unexplained".
Obviously, if my son missed two days school without a note ... it is "unexplained". The school wanted me to send a note confirming my son's two days unexplained absence. Anyone who does not see the idiocy of this should not comment.

Scoondal wrote: »

Only in Ireland would someone have to send a letter explaining an "unexplained absence". This is the stuff that I have to deal with in my son's school.

Do not post in this thread again

Postgrad10

How would we manage distancing in classrooms? A lot of classrooms are tiny. It’s all well and good in these schools abroad that have spacious rooms for plexi screens and students well distanced from each other.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Why do you have such an issue just writing the note? Not achieving anything from it.

I do think the point is that these rules around attendance need to be revised in light of the pandemic.

Some parents won't send their kids back or maybe not immediately and they shouldn't have the threat of Tusla if that's what they decide is best for their kids.

Also absenteeism will increase as parents will need to make sure that if their child does show signs of (any) illness they are kept at home, no exceptions.

My child was vomited on in school by another pupil earlier in the year, the child's mother when she was phoned told the teacher he was grand give him a drink etc.

Regular occurance I'd say in many schools. How anyone can knowingly send a sick child to school beggars belief. The poor child feeling unwell and then the other children who catch it.

I mean you see it with head lice for example, some of them won't even check their kids heads when a note comes home.

That sort of feckless attitude from parents needs to end now. Hopefully another good thing to come from all of this.

wirelessdude01

Postgrad10 wrote: »

How would we manage distancing in classrooms? A lot of classrooms are tiny. It’s all well and good in these schools abroad that have spacious rooms for plexi screens and students well distanced from each other.

And also a political system that values education and is willing to put money into resourcing it properly. Education is not valued in Ireland. A look at the various threads on boards shows that alot of people just want their child minding service(aka school) back operating.

wirelessdude01

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

I do think the point is that these rules around attendance need to be revised in light of the pandemic.

Some parents won't send their kids back or maybe not immediately and they shouldn't have the threat of Tusla if that's what they decide is best for their kids.

Also absenteeism will increase as parents will need to make sure that if their child does show signs of (any) illness they are kept at home, no exceptions.

My child was vomited on in school by another pupil earlier in the year, the child's mother when she was phoned told the teacher he was grand give him a drink etc.

Regular occurance I'd say in many schools.

That sort of feckless attitude from parents needs to end now. Hopefully another good thing to come from all of this.

But the absence that we are talking about occured in February '19. Nothing to do with the pandemic. Either way with the poster in question with his home schooling their won't be a need for any further absence notes in the future.

Postgrad10

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

And also a political system that values education and is willing to put money into resourcing it properly. Education is not valued in Ireland. A look at the various threads on boards shows that alot of people just want their child minding service(aka school) back operating.

I completely agree with you. Other than the usual hand washing promotions, what can schools do to prepare?

FishOnABike

Has the Department of Education and Skills issued any guidelines to schools issued any guidelines for schools on how they should operate so that there might be a consistent approach to timetabling, social distancing, hygiene, how to respond to a positive CoViD-19 case in a class/school, etc..

khalessi

Postgrad10 wrote: »

I completely agree with you. Other than the usual hand washing promotions, what can schools do to prepare?

Well schools need to know what direction the government will go. Will it be smaller classes in every second day or for half a day each or splitting classes and bring each half in alternate weeks?

PLanning training course for cleaning staff in deep cleaning techniques, getting funding for deep cleaning and disinfectant supplies for each class.

Short course for staff on cross infection and hand washing and fisinfectant technies so all on same page.

Measuring for 1 metre and 2 metre sd. to start with.

History Queen

FishOnABike wrote: »

Has the Department of Education and Skills issued any guidelines to schools issued any guidelines for schools on how they should operate so that there might be a consistent approach to timetabling, social distancing, hygiene, how to respond to a positive CoViD-19 case in a class/school, etc..

Not that we've heard of.

Treppen

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

Has it escaped your notice that thousands of people are still going out working every day and hence are on full pay???

That's my point.

wirelessdude01

FishOnABike wrote: »

Has the Department of Education and Skills issued any guidelines to schools issued any guidelines for schools on how they should operate so that there might be a consistent approach to timetabling, social distancing, hygiene, how to respond to a positive CoViD-19 case in a class/school, etc..

Not that I'm aware of. I'm guessing that there might be something in relation to a positive case due to the Dublin school at the start of it all.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

Treppen wrote: »

That's my point.

Spanish Eyes

FishOnABike wrote: »

Where does this come from? Children have been shown to suffer the same attack rate¹ and have the same viral load² as adults.

¹ https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(20)30287-5/fulltext
² https://zoonosen.charite.de/fileadmin/user_upload/microsites/m_cc05/virologie-ccm/dateien_upload/Weitere_Dateien/analysis-of-SARS-CoV-2-viral-load-by-patient-age.pdf

What I was referring to was the transmission rate AMONGST children and young adults. That may be happening amongst that cohort with little subsequent illness in the children.
However, the problem is the potential transmission from children to adults, teachers, SNAs, whilst attending school, and parents relatives and so on, on returning from school.

wirelessdude01

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

What I was referring to was the transmission rate AMONGST children and young adults. That seems to be happening amongst that cohort with little subsequent illness in the children.
However, the problem is the potential transmission from children to adults, teachers, SNAs, parents relatives and so on, on returning from school.

No thought given to school staff or their families.

Treppen

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

What I was referring to was the transmission rate AMONGST children and young adults. That may be happening amongst that cohort with little subsequent illness in the children.
However, the problem is the potential transmission from children to adults, teachers, SNAs, whilst attending school, and parents relatives and so on, on returning from school.

Ya shur no problems in the UK
https://www.tes.com/news/coronavirus-revealed-least-26-teachers-have-died-covid-19

downthemiddle

FishOnABike wrote: »

Has the Department of Education and Skills issued any guidelines to schools issued any guidelines for schools on how they should operate so that there might be a consistent approach to timetabling, social distancing, hygiene, how to respond to a positive CoViD-19 case in a class/school, etc..

There is currently no timetable for guidelines. The various representative bodies and partners in education have been in discussions but there is no imminent news. As a result there is quite a bit of unhelpful speculation.
Nobody knows what the landscape will look like in September. We are currently in a very good position as a nation. If people continue to be sensible we will be in a strong position when we move to Phase 5.
Publishing guidelines too early would be a mistake. However, based on past experience, the fear would be that the department will issue a fudge and leave schools to their own devices causing confusion and fear.
Many schools are already examining their options based on social distancing as it currently applies with a plan to adjust accordingly if the guidelines change. It is impossible to say, at the moment, what actions schools will have to take for September.

Spanish Eyes

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

No thought given to school staff or their families.

Indeed, and all families who have kids in a school.

But anyway. The Dutch return to school scheme seems to be working ok. Can't find the link right now, but they have pupils back for two days at a time. Each class is in for two days, then a deep clean, then the next cohort is in for the last two days. Another deep clean.

So Monday, Tuesday..... deep clean Wednesday, Thursday Friday for the next classes. Another deep clean.

I dunno, my NDN has a grandson in school in Eindhoven and this is what I'm told.

FishOnABike

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

What I was referring to was the transmission rate AMONGST children and young adults. That may be happening amongst that cohort with little subsequent illness in the children.
However, the problem is the potential transmission from children to adults, teachers, SNAs, whilst attending school, and parents relatives and so on, on returning from school.

Silent spreading in schools could be a problem alright. Between the already high proportion of asymptomatic but contagious cases and younger children seeming to have milder symptoms it may be more difficult to detect until a more vulnerable person is infected.