[Deleted User] wrote: » Eamon ryan wont get this deal through the greens imo? Theres no appitide in greens to be fall guys for ff/fg again no matter how much they rub his ego...took near on a decade to get back to where they are Why throw it away for few handy pensions???,their front canditdate profile is quiet young and most have 20 plus years left in politics,would seem foolish to me,to go in with ff/fg from a long term view? The shinnerz were lambasted by some in 2016 for not going in,deos anyone still think this is a mistake given their performance last election? No reason the greens cant be largest party in state in few years,if they play their cards right imo
all about the mane wrote: » Ye must be raging ye are down to 4th choice now...after ‘winning’ the election
Yurt! wrote: » You're a nasty sexist mane. That's the only point to be made here. Politics doesn't even come into it.
Edgware wrote: » Of course he's not. One day in power is worth a 100 in opposition. We have enough ***** like the SDs sitting on the fence and looking forward to five years whinging. Joint leaders me arse!
all about the mane wrote: » Whatever makes you feel better
Yurt! wrote: » Try to keep the quality of your posts up would you? You spent an inordinate amount of time slating a woman with outright sexist terms and having a cut at her when she had covid19. You're low-quality and a tremendous bore.
hatrickpatrick wrote: » I have never in my life voted for SF before this election and I gave them my #2 in my constituency, where I normally put all four major parties at the very bottom of my ballot paper. I know many, many, many people my age (mid twenties to thirty) who gave them a high or first preference after never being interested in voting for them before this year. What changed since 2016? Rents went through the f*cking roof, peoples quality of life was utterly decimated from it compared with what people had become accustomed to, and Fine Gael's complete and utter pr!ck of a housing minister was insufferably smug about it, suggesting that people should be happy to be paying far more for far, far sh!ttier living conditions (specifically, describing the BARTA sh!te for €1,400 a month as a "boutique hotel" where you could rent a decent self contained studio for half that only a few years previous) while simultaneously and very publicly blocking the construction of proper social housing (the O'Devaney development was probably the biggest flashpoint among people in my social circle, at least from my own anecdotal observations). Here's the thing: That issue is not going away unless someone actually does something about it. Fine Gael are ideologically opposed to doing what needs to be done. Fianna Fail are, in their current iteration, ideologically opposed to doing what needs to be done. Both parties are directly responsible in different ways for the crisis we have in housing. The generation of voters who have experienced and are experiencing this clusterf*ck over the last two years are not going anywhere. FFG are not going to solve the problem, ergo this cohort of voters is never going to vote for them. And even if they do solve it, they will not be forgiven for the "let them eat cake" attitude they displayed, particularly throughout 2019 (I'm talking specifically about their attitude and the smugness with which they happily condemned a whole generation to a sh!t quality of life and acted as if that was something we should just learn to live with). The reason SF surged between their disastrous LE performance and their incredible GE performance is because the crisis boiled over during the summer of 2019. So many people I know who had been renting since the middle of this decade were evicted for one reason or another and returned after just a few short years to a rental market which expected them to pay orders of magnitude more than they had being paying for orders of magnitude sh!ttier accommodation. And FG - and their cheerleaders - refused to acknowledge that this was an actual problem. I can point to countless posts from this very forum in which people took the "tough, that's life, live with it" attitude despite the very obvious and very universal paradigm that moving from college education and part time work to full time employment is supposed to bring an increase in living standards, and certainly not a massive downgrade as has happened with everyone who lost their rental accommodation in the last year and has had to settle for something orders of magnitude less comfortable for a ridiculously higher price. Those people will not vote for FFG. Even if FFG solve the problem, personally I believe that people have been so screwed and hurt by their policies and their smug attitude to others' suffering that forgiveness just won't be a thing. Those I know who went through this situation feel a visceral hatred towards Fine Gael which in all honesty is more intense than the anger they felt at FF for destroying their prospects just as they were getting ready to leave secondary school in and around 2008. You don't get those people back on your side after treating them the way this generation has been treated by FG. Now, maybe you're right in that the specific vote for Sinn Fein is a transient thing. Perhaps it is. But it's not going back to FFG or their cheerleaders Labour and the Greens. If this generation's faith in SF collapses, their votes will go to SocDems, PBP, independents, and probably a new left wing party which will almost inevitably form in order to capitalise on any such SF collapse. Bottom line is, those voters will not go back to the civil war parties. Not after being wronged by both of them in such a deeply fundamental way.
all about the mane wrote: » Damn right I’ve slated her. She has made an absolute shambles of things since the election. And her with notions of Taoiseach. Hilarious.
markodaly wrote: » You, see the difference between you and I? I will raise those figures once and move on, while you, will spend all day arguing and try and score cheap points, as evidenced by your last post. The figures in the North are what they are, like in the South. Now I have no idea if SF/DUP are playing a blinder or not. But perhaps their politicians should realise that they are actually in government somewhere and their electorate are looking to them for leadership. As I said, less twitter more governing.
Deleted User wrote: » Eamon ryan wont get this deal through the greens imo? Theres no appitide in greens to be fall guys for ff/fg again no matter how much they rub his ego...took near on a decade to get back to where they are Why throw it away for few handy pensions???,their front canditdate profile is quiet young and most have 20 plus years left in politics,would seem foolish to me,to go in with ff/fg from a long term view? The shinnerz were lambasted by some in 2016 for not going in,deos anyone still think this is a mistake given their performance last election? No reason the greens cant be largest party in state in few years,if they play their cards right imo
Galwayguy35 wrote: » The Greens are hated outside urban areas and west of the Shannon, there's no way in hell they could ever be the largest party in the state.
Deleted User wrote: » Shinners once used poll at 1 to 2% (took local SF man 3 elections to get in,last election ge returned with twice the quota)...now shinnerz are largest party for 1st pref under 65 Anything is possible in politics,if you build a platform,good policies and win people around.......though for greens to push on,they likely need to oust eamonn lettuce ryan
blanch152 wrote: » The issue is that they need a two-thirds majority of members to support it. However, have no doubt about it, the Greens at senior level would jump at the chance to be in Government, they want to change things and do it now. They are not prepared to wait. They would actually be happy to make permanent changes to the way things are done and then disappear. That makes them different from other political parties. As for the Shinners, it all depends on whether you are interested in power for powers sake or whether you want to get things done. SF aren't really interested in change, they are only interested in power for powers sake, so that they can push the united Ireland agenda. They will support anti-vaxxers, 5G weirdos and whatever other strange cause just to get into power, not because they actually believe in them.
Galwayguy35 wrote: » SF policies are always going top be popular with voters and a lot of their core vote aren't exactly the sharpest knife in the drawer so telling them they shouldn't have to pay for anything will always be a vote catcher. The Greens on the other hand want to bring in policies that are very unpolular in rural areas.
McMurphy wrote: » Here. Before we go around the houses trying to claim Leo didn't specifically say "criticism/critical of or criticise"" Tony Holohan said "he was not comfortable with the idea of a company chartering a flight to bring in staff" I think we can all agree that he's referring to Keeling's? Leo said. he “shares the discomfort expressed” by Dr Holohan. I think that's safe to say he wasn't too impressed with their shenanigans, you might even say he was critical. Seriously lads.
Deleted User wrote: » Boys yous are gonna drop the notion shinnerz are wasters,there isnt enough votes there to give em numbers they are getting?? I would like to see a manifesto drawn up by new generation greens,before id dismiss em as an option....but noway are they going anywhere under ryan
Galwayguy35 wrote: » I never said they didn't have capable politicans in the party, Pearse Doherty and ML herself would be the best example of this. But the same tired old story they peddle of tax the rich for everything and the spending and house builds they were promising at the last election was off the wall.
blanch152 wrote: » More fools those who fell for the SF palaver. The ones blocking social housing development were the SF-led councils. Thankfully last year's local elections rid us of that scourge.
tikkahunter wrote: » https://www.independent.ie/world-news/coronavirus/sinn-fein-td-apologises-after-falsely-claiming-17-people-died-in-one-nursing-home-39149665.html
markodaly wrote: » That's lovely of course, but again, you are speculating, the fact is you don't know if your prediction will be the actual outcome.
It may be strong now, but those younger people you harp on about, they will get jobs, buy a property, and become part of the establishment so to speak. The older you get, the more conservative you become. It's as true as night becomes day.
Votes will therefore go back to FF/FG, they will not all just move to a new party.
Don't you think this clouds your judgement then? Its a very small sample size.
Yes, younger voters who may not have as much to lose. Now though, they probably have lost their jobs and may have a different mindset? Whatever you think about FG, they did a good job in creating policies that created lots and lots of jobs.
Easy to forget that in good times, now though with unemployment at 22% it will focus minds, a lot!
Why? FF more than doubled it seats in GE 2016 after the debacle of GE 2011. You think after 9 years of FG in power, a few years away from the hot seat, FG won't come storming back? They will just disappear into nothing? FF too?
I can easily see FG storming back after an SF led left-wing government failing, that will ultimately disappoint as they will over-promise (its in their nature). Again, a 25-year-old voter who has just graduated is a very different beast to a 45-year-old taxpayer voter and property owner.
McMurphy wrote: » Not so for the victims of the troubles though, no need for me to link back to my post outling how you have had 100s of posts using the deaths of others to point score for years now - it's there for all see - and they will return soon after this pandemic passes, as sure as night follows day. You quoting the wrong poster? Or did mark buy a dog that's not yet up to speed on who its supposed to be barking at?
Bowie wrote: » You did the very thing you castigated others for allegedly doing. That's it simply. Now you say you do, but don'y harp on it and in the same post re-visit it
Yurt! wrote: » Were you not paying attention to what was going on the past couple of years?
Deluded. The combined share of FF/FG votes has plummeted like property ownership rates over the last few elections. This is a permanent change in the Irish political landscape, and the 'big two' created it.
45 year old property owners don't magic into existence like some law of nature. The conditions for affordable home ownership need to be there.
The algorithm has changed and quite frankly the traditional big two parties are without a map. In any case, the housing situation, as massive a failure as it is, is just one front.
all about the mane wrote: » That clown o’Reilly accusing the government of kite flying.
A Sinn Fein source said: “Dessie just got his facts wrong.” It is understood Mr Ellis based his statement on information he had received locally in his constituency.
hatrickpatrick wrote: » Of course I'm speculating, but I'd bet my life savings on it with little hesitation. The utter hatred for FFG among the vast majority of people I know from my own generation, spanning pretty much the whole spectrum of socioeconomic classes, speaks for itself. The fact that pretty much the entirety of social media and the actual results of the last election bear that out are why I'm confident these aren't mere guesses on my part.
They won't buy property unless someone solves the affordability situation, that's literally the whole point of everything we're arguing about here. The ladder has been pulled up so that this generation is unable to get on it and FFG are directly responsible for that.
See above. You're making the idiotic assumption that FFG will solve the housing unaffordability crisis. The reason they're being destroyed in elections isn't because they can't, it's because they won't. They refuse to. They don't care about it.
That would be a fair comment if the results of the election, and the demographic breakdown of those results, weren't perfectly in line with what I've been saying.
And because FFG refuse to tackle housing or the overall spiralling cost of living, having a well paying job doesn't do jack sh!t for one's quality of life. That's literally exactly what I've been saying for this entire thread - people were able to afford better living standards on part time incomes five years ago than they can on full time incomes, because the cost of living and housing have risen by orders of magnitude faster than average incomes, and Fine Gael seem to be perfectly happy with this - smugly and bizarrely cheerleading falling living standards as "progress". Unless that changes, they will not be able to win over this generation.
See above. The cost of living is too high regardless. And FFG refuse to tackle it. Unless they do, people who have been voting against them will not be changing their minds.
Again, if the cost of housing and the cost of living aren't tackled, we are headed for very profound changes to our political climate. The shoots of that can already be seen with the latest GE results.
You're acting like the cost of living crisis is temporary. It could be, but it won't be under FF or FG, because they have categorically refused to do anything about it except fiddle while Rome burns. Honestly I don't understand what you're not getting here. Your entire argument is built around the assumption that people are going to escape from the stagflation trap. They won't unless government policy tackles that stagflation, and FFG are ideologically opposed to prioritising quality of life above macroeconomics.
markodaly wrote: » They are a ****ing joke. Peddlers of fear and fake news.
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