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Relaxation of restrictions

Red Alert

Simon Harris curiously made a comment that there was a limit to how long people could put up with extreme level of restrictions as we currently have. Already we’re seeing in Italy that people are starting to get restless. So two big questions:

1) on Easter Sunday, do you think there will be further restrictions, no change with just an extension or some relaxation?

2) what will be the first thing rolled back?

My own guess would be: extension for at least 1 week. Then to allow some businesses like DIY shops to reopen, perhaps allow gatherings of 2/3 people, maybe a token increase on 2km.

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pjohnson

JRant wrote: »

Has it occurred to you that maybe the children don't want to be with their parents 24/7 either?

They need to spend time with peers, almost like regular human beings.

Maybe for some parents this is a wake up call to spend more time with their children. Maybe an awful lot of parents already do that anyway.

Must be fantastic to live is such a black and white world while making blanket statements about something you have absolutely no insight into.

Not a bad counter. Given some of the nonsense their parents are spouting they may well want to get out of there for some intelligent conversation.

Ray Donovan

1 day a week for primary schools is the most creative solution they came up with??

How about this and I’m just spitballing here:

Say a school has 200 pupils and 12 teachers including Special Ed.

Monday to Wednesday lunchtime - 100 kids are brought in and split into the 12 rooms and taught by the teachers in a ratio of 8/9 pupils to 1 teachers.

At lunchtime on Wednesday these 100 kids go home and the other 100 come in and repeat.

No children withdrawn for Special Ed unfortunately due to logistics etc.

Just a thought but probably a million reasons why this couldn’t happen.

JRant

kalkat2002 wrote: »

But they are vectors
Will you justify any grandparent or even kids death ?

What's your vector Victor?

Sensationalist comments like this are completely unwarranted.

Glenomra

Isaac Ben Israel an Israeli scientist has an interesting mathematical based conclusion that the virus burns itself out in every country it has hit after approximately 70 days regardless of lockdown etc. Maybe it has already been discussed. And sorry I can't link...of an age....

Professor Moriarty

Ray Donovan wrote: »

1 day a week for primary schools is the most creative solution they came up with??

How about this and I’m just spitballing here:

Say a school has 200 pupils and 12 teachers including Special Ed.

Monday to Wednesday lunchtime - 100 kids are brought in and split into the 12 rooms and taught by the teachers in a ratio of 8/9 pupils to 1 teachers.

At lunchtime on Wednesday these 100 kids go home and the other 100 come in and repeat.

No children withdrawn for Special Ed unfortunately due to logistics etc.

Just a thought but probably a million reasons why this couldn’t happen.

Eminently sensible suggestion. Logistics seem good. Maybe a concern for the teacher's health?

ceadaoin.

pjohnson wrote: »

The "open up" crowd would willingly sacrifice their own parent if it meant they could start making money.

No they wouldn't ffs. At some point people won't be able to put food on the table or a roof over their heads if they can't work. Not sure its about "making money", more "surviving". The evil bastards.

Ray Donovan

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Eminently sensible suggestion. Logistics seem good. Maybe a concern for the teacher's health?

Possibly Yes.

But one day in front of 33 kids or 5 days in front of 8 probably doesnt make much odds.

Definitely a safer option for the kids.

kalkat2002

JRant wrote: »

What's your vector Victor?

Sensationalist comments like this are completely unwarranted.

Dont be wrong is a cientific fact
Check it out steisy

pjohnson

ceadaoin. wrote: »

No they wouldn't ffs. At some point people won't be able to put food on the table or a roof over their heads if they can't work. Not sure its about "making money", more "surviving". The evil bastards.

If they havent heard of the 350 a week payment from the government to make up for any lost earnings then they probably dont have much chance of survival. Its been very well publicised. Sure it mightn't get them 5 star meals in fancy hotels or avocado or shìte like that that they are used to but it would allow survival.

Professor Moriarty

Ray Donovan wrote: »

Possibly Yes.

But one day in front of 33 kids or 5 days in front of 8 probably doesnt make much odds.

Definitely a safer option for the kids.

I'm sure you'd manage the social distancing for the kids. Maybe the younger ones not so much. Also the teacher would have responsibility for H&S and wellbeing which would probably necessitate close contact at times.

easypazz

pjohnson wrote: »

Not a bad counter. Given some of the nonsense their parents are spouting they may well want to get out of there for some intelligent conversation.

I pity the kids living in a lockdown until a vaccine house.

JRant

pjohnson wrote: »

Not a bad counter. Given some of the nonsense their parents are spouting they may well want to get out of there for some intelligent conversation.

Well, it's probably time to move past witty retorts and maybe begin in some constructive conversation around it.

We will open up and it looks like sooner rather than later. To me this is great news and shows we now have a handle on this. A month ago this was something I think we were all worried about.

If opening up schools and creches in the next few weeks means we need to have more of a community effort in supporting our elderly then I'm all for that. In fact, it's long past time that we started to be more proactive in helping elderly people around us and stop relying on the government for it.

I know my own area started a group to help the elderly, picking up prescriptions, doing their shopping, doing a bit of gardening for them etc. It's also been done in many communities around the country and talking to everyone involved we have no intentions of stopping just because some restrictions are being lifted.

You know this has been a terrible thing for so many people but an awful lot of good has come from it. Maybe I'm just overly optimistic but we can live in hope.

Professor Moriarty

pjohnson wrote: »

If they havent heard of the 350 a week payment from the government to make up for any lost earnings then they probably dont have much chance of survival. Its been very well publicised. Sure it mightn't get them 5 star meals in fancy hotels or avocado or shìte like that that they are used to but it would allow survival.

Avocados aren't expensive. They're tasty too.

easypazz

pjohnson wrote: »

If they havent heard of the 350 a week payment from the government to make up for any lost earnings then they probably dont have much chance of survival. Its been very well publicised. Sure it mightn't get them 5 star meals in fancy hotels or avocado or shìte like that that they are used to but it would allow survival.

You obviously don't realise they can't pay €350 indefinitely.

KerryConnor

Most schools are packed to capacity which is where I think the 1 day a week came from. There are no spare classrooms for 8/9 kids to sit in.

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Eminently sensible suggestion. Logistics seem good. Maybe a concern for the teacher's health?

JRant

Glenomra wrote: »

Isaac Ben Israel an Israeli scientist has an interesting mathematical based conclusion that the virus burns itself out in every country it has hit after approximately 70 days regardless of lockdown etc. Maybe it has already been discussed. And sorry I can't link...of an age....

I posted a link to a Times of Israel article yesterday where this was mentioned.

timmy_mallet

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Eminently sensible suggestion. Logistics seem good. Maybe a concern for the teacher's health?

Maybe a hologram of a teacher, projected from their home?

easypazz

JRant wrote: »

I posted a link to a Times of Israel article yesterday where this was mentioned.

I'd say it nonsense, the virus doesn't do borders.

timmy_mallet

pjohnson wrote: »

If they havent heard of the 350 a week payment from the government to make up for any lost earnings then they probably dont have much chance of survival. Its been very well publicised. Sure it mightn't get them 5 star meals in fancy hotels or avocado or shìte like that that they are used to but it would allow survival.

Well, there it is. Keep the avocado lovers lockdown because I'm begrudging, small minded and want everyone to wallow in my own special type of misery

Professor Moriarty

KerryConnor wrote: »

Most schools are packed to capacity which is where I think the 1 day a week came from. There are no spare classrooms for 8/9 kids to sit in.

They don't have to be spare. Ratio of 16/1 pupils to teachers coming into classrooms typically. If half stay at home then social distancing is possible. Logistically it would work but practically, with 5 year olds and teacher wellbeing in the mix, it might not.

KerryConnor

SEN teachers don't have classrooms, they typically have small rooms that might only fit 2 people if you were properly social distancing. Any school I've been in has only 1 classroom per class group.

So imagine that was taken into consideration with day a week idea.

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

They don't have to be spare. Ratio of 16/1 pupils to teachers coming into classrooms typically. If half stay at home then social distancing is possible. Logistically it would work but practically, with 5 year olds and teacher wellbeing in the mix, it might not.

Edit - - maybe they'll have to look into installing prefabs on school grounds if 8/9 number has to be adhered to for 12/18 months

rusty the athlete

The daily increase in deaths in Ireland looks very alarming. Over the last five days it is marginally ahead of the UK, twice as bad as Spain and four times worse than Italy. Really frightening.

ceadaoin.

pjohnson wrote: »

If they havent heard of the 350 a week payment from the government then they probably dont have much chance of survival. Its been well publicised. Sure it mightn't get them 5 star meals in fancy hotels they are used to but it would allow survival.

And that's an indefinite payment is it? Where is the money going to keep coming from if no one is working?

timmy_mallet

rusty the athlete wrote: »

The daily increase in deaths in Ireland looks very alarming. Over the last five days it is marginally ahead of the UK, twice as bad as Spain and four times worse than Italy. Really frightening.

Shocking what's going on in homes and healthcare settings

gnf_ireland

Ray Donovan wrote: »

1 day a week for primary schools is the most creative solution they came up with??

How about this and I’m just spitballing here:

Say a school has 200 pupils and 12 teachers including Special Ed.

Monday to Wednesday lunchtime - 100 kids are brought in and split into the 12 rooms and taught by the teachers in a ratio of 8/9 pupils to 1 teachers.

At lunchtime on Wednesday these 100 kids go home and the other 100 come in and repeat.

No children withdrawn for Special Ed unfortunately due to logistics etc.

Just a thought but probably a million reasons why this couldn’t happen.

I am not sure where you got the numbers from. Most schools would average around 20 students per teacher including principals. The student teacher ratio is 26 if I remember correctly. Our school has around 12 teachers (excl principal) for around 340 pupils.

The sensible way to approach this is to divide each class into say 3 or 4 groups, and bring them in one day a week each (teacher in 3-4 days), and spend the other day correcting homework and setting the plans for the children's work for the remaining days where they continue some level of home schooling.

That would mean around 8 children or so per class, so social distancing is much more possible, within the yard and classroom settings. And those requiring additional supports can continue to receive them.

Does it solve issues across the board - absolutely not, but it does allow a level of social interaction for children in a controlled manner, and if parents don't feel comfortable with it (for example they wish to engage closer with their own parents), then they don't have to send them in. But not everyone has Mammy and Daddy around the corner.

We all need to remember we are social animals and need a level of interaction. Children have effectively been locked up for the last month - and many don't understand what is going on. There is a reason solitary confinement is a punishment in most penal systems !

Professor Moriarty

KerryConnor wrote: »

SEN teachers don't have classrooms, they typically have small rooms that might only fit 2 people if you were properly social distancing. Any school I've been in has only 1 classroom per class group.

So imagine that was taken into consideration with day a week idea.

Edit - - maybe they'll have to look into installing prefabs on school grounds if 8/9 number has to be adhered to for 12/18 months

Not getting your logic. Special needs aside and taking a 16/1 ratio, there are 16 kids are typically in a classroom. If that number is reduced to 8, what's the problem?

alentejo

rusty the athlete wrote: »

The daily increase in deaths in Ireland looks very alarming. Over the last five days it is marginally ahead of the UK, twice as bad as Spain and four times worse than Italy. Really frightening.

The figures look and are shocking at the moment, however those are the reported figures and didn't necessarily occur over the past 24 hours. I suspect those deaths occurred over the past 7 to 14 days.

FishOnABike

It will be a logistical and practical nightmare. The biggest reservoirs of infection at the moment seem to be nursing/residential care homes and healthcare workers.

Any workplace where social distancing and other strict anti-infection measures can't be effectively and consistently implemented will be problematic.

If one worker tests positive they and their contacts will need to self isolate for up to a fortnight.

Next day test results wouldn't help if it takes time for a person's viral load to increase to a detectable level after infection.

With a significant % presymptomatic, asymptomatic or mildly symptomatic carriers it can spread under the radar before being detected.

If a number of people in a household are working the opportunity for infection is multiplied and if there is intra-household transfer of the virus then all contacts in multiple workplaces will also have to self isolate for a two week quarantine period.

With the prospect of repeated, significant, large levels of absenteeism, possibly amounting to effective shutdowns of a business, it would be an extremely difficult environment for any business to successfully operate in.

JRant

easypazz wrote: »

I'd say it nonsense, the virus doesn't do borders.

Could very well be. It does look at it from a mathematical view and how the peaks in nearly every country seems to be about 40 days from first case and after 70 it's numbers are dramatically decreased. This seems to be the distribution regardless of whether a full lockdown has been implemented or not. Probably a bit early to be making such claims but it does seem to correlate with what we are seeing here in Ireland anyway.

gnf_ireland

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

They don't have to be spare. Ratio of 16/1 pupils to teachers coming into classrooms typically. If half stay at home then social distancing is possible. Logistically it would work but practically, with 5 year olds and teacher wellbeing in the mix, it might not.

ratio is 26/1 when principals are included, of which many are non-teaching. Most classes in big schools have ~30 per class

Not every student is 5 years old ! The very youngest of a 13-14 year cycle are.