Relaxation of restrictions

khalessi wrote: »

I was watching a video on either the NY Times or Washington post where doctors were discussing the damage ventilators were doing to hearts and lungs. It is also known that Covid damges the heart if you get it bad enough

Re percetage of deaths of young people even 1 is too many especially if it is the 1 from your family

Ye look the one is too many is just empty rhetoric. Will we ban private vehicles of the road? Sure if it saves one life!

I'd be interested to watch said video if you can find it. Again, is it known? I find it hard to believe considering this has only been around since December.

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

You can google the first question yourself. Regarding your second request, it's not a claim it's a fact.

You made the claim. Back it up. You can't say that many healthy young people are dying and not expect someone to ask for evidence.

The fact that it can effect the heart is worrying, however

"Heart damage isn't typical in mild cases of COVID-19, and tends to occur more often in patients who have severe symptoms and are hospitalized, she said".

Is quite important. The overwhelming majority of cases are not hospitalised and are mild.

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

You can google the first question yourself. Regarding your second request, it's not a claim it's a fact.

Simple question, how many young people in this country have died from this, ages and numbers please.

You made the claim, you back it up.

khalessi

CtevenSrowder wrote: »

Ye look the one is too many is just empty rhetoric. Will we ban private vehicles of the road? Sure if it saves one life!

I'd be interested to watch said video if you can find it. Again, is it known? I find it hard to believe considering this has only been around since December.

Tell me it is empty rhetoric when it is someone belonging to you.

I will find the video but this stuff interests me and catches my eye as I am a nurse and want to know more about Covid

CtevenSrowder wrote: »

You made the claim. Back it up. You can't say that many healthy young people are dying and not expect someone to ask for evidence.

Watch him disappear for a few hours now. He knows he's beaten.

khalessi wrote: »

Tell me it is empty rhetoric when it is someone belonging to you.

Should we ban motor cars to save lives?

bladespin wrote: »

Not that many really though sadly it does happen

Fatality rate by age

That's an incredible website. I suppose it depends on what you define as young. For me, given the HSE guidelines, I would define people as under 60 as being young in the context of the pandemic i.e. they are not considered to be at risk due to age. Yet they die.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

That's an incredible website. I suppose it depends on what you define as young. For me, given the HSE guidelines, I would define people as under 60 as being young in the context of the pandemic i.e. they are not considered to be at risk due to age. Yet they die.

Numbers?

bluelamp

thomas 123 wrote: »

1 in 5 edging towards 1 in 4 people who contract covid require hospitalizations.

Please, please, stop making things up - what a ridiculous statement.

I swear, some people are genuinely loving the misery of this.

Coronavirus has made me realise how many people love living miserable lives, and love to try drag everyone down with them.

Yes this is a serious situation, but no, its not the "new normal" that so many depressing people seem to be wishing for.

We will go on holidays again, we will drink in pubs again, we will eat out again, kids will go to school again.

Miserable people will still be miserable though.

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

You can google the first question yourself. Regarding your second request, it's not a claim it's a fact.

I certainly can, Prof and the answer is 0.2% under 40 and 0.4% 40-50. And that's before you take into account pre-existing health conditions.
Hardly "many" healthy people.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/coronavirus-age-sex-demographics/

khalessi wrote: »

Tell me it is empty rhetoric when it is someone belonging to you.

I will find the video but this stuff interests me and catches my eye as I am a nurse and want to know more about Covid

In the broad scheme of things it is. Its cold hearted no doubt but sometimes you have to be.

And I'm genuinely curious in watching the video. I'm not trying to catch you out. There's only so much ****e on Netflix I can take

khalessi

CtevenSrowder wrote: »

Ye look the one is too many is just empty rhetoric. Will we ban private vehicles of the road? Sure if it saves one life!

I'd be interested to watch said video if you can find it. Again, is it known? I find it hard to believe considering this has only been around since December.

from 2 hours ago behind paywall

https://www.washingtonpost.com/

scroll down headline Coroanavirus destroys lungs but doctors finding damage in kidneys, heart and elsewhere.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/heart-damage-in-covid-19-patients-puzzles-doctors/

Tell me how

JoeExotic81 wrote: »

It's funny how some people want to default to experts on this. There are literally no experts on this, it's completely unprecedented.

The fact some countries are taking wildly different strategies on this proves as such.

Complete and utter guessing game.

It's not unprecedented in that it was forewarned by several people and SARS, Swine Flu, Ebola etc were similar.

The extent of this is much greater than the above, but it was very much expected that something like this would occur.

If we don't listen to the people who have experience in dealing with the above events, who do you advise we listen to?

khalessi

CtevenSrowder wrote: »

In the broad scheme of things it is. Its cold hearted no doubt but sometimes you have to be.

And I'm genuinely curious in watching the video. I'm not trying to catch you out. There's only so much ****e on Netflix I can take

The video was with an article on ARDs I was reading on either The Washington POst or New York Times. Basically the doctors were saying patients coming in with oxygen levels of 40% not normally condusive with life and they wer ebeing stuck on vents but that maybe due to the damage being done by vents that these patients walking in should not be vented as despite oxygen level they were able to fight it. Just observations doctors have noted over lst few months

khalessi wrote: »

The video was with an article on ARDs I was reading on either The Washington POst or New York Times. Basically the doctors were saying patients coming in with oxygen levels of 40% not normally condusive with life and they wer ebeing stuck on vents but that maybe due to the damage being done by vents that these patients walking in should not be vented as despite oxygen level they were able to fight it. Just observations doctors have noted over lst few months

How do ventilators cause damage?

CtevenSrowder wrote: »

You made the claim. Back it up. You can't say that many healthy young people are dying and not expect someone to ask for evidence.

The fact that it can effect the heart is worrying however

"Heart damage isn't typical in mild cases of COVID-19, and tends to occur more often in patients who have severe symptoms and are hospitalized, she said".

Is quite important. The overwhelming majority of cases are not hospitalised and are mild.

There's a good analysis here. In terms of cases of young people dying, it would seem to be about 2% for those under 60 (those considered not at risk due to age). For example, 1/250 people in their 40s who got the virus died from it. Of course you have to factor in prexeisting conditions.

Yeah, but when people are hospitalised and don't die, they can have very serious and permanent heart and lung damage.

easypazz wrote: »

Watch him disappear for a few hours now. He knows he's beaten.

I'm here.

facehugger99

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

I'm here.

Presumably you can back up your claims so.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

I certainly can, Prof and the answer is 0.2% under 40 and 0.4% 40-50. And that's before you take into account pre-existing health conditions.
Hardly "many" healthy people.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/coronavirus-age-sex-demographics/

So 2.3% of people under 60 who contract coronavirus die from it. That means today that 264 people under 60 have died or will die of coronavirus.

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

I'm here.

Yes and you still haven't told us how many young healthy people are dying.

You have now stretched the age of young to being 60.

Lets say 30 years or below is "young", even "40"

406 deaths in Ireland, 90% over 65

So 40 people under 65 are dead.

How many of these are healthy and under 40 do you think?

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

There's a good analysis here. In terms of cases of young people dying, it would seem to be about 2% for those under 60 (those considered not at risk due to age). For example, 1/250 people in their 40s who got the virus died from it. Of course you have to factor in prexeisting conditions.

That's not many then, considering 98% don't die.

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Yeah, but when people are hospitalised and don't die, they can have very serious and permanent heart and lung damage.

They can, doesn't mean they will. Isn't something like 80% of cases mild anyway, and so not in danger of having these problems. Regardless, If Covid is here to stay, I don't see what can be done about this necessarily anyway.

scamalert

bluelamp wrote: »

Please, please, stop making things up - what a ridiculous statement.

I swear, some people are genuinely loving the misery of this.

Coronavirus has made me realise how many people love living miserable lives, and love to try drag everyone down with them.

Yes this is a serious situation, but no, its not the "new normal" that so many depressing people seem to be wishing for.

We will go on holidays again, we will drink in pubs again, we will eat out again, kids will go to school again.

Miserable people will still be miserable though.

This sums it up nicely, the amount of doom gloomers online is insane some do really live miserable existence, even furthermore those mentally not well will come out with most ridicilous claims and excuses, reality is most people just obey the rules for now, many try to live as normal life as possible, theres no hysteria in shops on streets or in parks, most just enjoy getting out, people still talk to each other taking distance into account, but few really not well in their heads will scream how they are basically killing people doing this- and that we need more measures in place.

Those quite few people can sit here thanking each other all day long pretending to know it all and just spread their misery as if were all doomed forever.

Yet reality is most will go back to normal still go on holidays eat out, sure some will have to strap themselves and save as economy will be in ruins, but wont prevent people to get back to normal in a snap of a finger as social life goes.

El_Duderino 09

khalessi wrote: »

Its not our nature to rebel so I think we could get way with the situation as it stands till end of June and then review.

If you think this thing is going to be over in a couple of weeks so we can permanently lift restrictions in june, then I’m genuinely jealous of your naïveté.

Vulnerable people and those they live with are going to be cocooning until herd immunity is achieved either through a vaccine or people surviving the disease. Neither of those things is happening by June

JoeExotic81

Tell me how wrote: »

It's not unprecedented in that it was forewarned by several people and SARS, Swine Flu, Ebola etc were similar.

The extent of this is much greater than the above, but it was very much expected that something like this would occur.

If we don't listen to the people who have experience in dealing with the above events, who do you advise we listen to?

Listen to, take all the many opinions into consideration, that's all fine. That's not my point. My point is the constant sniping at people for questioning "the experts", when there's every reason to question the current strategy.

easypazz wrote: »

Yes and you still haven't told us how many young healthy people are dying.

You have now stretched the age of young to being 60.

Lets say 30 years or below is "young", even "40"

406 deaths in Ireland, 90% over 65

So 40 people under 65 are dead.

How many of these are healthy and under 40 do you think?

I use 60 as it is the HSE guideline for being at risk as over 60 is considered an age risk. That's why I said young and healthy people will die from Cironavirus and will be left with long term heart and lung problems.

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

So 2.3% of people under 60 who contract coronavirus die from it. That means today that 264 people under 60 have died or will die of coronavirus.

You are the only one pretending "young" is anybody below 60.

Also you said "young and healthy"

You are making a fool out of yourself now "professor"

Healthy people under 30, from the 406 dead in Ireland, how many please?

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

I use 60 as it is the HSE guideline for being at risk as over 60 is considered an age risk. That's why I said young and healthy people will die from Cironavirus and will be left with long term heart and lung problems.

You said "many" young and healthy

The HSE does not class people aged 60 as being young.

youandme13

easypazz wrote: »

No they are not. I have heard of a 32 yo and a 46 yo.

An 18 yo died in England and a 12 yo girl died in America..

Downlinz

JoeExotic81 wrote: »

It's funny how some people want to default to experts on this. There are literally no experts on this, it's completely unprecedented.

The fact some countries are taking wildly different strategies on this proves as such.

Complete and utter guessing game.

The virus is around 5 months old at this stage and thousands of infectious disease researchers and medical professionals have observed it and its characteristics enough to make recommendations.
To say we know nothing or that it's an "utter guessing game" on the grounds of not knowing absolutely everything about it is being willfully ignorant.

Also remember that containment strategies are chosen by political leaders, medical experts can only advise. Many of the most outlandish "strategies" like in Belarus or Brazil are not medically approved.