Masks

the.red.baron wrote: »

It's Slovakia we really need to check out, making the Czechs look sloppy yet again

Smaller country with basically only one city. Half the population of Czechia. Low density. Rural. Less foreign population, less international traffic (air or otherwise). Not sure if it's a good example.

Wibbs wrote: »

To be fair, the Czechs were much more restrictive earlier on, after a false start. They closed their borders for a start. The initial lockdown was stricter and more enforced(though it seems it didn't need to be nearly as much as here) and came into force more all at once than ours. The masks came later from a groundswell of calls from their own people, backed by experts among them. They were more proactive from both top and bottom to try and minimise this virus' impact. All this seems to have served them much better than our own governments lagging behind, reactive, only jump when the WHO and ECDC told them to. Never mind the laissez faire attitude to social distancing among our own population. I sadly suspect if masks became mandatory in Ireland soon(and pigs might fly), without enforcement quite the number here would flout the rules.

Why do you think we're still growing 8-10% daily despite the lockdown?

See attached, no sign of peaking. Compare with the CZ graph.

Just found this https://c19model.com/ simple simulation of Covid-19 spread, you can set up different scenarios to see how it affects the speed of infections. It's very simple, but interesting to see differences between different scenarios, very easy to understand for kids too

Spring Celebrator

McGiver wrote: »

Smaller country with basically only one city. Half the population of Czechia. Low density. Rural. Less foreign population, less international traffic (air or otherwise). Not sure if it's a good example.

Better to compare Slovakia than Czechia to Ireland. Similar size, population. Change of government at the same time. Similar amount of testing.
Ireland 30000 tests (old info from 2.4., hard to find data), 10000 positive, 365 deaths.
Slovakia 29000 tests (today), 816 positive, 2 deaths .

Spring Celebrator wrote: »

Better to compare Slovakia than Czechia to Ireland. Similar size, population. Change of government at the same time. Similar amount of testing.
Ireland 30000 tests (old info from 2.4., hard to find data), 10000 positive, 365 deaths.
Slovakia 29000 tests (today), 816 positive, 2 deaths .

Right.

30k tests in Ireland? That's poor.

CZ is at about 120k. That's twice as much per capita.

Setanter

I got a box of 50 3ply masks on www.pharmacy.ie today.
Seemed pretty decent quality.
They also had packs of 10 for €12.

I have health issues and I live with an elderly relative, I know from all the previous discussions they may only be a placebo but my doctor reckons he won't go out without a mask!!

dfx-

fr336 wrote: »

I keep buying masks without properly researching them! I keep thinking "I need them asap, because what if it doesn't turn up till next week and I get the virus this week?" Sigh...

Anyway just bought two of these which I think are okay https://www.ukmeds.co.uk/hygiene-face-mask-ffp2-n95

Any thoughts?

if you get the virus, you should not be going anywhere or going near anyone to need a mask.

McGiver wrote: »

Right.

30k tests in Ireland? That's poor.

CZ is at about 120k. That's twice as much per capita.

Consistently, it's the volume of testing that makes the difference whatever the country's individual circumstances.

dfx- wrote: »

if you get the virus, you should not be going anywhere or going near anyone to need a mask.

Yes that's a given (although it is actually unclear to me what isolated people who don't have anyone to do their grocery shopping should do if they have the virus and are told to isolate at home, I have a friend who was in that situation and it was awkward ... I think the government should either organise food/medication deliveries for them or force some businesses to deliver to them with high priority).

But FFP2 respirators like the one the poster mentioned also reduce the chances of a healthy wearer catching the virus from others. Based on his previous posts I think this is a key use case for the OP as they seem deeply concerned about catching the virus.

And actually even in terms of protecting others from yourself the mask he is looked at are useful as they don't have a valve. Since there are asymptomatic cases, an incubation period during which you might be contagious with no symptoms, and on top of that we are doing little and slow testing; there are probably many people who have the virus and don't even know they have it (as well as many people who have mild symptoms and don't know if they are caused by the virus of something else). So ideally and once there is enough supply, everyone should be wearing masks (even simple surgical ones) in shops, public transport, etc, to reduce asymptomatic transmissions.

Wibbs

dfx- wrote: »

if you get the virus, you should not be going anywhere or going near anyone to need a mask.

I would agree, it's a pity that asymptomatic spread means not most people not wearing one will continue to spread the virus more. People who are symptomatic and living with others are supposed to isolate within the home as much as is possible and they and those around them should wear masks. But again this risk reduction seems to magically vanish in the outside world of shops and other shared areas.

When we do start to reopen society we will have to wear them, like the Spanish and Austrians and Italians. By that stage hopefully the WHO and if not them the ECDC, like their US counterparts will bypass them and insist on it. Then our crowd of follow the leader may follow suit.

McGiver wrote: »

Why do you think we're still growing 8-10% daily despite the lockdown?

100% agree masks are playing a significant part.

But I also suspect our lockdown isn't as strict as lockdowns in other countries (I am not talking about the lockdown rules themselves, but rather their enforcement and the level of compliance). I could be wrong but I suspect Eastern European populations have a greater tendency to comply in the first place while at the same time their governments are also being more strict about non-compliance than ours.

Seanergy

Kivaro wrote: »

What boggles my mind is the spin on this forum about masks being useless because of the lack of "training".

I could create an animation in about 15 minutes for this.

Will you would you?

fr336

dfx- wrote: »

if you get the virus, you should not be going anywhere or going near anyone to need a mask.

No what I meant is that if I don't have a proper mask this week and I get the virus, I wouldn't be happy. Not that if I got the virus this week I would be going out next week.

Spring Celebrator

Bob24 wrote: »

100% agree masks are playing a significant part.

But I also suspect our lockdown isn't as strict as lockdowns in other countries (I am not talking about the lockdown rules themselves, but rather their enforcement and the level of compliance). I could be wrong but I suspect Eastern European populations have a greater tendency to comply in the first place while at the same time their governments are also being more strict about non-compliance than ours.

People coming from abroad are put into quarantine. Dedicated accommodation for 2 weeks and tested. I can speak only for Slovakia but I think Czechia does the same for few weeks now. Some countries tracking their citizens via phone apps (the infected ones).

https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=stW6y_1586497234

Smaller sized shops have reopened as planned in Austria today - with mandatory usage of masks for people going shopping.

Seanergy

Appears to me from what Dr Nabarro said on RTÉ - Today with Sean O’Rourke show titled Exiting Lockdown 14 April 2020 This link might work

that the WHO will recommend homemade facemasks for countries exiting lockdown and not before, and that's how they save face.

Ireland will continue to plod along.

Would have been fitting for O'Rourke to have a spokesman for the ECDC on at the same time seeing the HSE claims to operate a delayed repsonse on the back of both mouthpieces. Synopsis on RTE

caveat emptor

This guy is a genius. Although not sure how effective.

[Deleted User]

If I was in there I'd be very concerned about the combination of that kind of idiocy with a pump-action shotgun

august12

A good news story:
https://www.clareecho.ie/aircraft-company-owned-by-ennis-man-aiming-to-fly-70-tonnes-of-ppe-to-ireland/

Wibbs

Fair feckin play.

Bob24 wrote: »

100% agree masks are playing a significant part.

But I also suspect our lockdown isn't as strict as lockdowns in other countries (I am not talking about the lockdown rules themselves, but rather their enforcement and the level of compliance). I could be wrong but I suspect Eastern European populations have a greater tendency to comply in the first place while at the same time their governments are also being more strict about non-compliance than ours.

There was no restriction of travel in CZ such as the "no more than 2km" here while long distance travel was banned. And people were allowed going to from work, another difference to Ireland. I don't think the population is more likely to comply, not at all. Czechs are freedom loving, very liberal thinkers overall, live and let live attitude. More likely explanation is proper enforcement of the lockdown and measures. That I am almost certain about in case of Austria as well.

Note: Czech Republic is Central Europe as is Austria... not Eastern, but I know UK and Ireland would use Eastern Europe (incorrectly).

McGiver wrote: »

Note: Czech Republic is Central Europe as is Austria... not Eastern, but I know UK and Ireland would use Eastern Europe (incorrectly).

Side discussion, but I don't think you can categorically state that it is correct or incorrect to include Czech Republic in Eastern Europe, as there simply isn't an official definition of what Eastern Europe is.

In my mind when I said Eastern Europe, there was no such thing as Central Europe, so the country has to be either Eastern or Western (which is in line with the UN classification for European areas whereby Czech Republic is in the Eastern Europe subregion).

If you introduce a concept of Central Europe, Czech Republic will fit in that concept indeed. But it isn't more correct (nor less correct); it is just a different and more granular way to look at the situation.

celticWario

These don't seem like they'd be much use

https://company.playmobil.com/Company/en/Playmobil-mask

but they're cheap and maybe better than nothing? wondering if it's worth trying out

khalessi

celticWario wrote: »

These don't seem like they'd be much use

https://company.playmobil.com/Company/en/Playmobil-mask

but they're cheap and maybe better than nothing? wondering if it's worth trying out

WOnt post to ireland as i tried

Just to show great approach for Covid-19 at work, after keeping bringing up issues about ppe in close contact situations, was handed today two surgical masks for single use and been told to mind them.. So explained they are only for one use, what a big surprise to them.. Apparently don't come back for more is solution lol. Hope any of you guys who's still working is treated better!

khalessi wrote: »

WOnt post to ireland as i tried

Found these

https://www.medray.ie/dental/consumables/disposables/face-masks-and-sheilds/asap-non-woven-facemask-w-ear-loop-3-ply-blue-50-pcs/18491

khalessi

xhomelezz wrote: »

Just to show great approach for Covid-19 at work, after keeping bringing up issues about ppe in close contact situations, was handed today two surgical masks for single use and been told to mind them.. So explained they are only for one use, what a big surprise to them.. Apparently don't come back for more is solution lol. Hope any of you guys who's still working is treated better!

All I can say is thankfully i have my own but that is just a tick the box exercise

khalessi wrote: »

All I can say is thankfully i have my own but that is just a tick the box exercise

Got my ones too, not medical grade ones. The problem is I'm the only one who wears them

khalessi

xhomelezz wrote: »

Got my ones too, not medical grade ones. The problem is I'm the only one who wears them

I teach and have said to my parents when I go back I will wear a mask and I can guarantee I will be the only one. I will look like an idiot but sure they think I am half mad anyhows so lets just add to it, at least I will feel safer.

I did joke about wearing a hazmat suit under t shirt and jeans but that is possibly pushing it