Is it just me or have SF vanished?

Deleted User wrote: »

What's the value of the land you want to give away for free?

SF are talking about scaling up from 50 units to 10,000 units immediately, where do you think these approved bodies are going to come from? What's to stop a developer from applying to be an approved body? What % profit should these approved bodies be allowed make?

And can you answer the other two questions I asked two days ago?

No. From memory, your questions were silly, and I wouldn't be inclined to expend any energy answering them in any case.

And the model is there for all to see (as well as the criteria for Approved Housing Body status) if you'd wish to educate yourself. I think you'd rather remain ignorant though.

FG: ideologically incapable on housing.

Yurt! wrote: »

No. From memory, your questions were silly, and I wouldn't be inclined to expend any energy answering them in any case.

And the model is there for all to see (as well as the criteria for Approved Housing Body status) if you'd wish to educate yourself. I think you'd rather remain ignorant though.

FG: ideologically incapable on housing.

It's just more SF deflection. Rather than address the fact that you want to privatise State assets you just refuse to answer it. A leftwing party in favour of privatisation, another bizarre stance for SF to take.

Anyhow, What's silly about the following questions? I cut and pasted them for your ease of reference.

Do you think a small open economy like Ireland should narrow its tax base and raise corporation taxes?

Dublin City is owed 33 million euro in back rent, how would you collect it and what would you do with people who refuse to pay it?

Btw, are these the criteria you are referring to? Only applies to rental properties I think, but feel free to send me the right link.

https://www.housing.gov.ie/housing/social-housing/voluntary-and-cooperative-housing/approved-housing-bodies-ahbs

Yurt! wrote: »

Except the proposed model isn't to give it away to developers to practice arbitrage, which would be madness.

It is handed over to approved housing bodies who will construct affordable housing for sale at more or less cost of construction.

Way to miss the point, again. Fine Gael will simply never crack housing, ever.

......and what's to stop purchasers re-selling at market value, or renting it out, sub-letting or leasing? Given how difficult it is to fetter property rights in Ireland,

Deleted User wrote: »

It's just more SF deflection. Rather than address the fact that you want to privatise State assets you just refuse to answer it. A leftwing party in favour of privatisation, another bizarre stance for SF to take.

Anyhow, What's silly about the following questions? I cut and pasted them for your ease of reference.

Do you think a small open economy like Ireland should narrow its tax base and raise corporation taxes?

Dublin City is owed 33 million euro in back rent, how would you collect it and what would you do with people who refuse to pay it?

Btw, are these the criteria you are referring to? Only applies to rental properties I think, but feel free to send me the right link.

https://www.housing.gov.ie/housing/social-housing/voluntary-and-cooperative-housing/approved-housing-bodies-ahbs

Not ars*d. You think anyone approves of not paying ones rent if they can afford to do so? Ask someone else your silly question. I'm not playing.

O Cualann are an AHB and co-operative housing body that have already constructed affordable housing for purchase. Go off and do your own research. It's not my job to spoonfeed someone in an ideological psychosis who would probably throw a tantrum and go off on one about Venezuela even if it was spelled out to them.

It's honestly not worth the effort. Your mind is made up, and honestly, I don't care about people like you. There's enough right-minded people in Ireland to talk to about workable policy than to waste time arguing with a closed mind who would deny there is a problem in the first instance.

If you lot spent as much time doing your own research and generating ideas as jumping up and down trying to playing gotcha FG might have a credible housing policy. But you don't, and that's nobodies fault but the wider culture that the party promotes.

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

......and what's to stop purchasers re-selling at market value, or renting it out, sub-letting or leasing? Given how difficult it is to fetter property rights in Ireland,

There's already clawback schemes in place if one sells the property before a certain period of time.

http://www.housingagency.ie/housing-information/living-affordable-home

Honestly lads, do some research.

Do you wonder sometimes why you got spanked at election time at all?

Yurt! wrote: »

No. From memory, your questions were silly, and I wouldn't be inclined to expend any energy answering them in any case.

And the model is there for all to see (as well as the criteria for Approved Housing Body status) if you'd wish to educate yourself. I think you'd rather remain ignorant though.

FG: ideologically incapable on housing.

Do Approved Housing Bodies have directly employed labour forces capable of building the requisite number of houses and if they don't who will they contract with to get them built?

Not getting the vibe that there's a lot of spare house-building capacity out there.

Whatever the model SF choose, it simply comes back to resources and cost - if you want to build at the level they are talking about the resource pool needs to be expnded - that either means paying more (thus blowing their €6.5 billion figure) to encourage people to return to work in building and construction or importing workers from elsewhere, thus creating added demand pressures.

Yurt! wrote: »

Not ars*d. You think anyone approves of not paying ones rent if they can afford to do so? Ask someone else your silly question. I'm not playing.

O Cualann are an AHB and co-operative housing body that have already constructed affordable housing for purchase. Go off and do your own research. It's not my job to spoonfeed someone in an ideological psychosis who would probably throw a tantrum and go off on one about Venezuela even if it was spelled out to them.

It's honestly not worth the effort. Your mind is made up, and honestly, I don't care about people like you. There's enough right-minded people in Ireland to talk to about workable policy than to waste time arguing with a closed mind who would deny there is a problem in the first instance.

If you lot spent as much time doing your own research and generating ideas as jumping up and down trying to playing gotcha FG might have a credible housing policy. But you don't, and that's nobodies fault but the wider culture that the party promotes.

I am asking simple policy questions and tbf, I have completely accepted Lorcan Sirr's approval of the costings etc, rather than be bothered asking why an academic disagrees with what it is actually costing DCC etc.

A simple question like the value of the land shouldn't be hard to answer. Anytime the state gives up an asset for free I would think it's the most basic question to ask, tbh.

O'Cualann (afaik) made a 5% profit on their sites, the AHB are not-for-profit, there is a discrepancy there I think anyone would want to examine, tbh. You brought up the AHB, not me.

Greyfox

Deleted User wrote: »

Dublin City is owed 33 million euro in back rent, how would you collect it and what would you do with people who refuse to pay it?

The money should be took directly from their wages or dole payments. A system like this should of been put in place years ago.

Yurt! wrote: »

There's already clawback schemes in place if one sells the property before a certain period of time.

http://www.housingagency.ie/housing-information/living-affordable-home

Honestly lads, do some research.

Do you wonder sometimes why you got spanked at election time at all?

Eh, that clawback applied when council housing was sold. O'Cualann houses aren't council houses but I take it you would restrict the rights of purchasers under this scheme?

Greyfox wrote: »

The money should be took directly from their wages or dole payments. A system like this should of been put in place years ago.

Hard to see any party endorsing taking money for rent directly from people's dole tbh.

Breakerz

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It's just more SF deflection. Rather than address the fact that you want to privatise State assets you just refuse to answer it. A leftwing party in favour of privatisation, another bizarre stance for SF to take.

Anyhow, What's silly about the following questions? I cut and pasted them for your ease of reference.

Do you think a small open economy like Ireland should narrow its tax base and raise corporation taxes?

Dublin City is owed 33 million euro in back rent, how would you collect it and what would you do with people who refuse to pay it?

Btw, are these the criteria you are referring to? Only applies to rental properties I think, but feel free to send me the right link.

https://www.housing.gov.ie/housing/social-housing/voluntary-and-cooperative-housing/approved-housing-bodies-ahbs

Dublin City Council isn't the only council which has massive rent arrears so do all councils in Dublin and nothing has been done about it for years except producing new reports showing the figures skyrocketing year on year.

Ireland won't be able to determine its own CT in the future if we want to remain in the EU. Ireland can't increase CT without some form of exodus but the current rate is unsustainable because services haven't increased with the level of population and we can't house people so something will have to give. The majority of taxes paid by these companies are payroll taxes which is unfair as it puts too much of the burden on the IT payer.

We've not gotten any better at managing the economy despite what some would lead you to believe.

Breakerz wrote: »

Dublin City Council isn't the only council which has massive rent arrears so do all councils in Dublin and nothing has been done about it for years except producing new reports showing the figures skyrocketing year on year.

Ireland won't be able to determine its own CT in the future if we want to remain in the EU. Ireland can't increase CT without some form of exodus but the current rate is unsustainable because services haven't increased with the level of population and we can't house people so something will have to give. The majority of taxes paid by these companies are payroll taxes which is unfair as it puts too much of the burden on the IT payer.

We've not gotten any better at managing the economy despite what some would lead you to believe.

CT is still under Irish control, would need a new EU referendum to change it, afaik (as we would be giving up a fundamental competency to the EU).

The balance between CT and Income tax is hard to get right, but ultimately, corporations drive employment here.

Yurt! wrote: »

There's already clawback schemes in place if one sells the property before a certain period of time.

http://www.housingagency.ie/housing-information/living-affordable-home

Honestly lads, do some research.

Do you wonder sometimes why you got spanked at election time at all?

Yeah, you only have to hang on in there for 10 years then you get an increasing amount of the profit to keep - and after 20 years any profit realised is yours.

That's a pretty sweet deal for someone who bought in around 2012/13

So you get your home, at a discount, raise your kids then sell up after they clear off and trouser the money as you downsize!

Also, what's to prevent the property being rented out, leased out or moved into a trust?

Or if you split the purchase price so the consideration offered/accepted is on the land, rather than the house?

Deleted User wrote: »

Eh, that clawback applied when council housing was sold. O'Cualann houses aren't council houses but I take it you would restrict the rights of purchasers under this scheme?

20 year clawback arrangements in favour of the council (who provided the land) are already in place in the O Cualann affordable purchase units Including letting which triggers the clawback.

Like I said, do the research.

You're reflexive ideological position is that 'this can't be done' at every turn.

blanch152

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

So how does one "calibrate" a graph?

And it's not just maths SF are bad at - some of their bright young things called to canvass my father-in-law on his farm.......and proceeded with their spiel about SF and agriculture.....which was all centred on beef and dairy farming......they didn't realise they were on a tillage holding and when he asked about grain supports they were, to say the least, perplexed!

You calibrate a graph by excluding bits harmful to Sinn Fein.

blanch152 wrote: »

You calibrate a graph by excluding bits harmful to Sinn Fein.

Well you certainly dont calibrate or set up a graph,where the same axis measures two.different things

This is junior cert level stuff....ironic people sneer at others education,while pedelling sh1t graphs

But lookit,everyone has own way of doing things,even if its inherently wrong,who am i to tell em.different

(Imagine picking a journal.ie graph as your hill to die on though :pac: )

Deleted User wrote: »

Well you certainly dont calibrate or set up a graph,where the same axis measures two.different things

This is junior cert level stuff....ironic people sneer at others education,while pedelling sh1t graphs

But lookit,everyone has own way of doing things,even if its inherently wrong,who am i to tell em.different

(Imagine picking a journal.ie graph as your hill to die on though :pac: )

Really?

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Really?

Hmm.....not quite the bar graphs you were trying to pedel,while sneering at others,though are they

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Do Approved Housing Bodies have directly employed labour forces capable of building the requisite number of houses and if they don't who will they contract with to get them built?

Not getting the vibe that there's a lot of spare house-building capacity out there.

Whatever the model SF choose, it simply comes back to resources and cost - if you want to build at the level they are talking about the resource pool needs to be expnded - that either means paying more (thus blowing their €6.5 billion figure) to encourage people to return to work in building and construction or importing workers from elsewhere, thus creating added demand pressures.

Mary Lou said they will all come home from Oz!!

And she'll direct all construction from hotels and industrial buildings to build 100,000 social houses!!!!

Problem sorted just like that.

Deleted User wrote: »

Hmm.....not quite the bar graphs you were trying to pedel,while sneering at others,though are they

The graphs I was "peddling" (your choice of word, not mine) were from The Journal, so no I would not choose to use bars, but if they do that's a matter for them. I just posted it to illustrate the point that SF TDs are not behind the door when it comes to own/holding land or property.

However, you did post....

Well you certainly dont calibrate or set up a graph,where the same axis measures two.different things

This is junior cert level stuff....ironic people sneer at others education,while pedelling sh1t graphs

.....which I responded to, with a very short Tableau lesson and one example.

Here's another example using bars

FG: the 'it can't be done because we didn't try' party.

Good to see we've moved on from peddling lies about 65k houses anyway.

Only took half a dozen pages and now we've moved on to plumbers don't exist. Who knows where the next half-dozen will take the the true blue contingent?

I wonder how many times Venezuela will get mentioned?

Stay tuned folks...

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

The graphs I was "peddling" (your choice of word, not mine) were from The Journal, so no I would not choose to use bars, but if they do that's a matter for them. I just posted it to illustrate the point that SF TDs are not behind the door when it comes to own/holding land or property.

Like i said,your free to.use meaningless graphs all you want,

I have no interest,nor intention of changing your posting habits

(Just to highlight hyprocrisy)

Yurt! wrote: »

FG: the 'it can't be done because we didn't try' party.

Good to see we've moved on from peddling lies about 65k houses anyway.

Only took half a dozen pages and now we've moved on to plumbers don't exist. Who knows where the next half-dozen will take the the true blue contingent?

I wonder how many times Venezuela will get mentioned?

Stay tuned folks...

You're right - this is an SF-related thread, so the emphasis should be on their [lack of] competence.....

Not even a global pandemic can bring Sinn Fein to welcome help from the Brits…

All in all, it has made Sinn Fein’s leadership in the north seem weak, ineffectual and absent of the mettle to accept Executive decisions. Indeed, their dissent to date has achieved little and if anything, can be construed as frustrating a united crisis response. It can be put down to not much more than Sinn Fein’s failure to exorcise crude legacy ghosts and their everlasting binary inner monologue whispering in their ear that British is bad and Irish is good.

.....we need only look up the road to see what's in store for us when they get in.

Yurt! wrote: »

FG: the 'it can't be done because we didn't try' party.

Good to see we've moved on from peddling lies about 65k houses anyway.

Only took half a dozen pages and now we've moved on to plumbers don't exist. Who knows where the next half-dozen will take the the true blue contingent?

I wonder how many times Venezuela will get mentioned?

Stay tuned folks...

Can you show us where someone said plumbers don't exist?

Or are you spoofing again.

Im fascinated you mention FG in all your posts on a SF thread.

I suppose when there is nothing to actually talk about with SF cause they do sweet nothing anyway you have to fill the pages somehow.

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Can you show us where someone said plumbers don't exist?

Or are you spoofing again.

Im fascinated you mention FG in all your posts on a SF thread.

I suppose when there is nothing to actually talk about with SF cause they do sweet nothing anyway you have to fill the pages somehow.

Tell us how awful Venezuela is again to keep us entertained. You tell that one lovely.

Yurt! wrote: »

Tell us how awful Venezuela is to keep us entertained. You tell that one lovely.

So once again, show us where someone said plumbers don't exist.

Are you gonna answer it?

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

So once again, show us where someone said plumbers don't exist.

Are you gonna answer it?

Yurt! wrote: »

WTF is that?

It won't even play.

So you gonna show us where someone said plumbers don't exist?

Yurt! wrote: »

You're a Spoofer.