JJJJNR wrote: » Also nordic countries have been stockpiling everything needed since ww2.
niallo27 wrote: » Ok in your opinion, do you not think they should be in a lot worse position right now than they are in terms of deaths and people in icu
Danzy wrote: » Sweden is also stricter on who it lets in to ICU.
jaykay74 wrote: » I mean it could be but 50/50 as opposed to 80/20 survival is a lot to put down to general health/lifestyle. Very few smokers here, that might help. But would have thought those factors are only worth a few percent. It probably also indicates the ICUs in Stockholm are not in a stressed/overwhelmed state.
coastwatch wrote: » I think Tony Holohan reported ICU survival rates here are also around 80%, in one of the briefings last week.
sydthebeat wrote: » Are they doing OK?? What's the measure for that? Deaths per capita? Deaths in care homes? Testing levels? All of which they are failing at in comparison to similar countries
jaykay74 wrote: » One stat thats interesting from Sweden is the survival rate of ICU patients. Think in the UK its 50/50 between life and death once a patient enters ICU (I'm open to correction but I saw stats around that when Boris went to ISU). In Sweden so far the survival rate is 80% I think they are quickly to admit to ICU which may increase survival rates. Also from the article I can see there are 320 ICU beds in Stockholm county (220 in the city).https://www.svd.se/atta-av-tio-overlever-intensivvarden Direct link to google translation of article, not sure if that works or not https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=sv&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.svd.se%2Fatta-av-tio-overlever-intensivvarden
Widdensushi wrote: » population of around 2.5 million, maybe the survival rate has something to do with general health /obesity also ?
sydthebeat wrote: » I'm not arguing that at all. I'm arguing if they are doing OK as of now. These "mights" and "presuming" are all hypothetical
Widdensushi wrote: » hard to measure any countries results till the game is over, they might well be losing the first half but in a years time they might have the best results
sydthebeat wrote: » What models? Evidence please.... Are you referring to the "do nothing" prediction? . They aren't doing nothing. Along with increasing the capacity of their health service to cope with the surge, they are doing the following public actions :
niallo27 wrote: » Ok I'll rephrase, with every model we have seen Sweden should have 1000s dead and the hospitals should be overwhelmed. Why aren't they.
What should you be doing to help reduce the rate of infection? In Sweden, the official advice requires everyone to: Stay at home if you have any cold- or flu-like symptoms, even if they are mild and you would normally continue life as normal. Stay at home until you have been fully symptom-free for at least two days. Practise good hygiene, by regularly and thoroughly washing your hands with soap and water, using hand sanitiser when that’s not possible, and covering any coughs and sneezes with your elbow. Keep distance from all other people when in public places. That includes shops, parks, museums, and on the street, for example. The World Health Organisation recommends keeping at least a 1.5-2 metre distance. Avoid large gatherings, including parties, weddings, and other activities. Work from home if you can. Employers have been asked to ensure this happens where possible. Avoid all non-essential travel, both within and outside Sweden. That includes visits to family, planned holidays, and any other trips that can be avoided. If you have to travel, avoid busy times such as rush hour if you can. This reduces the number of people on public transport and makes it easier for people to keep their distance. If you are over 70 or belong to a high-risk group, you should stay at home and reduce all social contacts. Avoid going to the shops (get groceries delivered or try to find someone who can help you), but you can go outside if you keep distance from other people. Read more about the help available to those in risk groups here. By following these precautions, we can all help to protect those who are most at risk and to reduce the rate of infection, which in turn reduces the burden on Sweden's healthcare sector. Read more detail about the precautions we should all be taking in this paywall-free article. Advice in English is also available from Sweden's Public Health Agency and the World Health Organisation.
sydthebeat wrote: » "Would have thought" and "presuming" is not a good way to frame an argument
niallo27 wrote: » I would have thought sweden would have had top quality healthcare. I presume with no lockdown, there are 1000s dieing right now and all the hospitals are overwhelmed.
sydthebeat wrote: » . From :https://www.google.com/amp/s/time.com/5817412/sweden-coronavirus/%3famp=true And:https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00134-012-2627-8 Sweden has only 5.8 ICUs per 100,000. One of the lowest in Europe. They have already started to open a "field hospital" in the city centerhttps://www.thelocal.se/20200406/stockholm-field-hospital-to-open-its-doors-to-coronavirus-patients
niallo27 wrote: » Is the swedish health system overstretched. I'm not saying its the correct approach but people are too quick to dismiss it.
Sweden has the second lowest number of critical care beds in Europe after Portugal, with only 5 beds for every 100,000 inhabitants. The healthcare system would likely be unable to handle a severe COVID-19 outbreak
niallo27 wrote: » Australia are doing very well as well, maybe the warmer southern hemisphere season does have an affect on it. This will be tough on New Zealand though, they will have to lock themselves away from the rest of the world.
niallo27 wrote: » Or people realise that this virus is going no where and we will have to follow this approach eventually.
Augeo wrote: » Indeed, folk seem oblivious to this or genuinely too thick to figure it out.
lawrencesummers wrote: » Not to be pedantic here, but the virus will only be stopped if physical interaction between INFECTED people is stopped. This can been seen from the level of healthcare workers infected. A lot of people have the misconception that the virus is everywhere, it’s not. It has the potential to be. As an island if we severely limit travel into and out of the country, and we reduce internal movement drastically the virus will eventually die off on the island. Precisely what NZ have done. This is complicated slightly by the North having a different approach, there should be a political acknowledgement that north and south will agree to implement changes simultaneously, and when the day comes that The virus is extinct enough in Ireland for movement to recommence we are sandwiched between and rely greatly on travel between two counties whose approach to this has left a lot to be desired. If we open up travel to the US to soon then another wave is all but guaranteed. In the meantime let’s try and be NZ
Gary kk wrote: » ?
