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Masks

fr336

How many people on Boards have a mask and if so are you wearing them for essential trips? And this late in the day where can you get one that is going to be half decent and not from a suspect seller who could have done anything to it?

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take everything

Another question.
Cotton t-shirt material is suggested as having one of the best filtration/breathability ratios.

I'm looking at some cotton t-shirts at home and the fabric has sizeable enough (.1mm maybe) holes in the fabric.

Can anyone reconcile this.

2u2me

take everything wrote: »

What's the story with goggles btw.
Surely any goggles would have to be disposable as well. Or could you wash those.

I'm sure the viral build up wouldn't be anything near that of a mouth mask which has your breath on it.

Yellow_Fern

take everything wrote: »

Another question.
Cotton t-shirt material is suggested as having one of the best filtration/breathability ratios.

I'm looking at some cotton t-shirts at home and the fabric has sizeable enough (.1mm maybe) holes in the fabric.

Can anyone reconcile this.

no, layers of tissue.

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/health-environment/article/3050689/how-make-your-own-mask-hong-kong-scientists

take everything

Wibbs wrote: »

+1. For a homemade cotton type?

Put it on every time you leave the house. Cover your nose and mouth. Wash your hands before putting it on and after you take it off. Only touch your mask by the straps, never at the front. Wash it in hot water to clean.

Job done. And I don't write instructionals. Actually I know a chap, a mate of mine and here on Boards that is qualified in writing instructional manuals. He'd defo come up with a better and shorter set of instructions.

Don't sell yourself short Wibbs!
That was a great instructional 😜😅

I'm enjoying the withering takedowns of the professors and experts with their ever-malleable advice.

Probably because I have a prepper spirit at heart (never did it but probably will when I'm older), never trusted the man (tm) and am as contrary and iconoclastic as they come myself.

Enjoying this thread.

iamwhoiam

take everything wrote: »

Another question.
Cotton t-shirt material is suggested as having one of the best filtration/breathability ratios.

I'm looking at some cotton t-shirts at home and the fabric has sizeable enough (.1mm maybe) holes in the fabric.

Can anyone reconcile this.

We had a look at t shirts and other fabrics, we chose good quality pillow cases in the end as they were lease see throughable

Wibbs

If I was making a mask for myself, I'd be also looking at something like GoreTex breathable rainwear material as an outer layer. It's "waterproof" and breathable and with cotton layers behind it would give good protection I'd reckon. Washable too. If you try pouring water through a surgical mask it holds it, whereas cotton will quickly soak and leak through, hence the outer waterproof layer notion.

Yellow_Fern

High quality building stores sell filters for home heat recovery units and I am sure there are still easily available. Very thick heavy duty

saneman

Wibbs wrote: »

If I was making a mask for myself, I'd be also looking at something like GoreTex breathable rainwear material as an outer layer. It's "waterproof" and breathable and with cotton layers behind it would give good protection I'd reckon. Washable too. If you try pouring water through a surgical mask it holds it, whereas cotton will quickly soak and leak through, hence the outer waterproof layer notion.

I had similar thoughts myself and it seems so did others as it prompted Gore to issue a statement on the matter:
"..GORE-TEX materials are not designed and engineered to provide sufficient airflow to support human respiration.."
https://www.gore-tex.com/pressroom/press-release/gore-tex-brand/statement-from-wl-gore-associates-regarding-gore-tex-materials-and-covid-19

Now I believe part of that statement has a "covering their arse" motive as they state some of their customers have taken to manufacturing PPE using their material. Thinking through it though the breathability of Goretex relates to water vapour from sweat so it probably would be difficult to inhale through it.

Wibbs

Good point S.

2u2me

The better the filter the easier it is to clog. How do the high end masks work exactly? Do those filters need to be changed regularly?

Wibbs

2u2me wrote: »

The better the filter the easier it is to clog. How do the high end masks work exactly? Do those filters need to be changed regularly?

In the half face type respirators with replaceable filters they have a different filters to choose from(though you can mix and match). One type has activated charcoal which is for basically hazardous fumes(though also has a fair whack of filtration), which loses effectiveness as the charcoal gets saturated and "used up". The other type is pure filtration to varying levels. They last a lot longer unless you're in a very dusty environment, like I dunno if you were in an area with a lot of cement dust in the air for a long time. In everyday wear like in this situation they would last a long time.

Now they have a few differences to the one piece mask. About the biggest as far as filtration goes is surface area. The respirator filters are quilted and thicker and much larger in surface area, so will last a lot longer before clogging up.

That said even with the one piece more disposable mask, there is not a lot of "stuff" being inhaled in an every day environment like going to the shops etc. The vast majority of the "stuff" passing through it is air., so I suspect they'd last a fair while in a day to day environment worn for say under an hour per day. I'd reckon it would be exhaled moisture that could be the bigger issue over time?

Just my 2cents 2U. TBH I only know anything about this stuff because I got some instruction from a medical chappess on masks and infection hygiene a few years ago and more because last year I needed filtration for an oddball reason. So I went off and asked some people I know in construction and the like. Then read everything I could about the subject(and fcuk me some of it is deadly boring, flow rates and the like.

) and then looked at the options and ended up buying what I thought was right for my oddball purpose. It just happened through zero judgement on my part to turn out right for purpose with viruses too.

Regarding my original purpose, would I have been as happy just using a surgical mask, or a homemade setup? No, but far far happier than using no mask at all. In fact I simply wouldn't have attempted the purpose without a mask, any sort of mask. Which is my attitude to this virus.

Wibbs

The Doctor John chap has a video up on masks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycf6bAMKgjg

In short, the logic is in, ignore the incompetent gobsh1tes running the HSE, wear a mask.

saneman

2u2me wrote: »

The better the filter the easier it is to clog. How do the high end masks work exactly? Do those filters need to be changed regularly?

In industry use cases there's no hard/fast rule but it's generally recommended that P2/P3 filters for half masks (or indeed FFP2/FFP3 masks) are replaced after each shift, if they become discoloured, or if there's any difficulty experienced inhaling through the filters. It's very much dependent on the environment in which they're being used and the specific risks they're protecting against.

Masks and filters of this type are often manufactured with material that has an electrostatic charge to attract finer particles and offer better filtering efficiency than the material alone. They should be kept in a sealed container when not in use as they will attract dust if left out in the open, reducing their lifespan.

In medical use cases this would be different as protection is being offered against pathogens which that won't in themselves clog the filter but the mask itself becomes a risk factor during use.

Thingymebob

take everything wrote: »

Another question.
Cotton t-shirt material is suggested as having one of the best filtration/breathability ratios.

I'm looking at some cotton t-shirts at home and the fabric has sizeable enough (.1mm maybe) holes in the fabric.

Can anyone reconcile this.

Some Initial research (used loosely!) recommended ‘shop towels’ made from polyester hydro knit... but the brands listed are American so difficult to identify Irish options. Otherwise microfibre towels, providing the fabric is made with a high density of polypropylene.

The materials they’re using are less permeable material than cotton so the masks should be more effective.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8187603/Designers-say-layers-blue-shop-towels-inside-cotton-masks-help-effectiveness-homemade-PPEs.html

stratowide

Wait till July/August and the water is rationed again.

"Stop washing your hands and start wearing these masks...We've got billions of them now."

Wibbs

Thingymebob wrote: »

Some Initial research (used loosely!) recommended ‘shop towels’ made from polyester hydro knit... but the brands listed are American so difficult to identify Irish options. Otherwise microfibre towels, providing the fabric is made with a high density of polypropylene.

The materials they’re using are less permeable material than cotton so the masks should be more effective.

"Shop" as the Americans call garages and the like

And yep I know the stuff and you can get or damn similar in motor factors that supply to the car trade and petrolheads. Here's an ebay ad from the UK for a 1000 sheet roll for around 50 quid.

Away With The Fairies

Was in the two euro shop today, surprised it was open. They had the cheap Chinese knock-offs, the kn95 or something like that. €15 for three masks.

That is scandalous.

saneman

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

Was in the two euro shop today, surprised it was open. They had the cheap Chinese knock-offs, the kn95 or something like that. €15 for three masks.

That is scandalous.

If they are KN95 then the specification closely aligns to that of N95 (USA) or FFP2 (EU). It certainly seems to be the case that KN95 masks are the least scarce at the moment, not surprising since it's a Chinese specification and they commandeered all internal manufacturing capacity of masks when the virus took hold over there. To give some frame of reference at my place of work we sold a number of brands FFP2 masks (back in the "before times" when we could still get them) with prices ranging from €15 - €35 per box of 10.

Tbh, as familiar as I am with them, I don't know how easy it would be to identify a knock-off or defective mask being sold as the genuine article, especially without knowing the chain of supply (not saying that's the case here).

paleoperson

Wibbs wrote: »

The Doctor John chap has a video up on masks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycf6bAMKgjg

In short, the logic is in, ignore the incompetent gobsh1tes running the HSE, wear a mask.

Also the incompetent gobsh1tes running the WHO apparently - recently WHO doubled down on their recommendation not to wear masks citing there was "no evidence" for it.

https://www.who.int/publications-detail/advice-on-the-use-of-masks-in-the-community-during-home-care-and-in-healthcare-settings-in-the-context-of-the-novel-coronavirus-(2019-ncov)-outbreak

Think about this next time WHO says there is "no evidence" for taking garlic or vitamin c or whatever else to help protect against the virus.

There is also "no evidence" that putting a hood on you protects you from rain, but it's clearly common sense and logic that it would work. Such a joke.

Wibbs

paleoperson wrote: »

Also the incompetent gobsh1tes running the WHO apparently - recently WHO doubled down on their recommendation not to wear masks citing there was "no evidence" for it.

Like I say we have to be independent of those fcukwits, whose list of screwups since this pandemic kicked off is long. They even took their sweet time to even call it one.

We have to be independent, just like the Czech people were and they have under half the rate of deaths in a much more densely populated country of over twice our population. We're in the top ten of percentage dead per million and we'll stay that way until we change.

xhomelezz

Watched this video the other day, a bit long, but very clear explanation of what they do in South Korea..

https://youtu.be/gAk7aX5hksU

otnomart

Bought my first two surgical masks last Saturday.
Out food shopping today, so wore it for the first time.
Followed a tip of giving a shape to the nose when I put it on, so it was not too unconfortable.
Was out for no more than 30 mins overall, so when I got home, removed gloves, washed hands, removed the mask and placed it in a open ziploc bag. Washed hands again.
All these new routine steps feel like a dystopian movie, anyway whatever stops catching it and spreading it, must be worth it.

suicide_circus

Wibbs wrote: »

Like I say we have to be independent of those fcukwits, whose list of screwups since this pandemic kicked off is long. They even took their sweet time to even call it one.

We have to be independent, just like the Czech people were and they have under half the rate of deaths in a much more densely populated country of over twice our population. We're in the top ten of percentage dead per million and we'll stay that way until we change.

is it 100% that its the masks in the czech rep that is making the difference?

i have my homemade t-shirt mask, i dont feel it does much tbh but who knows.

as a man with a pro mask, do you feel that having the mask influences your opinion that masks are essential? do you see what i'm saying? and i'm not having a dig

xhomelezz

suicide_circus wrote: »

is it 100% that its the masks in the czech rep that is making the difference?

i have my homemade t-shirt mask, i dont feel it does much tbh but who knows.

as a man with a pro mask, do you feel that having the mask influences your opinion that masks are essential? do you see what i'm saying? and i'm not having a dig

Of course it's not only masks, restrictions were in place much earlier there. Every bit helps I think. Social distancing works with the masks even better, less spread of the virus. Look at some Asian countries, it's a part of their culture, because they already had opportunities to meet different viruses. If it didn't work, why would they bother.

suicide_circus

xhomelezz wrote: »

If it didn't work, why would they bother.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSVqLHghLpw

khalessi

suicide_circus wrote: »

is it 100% that its the masks in the czech rep that is making the difference?

i have my homemade t-shirt mask, i dont feel it does much tbh but who knows.

as a man with a pro mask, do you feel that having the mask influences your opinion that masks are essential? do you see what i'm saying? and i'm not having a dig

I think homemade masks help as they stop droplet spray when taling coughing or sneezing so preventing spread. ALso you arent walking unknowingly through droplet spray. Apparently Sam McConkey was talking this morning on tv about something similat and he totally believes we should all be wearing masks but that it essentially is down to a shortage of availibility

Wibbs

suicide_circus wrote: »

is it 100% that its the masks in the czech rep that is making the difference?

i have my homemade t-shirt mask, i dont feel it does much tbh but who knows.

as a man with a pro mask, do you feel that having the mask influences your opinion that masks are essential? do you see what i'm saying? and i'm not having a dig

Oh god no SC, I get what you're saying alright. Hmmm, ok let me put it this way and an odd way it is.

The reason I got a mask and why I researched like a demon, was because I was fiddling about with some of my very old wristwatches that had radium luminous paint on the dials and hands. The glow is long gone, burnt out by the radiation from the radium, but radium has a half life of 1600 odd years(IIRC). I wanted to remove that stuff safely. Now inhaling even a tiny speck of that stuff would make smoking 60 fags a day look like the healthiest thing since wheatgrass enemas during hot yoga, so I got the mask(and wore goggles and did it outside and kept the parts under a layer of oil just to be safe).

OK that's my madness, but to answer your question SC. If I couldn't wear a mask of any kind, including a homemade t-shirt one, would I have tried to do the above? Not a hope in hell. FWIW most of the time when I go out I wear a surgical type mask, not the full Darth Vader. I'd only wear that if I had to share a car or be in close proximity to someone diagnosed, but if I had neither but did have your t-shirt one, I'd be wearing that no bother. And I'd feel a lot better if I met you wearing it.

suicide_circus

if this were at any other time the term "conspiracy theorist" would be bandied around a lot more. but listen, if we're putting the boot in to the hse and who, i'm on board.

Away With The Fairies

khalessi wrote: »

I think homemade masks help as they stop droplet spray when taling coughing or sneezing so preventing spread. ALso you arent walking unknowingly through droplet spray. Apparently Sam McConkey was talking this morning on tv about something similat and he totally believes we should all be wearing masks but that it essentially is down to a shortage of availibility

There's so much people who don't know how to cough or sneeze properly. I hope they start telling people to wear masks here.

Seanergy

xhomelezz wrote: »

Same for me, when mask is on makes me more aware and more careful. And how to wear one properly is not a rocket science either..

Indeed having a mask on does make you more aware and careful and if you preformed a fit test you might double that awreness sensation. Your completly right it is not rocket science but surgical mask's come with no instructions for the majority of casual users/the public.

The cabbage and his buddies have no reason(in their eyes) to educate the public to the dangers involved in mask wearing because they didn't recommend it, i.e they are not accountable.

The main reason for face touching during use is not a lack of education about why or how not to touch your mask, it's lack of information regarding how to properly put on a mask. A HSE face wearing goon would be taught how to carry out a fit test for non sealed masks at the expense of the tax payer but they refuse to teach us, the casual users.

People's face's are different shapes and sizes. The majority of non seal face masks being sold to casual users are a one size fits all. Casual user's need to preform a fit test after putting on their masks. This action alone will vastly reduce and in many instances elimate face touching/rearranging your mask.

Sorry I got carried away, it's not rocket science, enjoy, more instructions to come asap.