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Relaxation of restrictions

Red Alert

Simon Harris curiously made a comment that there was a limit to how long people could put up with extreme level of restrictions as we currently have. Already we’re seeing in Italy that people are starting to get restless. So two big questions:

1) on Easter Sunday, do you think there will be further restrictions, no change with just an extension or some relaxation?

2) what will be the first thing rolled back?

My own guess would be: extension for at least 1 week. Then to allow some businesses like DIY shops to reopen, perhaps allow gatherings of 2/3 people, maybe a token increase on 2km.

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TheCitizen

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

What we're doing here really isn't that much less, in terms of the virus spreading.

Ireland has the advantage over cities like Wuhan of low population density as well. It's far, far easier for most people in Ireland to completely avoid contact with others than it is for people in urban China. Even getting into a lift in your own apartment block to go downstairs and accept a food delivery is far more risk than most people in Ireland currently have to tolerate.

Yes that's why the restrictions appear to be working

ThewhiteJesus

BanditLuke wrote: »

Do you live beside the park?

I live in the zoo with your ma.

Plumbthedepths

housemouse wrote: »

I know Terry can't process new information, but I suspect that most people reading this thread are able to.

If you didn't watch it, I suggest you watch last night's Tonight show on the player if you can.

tobefrank321

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I genuinely believe there are people taking pleasure from the current restrictions. Plenty of evidence of it here.

I'd imagine I'd be representative of most people.

I don't enjoy the current restrictions but I am willing to put up with them on two conditions. 1. That their success can be quantified properly - and not with some shambolic testing regime which throws in old cases with newer ones and says they are all "new" cases. 2. There's a plan for post lockdown which can get most people back in their jobs, but which takes account for protecting the vulnerable and healthcare workers and ensures there's enough ICU beds and ventilators for an expected rise in cases.

Unfortunately the government or HSE haven't shown themselves to be capable of meeting either of these conditions.

housemouse

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I suspect you are wasting your time.

I know Terry can't process new information, but I suspect that most people reading this thread are able to.

Plumbthedepths

housemouse wrote: »

link to the above interview:

https://ratical.org/PerspectivesOnPandemic-II.html

I suspect you are wasting your time.

terrydel

ITman88 wrote: »

The lockdown fairies are completely ignoring those facts.

Wuhan, Lombardy, Madrid and Paris ain’t anything like Ireland.

Even our most densely populated cities never built up, they built out.

We have so much working in our favour, including population density and age profile.

34 European cities have a greater population than Dublin.

The bit you are ignoring is that lockdown works far better than the approach you are espousing.

Plumbthedepths

ThewhiteJesus wrote: »

i was just in the phoenix park and it's packed, groups all sitting round each other.
Nothings changed yet anyway

Phoenix park is 1800 acres, largest enclosed park in Europe. Every person in Dublin and surrounding counties must be there if it's packed.

housemouse

link to the above interview:

https://ratical.org/PerspectivesOnPandemic-II.html

housemouse

terrydel wrote: »

And yet you still reply. Making a liar of youraelf again.
When you answer the question of why our approach is 'panicked and poor', offer an alternative approach and reasons as to why its better, you can toddle off then.

You where blatantly wrong calling our approach 'panicked and poor', if you can bring yourself to actually admit that, you may win back some of your longdeparted reputation.

Terry, every time you put some verbal excrement on this thread, I will provide another piece of evidence for the open-minded, rational people to consider.

Dr Knut Wittkowski was head of the Department of Biostatistics, Epidemiology, and Research Design at The Rockefeller University, New York.

This is what he says about how to stop the virus:

"As with every respiratory disease, we should protect the elderly and fragile because when they get pneumonia, they have a high risk of dying of the pneumonia. So that is one of the key issues that we should keep in mind. On the other hand, children do very well with these diseases. They’re evolutionarily designed to be exposed to all sorts of viruses during their lifetime, and so they should keep going to school and infecting each other. Then, that contributes to herd immunity, which means after about four weeks at the most, the elderly people could start joining their family because then the virus would have been extinguished.

With all respiratory diseases, the only thing that stops the disease is herd immunity. About 80% of the people need to have had contact with the virus, and the majority of them won’t even have recognized that they were infected, or they had very, very mild symptoms, especially if they are children. So, it’s very important to keep the schools open and kids mingling to spread the virus to get herd immunity as fast as possible, and then the elderly people, who should be separated, and the nursing homes should be closed during that time, can come back and meet their children and grandchildren after about 4 weeks when the virus has been exterminated.

Well, what people are trying to do is flatten the curve. I don’t really know why. But, what happens is if you flatten the curve, you also prolong, to widen it, and it takes more time. And I don’t see a good reason for a respiratory disease to stay in the population longer than necessary."

He goes on to say that China's big advantage is that the virus peaked there before social distancing was implemented, i.e. after the Chinese people developed herd immunity:

"They had an advantage that in the beginning, they didn’t know what they were dealing with. So, it took them a long time to start the containment or social distancing, which, in the course of the epidemic is good, because there was enough time for the virus to reach herd immunity before the social distancing started."

BanditLuke

ThewhiteJesus wrote: »

i was just in the phoenix park and it's packed, groups all sitting round each other.
Nothings changed yet anyway

Do you live beside the park?

terrydel

housemouse wrote: »

Terry, you are not worth my time. I enjoy following this thread, though, so please feel free to continue provoking me. I will continue to remind you that you aren't worth my time, and everyone will be bored by it.

For everyone who isn't emotionally threatened by facts and logic, here is an article you may have missed by a retired Professor of Pathology. He explains some of the key issues surrounding the data:

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/The-evidence-on-Covid-19-is-not-as-clear-as-we-think

And yet you still reply. Making a liar of yourself again.
When you answer the question of why our approach is 'panicked and poor', offer an alternative approach and reasons and proof as to why its better, you can toddle off then.

You where blatantly wrong calling our approach 'panicked and poor', if you can bring yourself to actually admit that, you may win back some of your long departed reputation.

Hilarious that the best you can do is an article from a media outlet that Johnson was a massive part of and is hugely pro Tory/Johnson, and from 2 weeks ago. Facts since have shown that the theory put forward by that article to so wildly off track as to be hilarious.
The countries faring best by a huge measure are those taking similar or identical approach to ours, the one you called panicked and poor.
Have some honour and admit you are wrong.

MadYaker

Queasy Tadpole wrote: »

Are you driving in Dublin? I was only out a few times but was stopped numerous. Most amount of checkpoints/stops I've seen in decades of driving.

Galway and mostly at weird hours. I’ve seen them driving around but no checkpoints. To be fair I think I’ve driven my car 4 times in the last 3 weeks so they could be doing checkpoints for all I know.

ThewhiteJesus

i was just in the phoenix park and it's packed, groups all sitting round each other.
Nothings changed yet anyway

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Blueshoe wrote: »

Once the global pandemic is under control here in Ireland I'd be in favour of business as usual.

That's pretty much what we're saying.

Blueshoe

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Well they have to end at some point. Are you in favour of eternal lockdown?

Once the global pandemic is under control here in Ireland I'd be in favour of business as usual.
How about you? Are you in favour of eternal lockdown?

Queasy Tadpole

MadYaker wrote: »

Driving is a lot more fun on empty roads and I haven’t seen a single checkpoint yet! Before anyone starts abusing me for driving I still have to actually go into work the odd day. The air is definitely cleaner around town as well. Those are about the only positives I can think of

Are you driving in Dublin? I was only out a few times but was stopped numerous. Most amount of checkpoints/stops I've seen in decades of driving.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Blueshoe wrote: »

There are those who are only thinking of themselves and using their fragility and selfishness to push their view that the restrictions must end.

There are all sorts

Well they have to end at some point. Are you in favour of eternal lockdown?

Plumbthedepths

Blueshoe wrote: »

Maybe I could but more likely that I won't. The selfishness in a very small minority is there to see. I don't have to follow any instruction from your good self.
Find someone else to argue with

It wasn't an instruction, you made a claim I asked you could you provide evidence to back up your claim. If you can't I won't think less of you for admitting it.
Someone else could be less kind and conclude by your response that you are spoofing but not me.

MadYaker

Driving is a lot more fun on empty roads and I haven’t seen a single checkpoint yet! Before anyone starts abusing me for driving I still have to actually go into work the odd day. The air is definitely cleaner around town as well. Those are about the only positives I can think of

Blueshoe

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I have been reading and commenting on this thread from the start, I have seen comments saying that restrictions need to be eased and an exit plan explained but I have not seen anyone call for the restrictions to end. Maybe you could post a link or two to back up this selfishness you are referring too?

Maybe I could but more likely that I won't. The selfishness in a very small minority is there to see. I don't have to follow any instruction from your good self.
Find someone else to argue with

Penfailed

ITman88 wrote: »

It’s here to stay, you can hardly suggest once the restrictions are lifted we won’t be social distancing

Forever? That's exactly what I'm suggesting.

Plumbthedepths

Blueshoe wrote: »

There are those who are only thinking of themselves and using their fragility and selfishness to push their view that the restrictions must end.

There are all sorts

I have been reading and commenting on this thread from the start, I have seen comments saying that restrictions need to be eased and an exit plan explained but I have not seen anyone call for the restrictions to end. Maybe you could post a link or two to back up this selfishness you are referring too?

Blueshoe

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Actually I'm referring to to the lockdown fetists of which they are several.

There are those who are only thinking of themselves and using their fragility and selfishness to push their view that the restrictions must end.

There are all sorts

ITman88

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

Let`s just wait and see what the consequences of that will be, in particular reopening the schools and colleges. It may well be a decision they come to regret if new cases and deaths spike there.

It’s worth a chance.

Life must go on.

They can re isolate if necessary.

We are static.

As pragmatic as it sounds the restrictions aren’t saving lives in most cases, they are slightly prolonging them.

Our ICU numbers are manageable, that was our goal

Plumbthedepths

Blueshoe wrote: »

Some people embrace a change from the norm. Some people are just getting on with it. Some people are struggling with the current restrictions and some people enjoy telling others that the restrictions won't be going anywhere anytime soon.

Such is life. People are different. If we were all the same life would be boring

Actually I'm referring to to the lockdown fetists of which they are several.

nacho libre

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

I think the once-a-day 'exercise' should include being able to go and sit on a blanket in the park or on a park bench, alone. The current policy is very discriminatory against those not able to visibly exercise.

In a city the problem is many will have the same idea, so if the authorities allow it you can easily get the situation that happened in Lambeth park recently

Cork Boy 53

Cyrus wrote: »

i was referring to norway and denmark more so who have followed similar approachs to us and are easing restrictions next week (schools to reopen etc)

Let`s just wait and see what the consequences of that will be, in particular reopening the schools and colleges. It may well be a decision they come to regret if new cases and deaths spike there.

TheCitizen

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I genuinely believe there are people taking pleasure from the current restrictions. Plenty of evidence of it here.

Some people are trying to make the best of things.

ITman88

Penfailed wrote: »

Sorry...what?!

It’s here to stay, you can hardly suggest once the restrictions are lifted we won’t be social distancing