Relaxation of restrictions

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

In fairness, why did you ask for stuff then, if you didn't consider it essential? I have an underlying condition myself, but there's no excuse for being ungrateful and rude. You're very lucky to have someone willing to go out and buy things for you, and I very much hope you didn't take this tone with your sister.

Sure, but it doesn't excuse such rudeness. There's nothing particularly high risk about dropping stuff on someone's doorstep - in fact, this is what has been advised. It's not riskier than a postman who has been to every house on the street and exposed to all sorts putting it through the letterbox.

Some people have abandoned all logic and common sense in the face of this.

Didn't you post a couple months ago about how you verbally let rip at people who were in your way at the bottom of an escalator or something?

Forgive me if I am mixing you up with someone else, but if not, I don't think you are in a strong position to judge someone on whether or not being rude is appropriate. Particularly in the current climate at the situations some people have to consider. If you didn't make such a post, let me know, and I will delete this.

avg3078 wrote: »

Controlled by the government. A lot of lies there or showing only one side of the story.

What lies?

And, from what source can you offer a view form the other side of the story?

faceman

easypazz wrote: »

We closed our pubs and restaurants one day after Spain, and it was rife over there by then.

My take is we caught early. We have clusters around nursing homes and healthcare workers.

As much as I dislike our current government, you are correct and they’ll never get the credit for taking the action when they did. We got a head start on most European countries

Tell me how wrote: »

Didn't you post a couple months ago about how you verbally let rip at people who were in your way at the bottom of an escalator or something?

Forgive me if I am mixing you up with someone else, but if not, I don't think you are in a strong position to judge someone on whether or not being rude is appropriate. Particularly in the current climate at the situations some people have to consider. If you didn't make such a post, let me know, and I will delete this.

What in the world does letting rip at a bunch of inconsiderate strangers have in common with badmouthing a family member who was trying to do a good deed?

Really grasping at straws here, aren't you?

Icepick

matc66 wrote: »

https://www.bmj.com/content/369/bmj.m1375
which references this article from The Centre for Evidence Based Medicine in Oxford.
https://www.cebm.net/2020/03/covid-19-the-tipping-point
A quote is "Jefferson said that it was quite likely that the virus had been circulating for longer than generally believed and that large swathes of the population had already been exposed."
And
If—and I stress, if—the results are representative, then we have to ask, ‘What the hell are we locking down for?’

That's a premature interpretation of the data even if we 100% believe the source.
Symptoms develop in 5 to 14 days so if they are tracing and testing everyone, they are catching a lot of people pre-symptoms.
More importantly, other studies and examples, such as the Diamond Princess and Singapore and S Korea, who are tracing and testing everyone, show a different rate (15-20%).

faceman wrote: »

As much as I dislike our current government, you are correct and they’ll never get the credit for taking the action when they did. We got a head start on most European countries

Absolutely. For all the moaning on here, the Irish have done a far better job than most governments with this crisis. Lockdown happened far earlier in the curve than it did in most places. Locking down far too early would have meant that people would have got sick of it and started to become lax too early on. I think they actually got it pretty much right with the timing.

JTMan

Regardless of what the government will do, anyone any views on when companies will lift mandatory work-from-home restrictions?

I work for a company that now have 99% of staff working from home, this would have been unthinkable just a few weeks ago.

Now that companies like this know that they can operate almost entirely remotely, surely these companies will not lift restrictions until such time as virus cases are down to near-zero or there is a vaccine?

i.e. whatever about when the government lift restrictions, companies may not lift mandatory WFH restrictions for potentially another 12-18 months?

Red Alert

I think if there’s one positive thing from crisis, it’ll be to smash the objection many companies have to remote working. Not every job sits remote work, but many could be done partially remotely. Yet a lot of places have a quasi-religious opposition to it. We may well find a lot of people would be very happy to work from home 1-2 days a week.

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

What in the world does letting rip at a bunch of inconsiderate strangers have in common with badmouthing a family member who was trying to do a good deed?

Really grasping at straws here, aren't you?

Yep. Figured it was you.

We are talking literal life and death situations rather than your need to walk in a straight line through a shopping center.

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

What in the world does letting rip at a bunch of inconsiderate strangers have in common with badmouthing a family member who was trying to do a good deed?

Given the tone of some of your posts on here I agree with the poster above.

Your posts frequently come across quite nasty tbh

jlm29

My main concern currently is how far into the future it will be before my kids (and my husband) can get their hair cut

. They all kind of needed to be shorn about a week before the schools closed. Now it’s out of control.

pjohnson

Stheno wrote: »

Given the tone of some of your posts on here I agree with the poster above.

Your posts frequently come across quite nasty tbh

Very much do as I say not as I do type.
She can be nasty but everyone better be nice to her and do what she demands or else.

Logan Roy

Red Alert wrote: »

I think if there’s one positive thing from crisis, it’ll be to smash the objection many companies have to remote working. Not every job sits remote work, but many could be done partially remotely. Yet a lot of places have a quasi-religious opposition to it. We may well find a lot of people would be very happy to work from home 1-2 days a week.

1-2 days a week would be great, imagine what it would do for traffic / pollution ! Companies should be forced to do it where possible, it would be one of the easiest impactful things we could do to start to address the climate issue.

[Deleted User]

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

What in the world does letting rip at a bunch of inconsiderate strangers have in common with badmouthing a family member who was trying to do a good deed?

Really grasping at straws here, aren't you?

You're going ape at a poster who is seriously ill who is concerned about an illness that they're at far greater risk of getting.

JTMan wrote: »

Regardless of what the government will do, anyone any views on when companies will lift mandatory work-from-home restrictions?

I work for a company that now have 99% of staff working from home, this would have been unthinkable just a few weeks ago.

Now that companies like this know that they can operate almost entirely remotely, surely these companies will not lift restrictions until such time as virus cases are down to near-zero or there is a vaccine?

i.e. whatever about when the government lift restrictions, companies may not lift mandatory WFH restrictions for potentially another 12-18 months?

Possible, however you are forgetting potential antibody testing which would likely lift restrictions for people who are shown to have had the virus and developed immunity, and hopefully also effective treatments to lessen the impact.

I'd hope to see at least the anti body test (a reliable one) to be widely available in the next three months

However I dont think companies will be encouraged by the govt to lift work from home directives until near the end of lifting restrictions

In the area I work in in Grand Canal betw2en Google, Facebook and a dozen other companies there are probably 20 thousand out of 25000 at least who do not need to physically be in the office

That's a very small area but an enormous amount of people to keep off public transport/the streets if companies cooperate with the government and keep it in place longer

It's no picnic working from home five days a week when you are used to being in an office but if it has to be done so be it. I'm lucky enough to have a dedicated home office which helps though

seamusk84

Stheno wrote: »

Possible, however you are forgetting potential antibody testing which would likely lift restrictions for people who are shown to have had the virus and developed immunity, and hopefully also effective treatments to lessen the impact.

I'd hope to see at least the anti body test (a reliable one) to be widely available in the next three months

However I dont think companies will be encouraged by the govt to lift work from home directives until near the end of lifting restrictions

In the area I work in in Grand Canal betw2en Google, Facebook and a dozen other companies there are probably 20 thousand out of 25000 at least who do not need to physically be in the office

That's a very small area but an enormous amount of people to keep off public transport/the streets if companies cooperate with the government and keep it in place longer

It's no picnic working from home five days a week when you are used to being in an office but if it has to be done so be it. I'm lucky enough to have a dedicated home office which helps though

I work in the same area as you (potentially for the the same company) and we have essentially 95% been WFH for 2 weeks now.

But are you not concerned that now that we have shown we can operate like this, we have essentially demonstrated that our work can be done from India etc at a much lower cost with just a "Plate on Door" presence in Ireland?

I haven't heard anyone else say that yet....But we need to think about it.

[Deleted User]

Blueshoe wrote: »

It's like a step back to older times when the nosey Garda thought it normal to ask everyone who they are and where are they going.
We have moved away from those times thankfully.

We get it, you have a gripe with the police

Logan Roy

The company you work for was hardly unaware that the job could be done from home? It just doesn't suit a lot of employers to have people working from home. They don't trust employees to be as productive at home.

ITman88

seamusk84 wrote: »

I work in the same area as you (potentially for the the same company) and we have essentially 95% been WFH for 2 weeks now.

But are you not concerned that now that we have shown we can operate like this, we have essentially demonstrated that our work can be done from India etc at a much lower cost with just a "Plate on Door" presence in Ireland?

I haven't heard anyone else say that yet....But we need to think about it.

That is a fantastic point.

When you think of it, all the company needs is a plate on a door as you say if people are working from home.

How many roles outside of software can be done form home entirely?

ITman88

Logan Roy wrote: »

The company you work for was hardly unaware that the job could be done from home? It just doesn't suit a lot of employers to have people working from home. They don't trust employees to be as productive at home.

How many roles can be realistically be done from home completely tho? I know I’ve asked in another post

Tell me how wrote: »

Yep. Figured it was you.

We are talking literal life and death situations rather than your need to walk in a straight line through a shopping center.

It wasn't a shopping centre, it was a train a bunch of people were desperately trying to catch, and most of them missed it due to people being plain oblivious, but don't let the truth get in the way of a good bashing.

There is an ENORMOUS difference between being irritated with people blocking the way to a train and publicly criticising a family member who has gone out of their way to help you just because they didn't quite do exactly what you wanted them to do. Getting some non-essential items you felt like having isn't a 'matter of life or death', and if they were so unimportant, he shouldn't have asked for them, rather than expecting his sister to just know. Being high risk doesn't give you a free pass to be entitled and mean. Imagine how she'd feel to read that.

[Deleted User]

seamusk84 wrote: »

I work in the same area as you (potentially for the the same company) and we have essentially 95% been WFH for 2 weeks now.

But are you not concerned that now that we have shown we can operate like this, we have essentially demonstrated that our work can be done from India etc at a much lower cost with just a "Plate on Door" presence in Ireland?

I haven't heard anyone else say that yet....But we need to think about it.

While it's worth thinking about, I wouldn't suggest that you take it too seriously. Outsourcing to India or another similar countries comes with it's own drawbacks, and the virus shows just how fragile their social structures often are to a major crisis.

Besides, the virus (and Chinese supply chains) also shows the danger of being reliant on a population center so far away. I think we'll be seeing more companies move away from outsourcing to essentially 3rd world nations, although, cheaper countries like in Eastern Europe remain an attractive alternative.

Stheno wrote: »

Given the tone of some of your posts on here I agree with the poster above.

Your posts frequently come across quite nasty tbh

Weird, because I think exactly the same about yours.

seamusk84

Logan Roy wrote: »

The company you work for was hardly unaware that the job could be done from home? It just doesn't suit a lot of employers to have people working from home. They don't trust employees to be as productive at home.

True, but my point is we have actually 100% demonstrated it can be done now.

Management and shareholders always thought about it. But we have proven through this forced experiment that it is not only possible but very quickly achievable.

Just a thought.

ITman88 wrote: »

How many roles can be realistically be done from home completely tho? I know I’ve asked in another post

HR, Payroll, tech support, sales, administration, engineering development, finance and so on and so on and so on.

But, realistically, for most roles I expect a very strong transition to 60% - 80% working from home with 1 or 2 days a week in the office where hot desks will be in play instead of permanent allocations.

I do think that there will be some implications of this such as introduction of metrics of sort to ensure that working from home equates to 39 hours per week and these metrics might be something which could vary from reasonable to pretty draconian.

seamusk84 wrote: »

I work in the same area as you (potentially for the the same company) and we have essentially 95% been WFH for 2 weeks now.

But are you not concerned that now that we have shown we can operate like this, we have essentially demonstrated that our work can be done from India etc at a much lower cost with just a "Plate on Door" presence in Ireland?

I haven't heard anyone else say that yet....But we need to think about it.

No for two reasons
1. The company I work for have a condition on their IDA Grant's directly related to how many people they employ in Ireland
2. It's a global company with a bias towards enabling certain staff to work remotely wherever possible so its engrained

I dont see the company staying in Ireland long term (5-10 years from now) however

SSeanSS

seamusk84 wrote: »

I work in the same area as you (potentially for the the same company) and we have essentially 95% been WFH for 2 weeks now.

But are you not concerned that now that we have shown we can operate like this, we have essentially demonstrated that our work can be done from India etc at a much lower cost with just a "Plate on Door" presence in Ireland?

I haven't heard anyone else say that yet....But we need to think about it.

I don't think we need to be overly concerned about this. I am however basing that almost entirely on my experience of Eir Online Chat support :pac:

JTMan wrote: »

Regardless of what the government will do, anyone any views on when companies will lift mandatory work-from-home restrictions?

I work for a company that now have 99% of staff working from home, this would have been unthinkable just a few weeks ago.

Now that companies like this know that they can operate almost entirely remotely, surely these companies will not lift restrictions until such time as virus cases are down to near-zero or there is a vaccine?

i.e. whatever about when the government lift restrictions, companies may not lift mandatory WFH restrictions for potentially another 12-18 months?

I'd imagine that those who would prefer to WFH will be allowed to do so, at least for a certain amount of time, and those who prefer the office will eventually be allowed to go back. A lot of my colleagues are itching to get back into the office even though they have long and annoying commutes. Lots of people just can't hack working from home every day.

It's hard to imagine when that might be, though. Early summer?

ITman88

Tell me how wrote: »

I do think that there will be some implications of this such as introduction of metrics of sort to ensure that working from home equates to 39 hours per week and these metrics might be something which could vary from reasonable to pretty draconian.

The draconian point is interesting.
My role is luckily very relaxed but my boss who works from home has a real s*** show.
He claims that the commute time saved from working from home is more than swallowed up with extra workload.
Secondly a utilities issue exists, will companies subsidise broadband for 200 employees working from home?
Will they subsidise heating etc or does that get offset against a commute!