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Relaxation of restrictions

Red Alert

Simon Harris curiously made a comment that there was a limit to how long people could put up with extreme level of restrictions as we currently have. Already we’re seeing in Italy that people are starting to get restless. So two big questions:

1) on Easter Sunday, do you think there will be further restrictions, no change with just an extension or some relaxation?

2) what will be the first thing rolled back?

My own guess would be: extension for at least 1 week. Then to allow some businesses like DIY shops to reopen, perhaps allow gatherings of 2/3 people, maybe a token increase on 2km.

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Thelonious Monk

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

Oh, well that's grand then, once you're alright, Jack.

No need to worry about the many, many people who are NOT doing OK, and who will be unable to cope with this situation if it went on for many months.

I'm not alright, my parents and brother are stranded abroad, I haven't spoken to someone in person in ages. But until I have no shelter or food on the table I'll just have to relax. Try doing the same yourself.

[Deleted User]

ITman88 wrote: »

No one is suggesting that.

It has however been happening for years now, so while you were being passive aggressive you need to check out what’s being going on in Italy for a number of years

I honestly am inclined to trust the various global medical authorities including virologists and epidemiologist in terms of the necessity of maintaining the lockdown..

HBC08

ITman88 wrote: »

So are you suggesting we lift the restrictions then?

Do the opposite of the UK?

No,
What I said wasnt hard to read.

KiKi III

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

There's no way people can cope with it being that long. Honestly just no way. The only reason there should ever be an 'explosion of cases' once people have been locked down for several weeks is if mass travel starts up again. I can understand that being pushed back as far as possible. But this extreme social distancing and isolation cannot last for months more.

Such an incredible lack of empathy, it's unbelievable.

You do realise a lot of people have mental and physical health needs which are going completely or almost completely unmet during this crisis? As everything else is shelved in favour of coronavirus stuff, people are going without therapy sessions, medication and having operations pushed back, and on top of all this, are unable to do anything which might help, such as meet friends, play group sports or any of the other things which are normally suggested when you're having a hard time? How do you think it feels for someone with chronic depression or illness to be stuck inside 24/7, alone?

That's only one aspect. There's also the pressure it puts on relationships, probably an increase in domestic violence, people cracking under pressure trying to homeschool kids, do housework AND work from home, in addition to the worries and stress many people are facing about money, security and work at the moment.

You might be fine, but that doesn't mean everyone else is. Pretty hard to focus on reading or doing online courses when you're in a terrible mental state and have no idea when it will end.

My empathy is primarily with those suffering from Covid 19, their families, those mourning lost loved ones and the frontline medical staff dealing with it.

Is it crap to miss a therapy session if you’ve got depression? Yes. Is it crap to feel lonely or bored at home on your own for a few weeks? Yes. Do we need to suck it up for a few weeks? Yes.

I’m doing my therapy sessions over Skype and it’s going fine. Pieta House are still providing remote support. People need to get creative and come up with solutions instead of problems.

We’re still able to get outside every day, speak to our loved ones, find all sorts of entertainment, stay safe and healthy and all we have to do is stay at home. It’s a small sacrifice.

13 new deaths and 400 new cases today.

I’m bored and frustrated at home. I miss my family. My housemate and I are starting to get on each other’s nerves. But I’m more than happy to continue with this for the next 2-4 weeks to save hundreds, or maybe thousands of lives.

lainey_d_123

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Lainey your posts are a bit hysterical on these matters. You are freaking out about the whole thing but most of us are doing ok.

Oh, well that's grand then, once you're alright, Jack.

No need to worry about the many, many people who are NOT doing OK, and who will be unable to cope with this situation if it went on for many months.

ITman88

Raconteuse wrote: »

Let the over 60s and immuno-compromised just die in their hundreds per day like in Italy and Spain eh?

Shur they're only useless people anyway.

No one is suggesting that.

It has however been happening for years now, so while you were being passive aggressive you need to check out what’s being going on in Italy for a number of years

landofthetree

http://www.westmeathexaminer.ie/2020/04/01/over-by-summer-if-we-comply/

June or July at the earliest according to Kingston Mills- an expert experimental immunology at TCD.

Blueshoe

Today's figures should put an end to the nonsense talk

[Deleted User]

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

There's no way people can cope with it being that long. Honestly just no way. The only reason there should ever be an 'explosion of cases' once people have been locked down for several weeks is if mass travel starts up again. I can understand that being pushed back as far as possible. But this extreme social distancing and isolation cannot last for months more.

Such an incredible lack of empathy, it's unbelievable.

You do realise a lot of people have mental and physical health needs which are going completely or almost completely unmet during this crisis? As everything else is shelved in favour of coronavirus stuff, people are going without therapy sessions, medication and having operations pushed back, and on top of all this, are unable to do anything which might help, such as meet friends, play group sports or any of the other things which are normally suggested when you're having a hard time? How do you think it feels for someone with chronic depression or illness to be stuck inside 24/7, alone?

That's only one aspect. There's also the pressure it puts on relationships, probably an increase in domestic violence, people cracking under pressure trying to homeschool kids, do housework AND work from home, in addition to the worries and stress many people are facing about money, security and work at the moment.

You might be fine, but that doesn't mean everyone else is. Pretty hard to focus on reading or doing online courses when you're in a terrible mental state and have no idea when it will end.

I've got some pretty extreme anxiety and depression, been on it for years. Also have a chronic illness that requires me to get treated in a hospital every two months. No idea if that treatment will go ahead. I also faced a drastic pay cut.

Yes, I feel pretty awful about it all but I view the measures as entirely necessary. We're only a few days into a very light lockdown and posters are behaving as if it's been ongoing for months.

Thelonious Monk

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

They basically are. A lockdown so strict that people are being shamed for exercising outside (even when officially allowed) and only expected to go out for essential food is basically being imprisoned in your home. What else would you call it? I'm certainly not free to do whatever I want and would certainly be stopped if i tried to do something as inoffensive as read a book in the park in the sun. This is a total stripping of civil liberties - whether it's for the greater good is irrelevant. Stop lying to yourself about what it is.

Lainey your posts are a bit hysterical on these matters. You are freaking out about the whole thing but most of us are doing ok.

Raconteuse

niallo27 wrote: »

Exactly, could you imagine what the generations who fought wars would have said, get back to work you soft *****, i saw thousands die all around me and you are afraid of a virus.

Let the over 60s and immuno-compromised just die in their hundreds per day like in Italy and Spain eh?

Shur they're only useless people anyway.

Harry Palmr

The governments balancing act is not to rob people of light at the end of the staycation tunnel. If the reaction to the next announcement is one of annoyance/frustration/sorrow rather than an "ah well" shrug then it won't be long before the whole policy is in tatters.

suicide_circus

the comparisons with WWI veterans are fun but not exactly useful.

The lads who fought in WWI didn't know how good they had it, early Christians were fed to the lions in Roman colosseums!

Blueshoe

ITman88 wrote: »

We don’t know if it’s the restrictions. What is implemented elsewhere may not be effective in Ireland. I think we should of followed Singapore’s stance, kids in school and business open. Then shut the airports.
Implementing a lockdown is useless if its not implemented within a 10 day timeframe. To early or to late and it will have no effects.

We can’t compare Ireland to mainland Europe or the UK.

We don’t have any historical issues with flu endemics like the ageing populations in Europe have had over the last few years.

The Italian health service have had warnings about this before and they also had triage issues and overcrowding like they are experiencing now.

In Italy they had an incredibly low number of flu deaths this season in comparison to recent years and thus a number of vulnerable people were then in a precarious scenario when this hit. (Germany interestingly had a very difficult flu season with many deaths accountable to flu up to February)

Our population density is also a positive in a pandemic, in Lombardy they have an ageing 10m in an area the size of Munster.

The ageing population in Italy was becoming such a problem that they introduced grants to encourage people to have kids.

I believe we won’t see anything like we have seen on the European mainland, I’ll stay optimistic

We are relying on the HSE. A service that cannot cope with the annual winter flu. A service with 800,000 people on waiting lists for appointments (imagine the figure after this is over)

We cannot risk them being overrun. It would be mayhem and a complete disaster. .

lainey_d_123

KiKi III wrote: »

Fact check: No one is imprisoned in their homes. No one is suggesting this should go on indefinitely.

They basically are. A lockdown so strict that people are being shamed for exercising outside (even when officially allowed) and only expected to go out for essential food is basically being imprisoned in your home. What else would you call it? I'm certainly not free to do whatever I want and would certainly be stopped if i tried to do something as inoffensive as read a book in the park in the sun. This is a total stripping of civil liberties - whether it's for the greater good is irrelevant. Stop lying to yourself about what it is.

ITman88

HBC08 wrote: »

Well if there's one source I want my information from during this pandemic its officials in the UK.

So are you suggesting we lift the restrictions then?

Do the opposite of the UK?

[Deleted User]

niallo27 wrote: »

Exactly, could you imagine what the generations who fought wars would have said, get back to work you soft *****, i saw thousands die all around me and you are afraid of a virus.

I imagine those generations that were affected by the likes of cholera and polio wouldn't be viewing it as soft to avoid wiping out millions of lives.

lainey_d_123

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I'd go with the end of July for the beginning of relaxing measures across Europe and in Ireland and the middle of 2021 to see a return to normality.

No government is going to relax the measures so long as the threat of a renewed explosion in cases is there.

Because we will just be shut down again within a week.

A lot of unrealistic expectations around.

There's no way people can cope with it being that long. Honestly just no way. The only reason there should ever be an 'explosion of cases' once people have been locked down for several weeks is if mass travel starts up again. I can understand that being pushed back as far as possible. But this extreme social distancing and isolation cannot last for months more.

KiKi III wrote: »

Why? What’s so hard about it?

You have access to every movie, book and piece of music ever created, exercise, plenty of ways to keep in touch with people, you can buy groceries and alcohol. The weather is generally grand and you can get out in it every day. Tons of free online courses to keep your mind stimulated.

What’s the problem?

Such an incredible lack of empathy, it's unbelievable.

You do realise a lot of people have mental and physical health needs which are going completely or almost completely unmet during this crisis? As everything else is shelved in favour of coronavirus stuff, people are going without therapy sessions, medication and having operations pushed back, and on top of all this, are unable to do anything which might help, such as meet friends, play group sports or any of the other things which are normally suggested when you're having a hard time? How do you think it feels for someone with chronic depression or illness to be stuck inside 24/7, alone?

That's only one aspect. There's also the pressure it puts on relationships, probably an increase in domestic violence, people cracking under pressure trying to homeschool kids, do housework AND work from home, in addition to the worries and stress many people are facing about money, security and work at the moment.

You might be fine, but that doesn't mean everyone else is. Pretty hard to focus on reading or doing online courses when you're in a terrible mental state and have no idea when it will end.

ITman88

KiKi III wrote: »

The reason things are not too bad here yet is because of the restrictions you’re so keen to get rid of.....

We don’t know if it’s the restrictions. What is implemented elsewhere may not be effective in Ireland. I think we should of followed Singapore’s stance, kids in school and business open. Then shut the airports.
Implementing a lockdown is useless if its not implemented within a 10 day timeframe. To early or to late and it will have no effects.

We can’t compare Ireland to mainland Europe or the UK.

We don’t have any historical issues with flu endemics like the ageing populations in Europe have had over the last few years.

The Italian health service have had warnings about this before and they also had triage issues and overcrowding like they are experiencing now.

In Italy they had an incredibly low number of flu deaths this season in comparison to recent years and thus a number of vulnerable people were then in a precarious scenario when this hit. (Germany interestingly had a very difficult flu season with many deaths accountable to flu up to February)

Our population density is also a positive in a pandemic, in Lombardy they have an ageing 10m in an area the size of Munster.

The ageing population in Italy was becoming such a problem that they introduced grants to encourage people to have kids.

I believe we won’t see anything like we have seen on the European mainland, I’ll stay optimistic

HBC08

ITman88 wrote: »

Most are ignoring this.

It is exactly the elephant!

Officials in the UK did a study last week on the effects of the restrictions and determined a shrink in the economy of 6% is the equilibrium where the economic contraction will cause more deaths.

It’s forbidden however from being mentioned by many posters, you will be accused of immaturity/lack of empathy/not understanding the effects of the virus etc.

Well if there's one source I want my information from during this pandemic its officials in the UK.

[Deleted User]

average_runner wrote: »

I think by middle of May we be back in the office. 6 weeks of this and the country is bankrupt so will have no choice.

Even when retail and businesses reopen, and travel restrictions are relaxed, the one thing that we wont all be doing is all heading back to the office. I'm resigned to working from home until August / September at the absolute earliest, even if some other aspects of life resemble normality

KiKi III

Gael23 wrote: »

You can’t imprison people in their homes indefinitely

Fact check: No one is imprisoned in their homes. No one is suggesting this should go on indefinitely.

Blueshoe

Gael23 wrote: »

You can’t imprison people in their homes indefinitely

Global pandemic going on

KiKi III

niallo27 wrote: »

Or they could have said the opposite. Its very easy spin things.

I think a soldier who saw men in his unit die of Spanish Flu is unlikely to take the position you are pointing to.

alwald

is_that_so wrote:

There's a reason why we tell kids how many sleeps till Santa! We too need that 7-10 days blanky every so often during this. If we get to the end of April without any sign of an end there is a far higher risk people will begin to flout the restrictions.

Extraordinary situations require special measures to be put in place and no-one can tell when this will end and what's the next step.
It's not that easy or simple and I understand that people miss the social elements of life, going to the pub, heading to the beach, traveling, outdoor activities, gym, BBQs and the list is long...hell I miss that too and I would love to go back to normal asap.
Alas this isn't possible and the reality is that we are facing a massive challenge for which no country is prepared.

I spoke my mind and I sent my message but this thread is divided between those who are in favour of strong/robust/necessary measures to tackle this virus and others who dream/hope/fantasise about lifting restrictions and going back to normal...so I am out!!

Gael23

Ace2007 wrote: »

So which restriction are you going to ease - let people roam around in large numbers again?

You can’t imprison people in their homes indefinitely

niallo27

KiKi III wrote: »

Given that the Spanish Flu killed more WW1 soldiers than any battle, I think they’d tell you to stay home.

https://www.worldwar1centennial.org/index.php/communicate/press-media/wwi-centennial-news/3978-flu-killed-more-world-war-i-troops-than-any-battle.html

This is not comparable to the Spanish flu, that killed the young. If it was like the Spanish flu i would totally agree we should lock everything down.

is_that_so

KiKi III wrote: »

Italy has had a far stricter lockdown in place for longer.

Of course this can’t go on forever, but people calling for the relaxation of restrictions at this very early stage are being recklessly premature.

I agree but they will still have an eye on where they might hint at some positive changes.

niallo27

Ace2007 wrote: »

Or they would have said, I had to go fight for my country, all your country is asking you to do is stay in doors - watch tv and cup of tea - do whatever you want to do at home.

Grow up and stop being so selfish

Or they could have said the opposite. Its very easy spin things.

KiKi III

niallo27 wrote: »

Exactly, could you imagine what the generations who fought wars would have said, get back to work you soft *****, i saw thousands die all around me and you are afraid of a virus.

Given that the Spanish Flu killed more WW1 soldiers than any battle, I think they’d tell you to stay home.

https://www.worldwar1centennial.org/index.php/communicate/press-media/wwi-centennial-news/3978-flu-killed-more-world-war-i-troops-than-any-battle.html