Is it just me or have SF vanished?

FrancieBrady wrote: »

My business has supplied (for free) a product we sell normally, to everyone who needs it, around the county. This will be an ongoing cost as long as the crisis lasts and social distancing measures are to be kept in place. Two family members going in today with me to make up some more today.

Not world changing but it is something. I don't pretend to have all the answers, and I am not arrogant enough to say that I don't need suggestions/help at times.

We set up governance in this democracy and gave duties to those elected.

Your DUTY as an opposition politician and especially spokesperson, is to call out mistakes and inaction and make suggestions if you see them.

FG would be doing exactly the same as LoR was doing. If you want evidence of that, research the newspapers when FG were in opposition...see where they remaining silent.
You do know how to 'research' stuff I hope?

Problem is there are no SF politicians knowledgeble enough to spot, much less call out problems , and much less suggest solutions!!

They are not helping - I know it's a struggle not to be in the limelight, but sometimes for the good of everyone it's better if those who have nothing to contribute just stay out of the way - this is a health crisis, not a political one so the type of political operative so beloved of SF would make a greater contribution by not making any contribution.

Although, one suspects that every crisis, even the manufactured ones, are seen as political crises through the warped reality projected by the SF lens.

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

You equated the idea of current capacity with a production ceiling (which we aren't at) and suggested posters were saying production couldn't be expanded - conveniently neglecting what everyone, even the article you cited, is saying - that a step change in production takes time.

At the moment the industry is at capacity - the challenge now is grow the production capacity in a safe and sustainable way. Which, despite SF's utterings, is not easy to do - and sooner or later we'll run into a production ceiling - then what?

Volume is an important factor to consider here, but not the only factor - rate of deilvery is another point to consider. No point in trying to ram products into the system if it can't accommodate them, that's just wasteful. All these operations, from analysis back through testing to production need to be carefully synchronised......and SF politicans with their populist rhetoric, and general idiocy are not helping.

Plus, firms are just looking at SF and thinking "really? do we want to invest here if there's a chance these loons are getting into government?"

The opening post on this Sultan...go read what it has to say about '24/7/365'.
Read what Harvey had to say about switching to producing a different product.

I get what you are saying about time to change etc etc etc. But nobody was suggesting that 'risks be taken' or that switches could be flipped' etc.

Complete over reaction to a simple ask by a politician. And we know exactly why that is.
SF inside the heads of poor FGers.

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Did she accuse them of 'not stepping up'?

Can you link to where she said that?

There are 180 pharma companies and we have shortages in test kits, equipment and PPE.

As an opposition politician I would be role calling all these companies to see what they can offer.

What would you do?

Not stepping up is your paraphrase
Now answer the question
Which companies and specifically what are they not doing that they could?
Answer the question

tikkahunter

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

You equated the idea of current capacity with a production ceiling (which we aren't at) and suggested posters were saying production couldn't be expanded - conveniently neglecting what everyone, even the article you cited, is saying - that a step change in production takes time.

At the moment the industry is at capacity - the challenge now is grow the production capacity in a safe and sustainable way. Which, despite SF's utterings, is not easy to do - and sooner or later we'll run into a production ceiling - then what?

Volume is an important factor to consider here, but not the only factor - rate of deilvery is another point to consider. No point in trying to ram products into the system if it can't accommodate them, that's just wasteful. All these operations, from analysis back through testing to production need to be carefully synchronised......and SF politicans with their populist rhetoric, and general idiocy are not helping.

Plus, firms are just looking at SF and thinking "really? do we want to invest here if there's a chance these loons are getting into government?"

Step up to the plate - but if we get in we are going to tax the bollox out of you . Some beauts

Mortelaro wrote: »

What did you mean then by pharma not stepping up to the plate?
Still waiting for your list of companies or proof they're not doing what they can like the Sinn Fein health spokesperson and you her supporter is suggesting

Did she accuse them of 'not stepping up'?

Can you link to where she said that?

There are 180 pharma companies and we have shortages in test kits, equipment and PPE.

As an opposition politician I would be role calling all these companies to see what they can offer.

What would you do?

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Front page of the Irish Times again is a bit embarrassing for our 'it isn't possible' pharma experts this AM.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/ireland-s-pharma-industry-gears-up-to-make-key-ingredient-for-covid-19-testing-1.4218334

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Out of context? WTF What the absolute f*** is wrong with you lot?

How much clearer..in context could the following be?

You equated the idea of current capacity with a production ceiling (which we aren't at) and suggested posters were saying production couldn't be expanded - conveniently neglecting what everyone, even the article you cited, is saying - that a step change in production takes time.

At the moment the industry is at capacity - the challenge now is grow the production capacity in a safe and sustainable way. Which, despite SF's utterings, is not easy to do - and sooner or later we'll run into a production ceiling - then what?

Volume is an important factor to consider here, but not the only factor - rate of deilvery is another point to consider. No point in trying to ram products into the system if it can't accommodate them, that's just wasteful. All these operations, from analysis back through testing to production need to be carefully synchronised......and SF politicans with their populist rhetoric, and general idiocy are not helping.

Plus, firms are just looking at SF and thinking "really? do we want to invest here if there's a chance these loons are getting into government?"

Ballso

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I don't pretend to have all the answers

Yes you do Francie.

Ballso

maccored wrote: »

jaysus the 'facts' in this thread are just hilarious

Here's another intellectual giant taking time out of his busy day at the top of his industry to grace us with his expertise. What your speciality caller? Reagent production? Antibody analytics? Medical device manufacturing?

Ballso wrote: »

Hey Francie you seem to have ignored me when I asked what you are doing to step up? What are you contributing? You seem to be able to give direction to literally everyone else from government, to the HSE, to pharma and manufacturing. Your own contribution must be incredible?

My business has supplied (for free) a product we sell normally, to everyone who needs it, around the county. This will be an ongoing cost as long as the crisis lasts and social distancing measures are to be kept in place. Two family members going in today with me to make up some more today.

Not world changing but it is something. I don't pretend to have all the answers, and I am not arrogant enough to say that I don't need suggestions/help at times.

We set up governance in this democracy and gave duties to those elected.

Your DUTY as an opposition politician and especially spokesperson, is to call out mistakes and inaction and make suggestions if you see them.

FG would be doing exactly the same as LoR was doing. If you want evidence of that, research the newspapers when FG were in opposition...see where they remaining silent.
You do know how to 'research' stuff I hope?

tikkahunter

maccored wrote: »

jaysus the 'facts' in this thread are just hilarious

We’ll go ahead let me know which ones are ?

maccored

tikkahunter wrote: »

His contribution is coming on here and defending SF no matter how wrong they are. He has been put in his box by the real experts on the subject with facts and just keeps rolling out the same waffle.

jaysus the 'facts' in this thread are just hilarious

FrancieBrady wrote: »

:D:D Trying to eek out a wee victory Harvey.

I never said anything, anything at all about 'time frame'.

Fook right off with that pivot.

No pivot from me. I have been consistent on this. Major changes to production lines take time. If you are saying you agree, that's great.

tikkahunter

Ballso wrote: »

Hey Francie you seem to have ignored me when I asked what you are doing to step up? What are you contributing? You seem to be able to give direction to literally everyone else from government, to the HSE, to pharma and manufacturing. Your own contribution must be incredible?

His contribution is coming on here and defending SF no matter how wrong they are. He has been put in his box by the real experts on the subject with facts and just keeps rolling out the same waffle.

FrancieBrady wrote: »

:D:D Trying to eek out a wee victory Harvey.

I never said anything, anything at all about 'time frame'.

Fook right off with that pivot.

What did you mean then by pharma not stepping up to the plate?
Still waiting for your list of companies or proof they're not doing what they can like the Sinn Fein health spokesperson and you her supporter is suggesting

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

You took a quote completely out of context, stripped it of all meaning and tried to warp it to your own agenda.

I'm not sure what your background is but I'll bet it's not pharmaceuticals, life sciences or medical devices - or, I'll wager, it's not any kind of modern manufacturing or production.

It's a very complicated area, and the only thing I really know is that I know enough to know to stay in my own very narrow area of expertise - there's maybe a lesson in that

Out of context? WTF What the absolute f*** is wrong with you lot?

How much clearer..in context could the following be?

Ireland’s pharmaceutical industry has indicated it is gearing up to produce key ingredients for Covid-19 testing which the State is struggling to source on the international market.

The industry could produce enough reagent – a key laboratory ingredient which is in short supply – to enable around 500,000 tests to take place, said Matt Moran, director of the pharmaceutical industry lobby group BioPharmaChem Ireland.

Ballso wrote: »

Hey Francie you seem to have ignored me when I asked what you are doing to step up? What are you contributing? You seem to be able to give direction to literally everyone else from government, to the HSE, to pharma and manufacturing. Your own contribution must be incredible?

A vaccine can only be hours away.....

Deleted User wrote: »

So, you agree it will take time to do? Great, we're making progress.

The reality remains, as you have been told repeatedly, it's not that the companies can't do it, it's that they can't do it quickly.

:D:D Trying to eek out a wee victory Harvey.

I never said anything, anything at all about 'time frame'.

Fook right off with that pivot.

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I am not saying anything here...I quoted the PHARMA INDUSTRY itself saying something. There is a difference you know.

You took a quote completely out of context, stripped it of all meaning and tried to warp it to your own agenda.

I'm not sure what your background is but I'll bet it's not pharmaceuticals, life sciences or medical devices - or, I'll wager, it's not any kind of modern manufacturing or production.

It's a very complicated area, and the only thing I really know is that I know enough to know to stay in my own very narrow area of expertise - there's maybe a lesson in that

Ballso

FrancieBrady wrote: »

WHO said anything about 'flicking switches'...'straight away'..morte?

Hey Francie you seem to have ignored me when I asked what you are doing to step up? What are you contributing? You seem to be able to give direction to literally everyone else from government, to the HSE, to pharma and manufacturing. Your own contribution must be incredible?

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The very first post on the subject last night says it in figures!

You know majority doesn't mean all?

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Nice try FB, you really went for it.

However, that post doesn't mean it can't be done, just means it can't be done like flicking a switch, which has been the point all along.

He is trying to suggest 'just' in the post he quoted isnt short for 'just like that' which is another anachronism for 'clicking your fingers'
Who needs shovels

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Who claimed at any point that it could be done by flicking a switch? Did you perhaps invent this switch Harvey?

So, you agree it will take time to do? Great, we're making progress.

The reality remains, as you have been told repeatedly, it's not that the companies can't do it, it's that they can't do it quickly.

Mortelaro wrote: »

'Could just' means the point is cant straight away
Try again
I'm waiting

WHO said anything about 'flicking switches'...'straight away'..morte?

Deleted User wrote: »

Gwan and give the capacity point another go, who said there was no capacity?

The very first post on the subject last night says it in figures!

the majority of pharma plants are already 24/7 365

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Here is a post completely rubbished by what the Irish Times reported on this AM.

Lads/Lassies...seriously, you are all out on this one, again.

Pharma, just like everyone else can 'step up'.

'Could just' means the point is cant straight away
Try again
I'm waiting

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I am not saying anything here...I quoted the PHARMA INDUSTRY itself saying something. There is a difference you know.

Gwan and give the capacity point another go, who said there was no capacity?

Deleted User wrote: »

Nice try FB, you really went for it.

However, that post doesn't mean it can't be done, just means it can't be done like flicking a switch, which has been the point all along.

Who claimed at any point that it could be done by flicking a switch? Did you perhaps invent this switch Harvey?

markodaly

Runaways wrote: »

I do. Loads of it.

*Gestures broadly at this very thread*

So, show me a post where there is proof that FG have paid for these bots?

Caustion does not equal correlation.

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Yeah, that's spot on - just because two things are described as "pharma products" it doesn't mean they are inter-changeable. It doesn't even mean that because one is safe to consume, it follows that all are safe to consume.

Also, something else you fail to grasp is that if everyone piles into producing something not will only will quality vary wildly, but the potential for counterfeiting and fraud will sky-rocket - which will itself feedback into the system by meaning more verification testing is required, which will greatly slow the flow of products the market, generating significant unusable stockpiles.

I am not saying anything here...I quoted the PHARMA INDUSTRY itself saying something. There is a difference you know.