Relaxation of restrictions

rossie1977 wrote: »

Extreme would be the army and Gardai patrolling every major town and city in the country day and night.

The Gardai are, the army not yet, but not needed.

rossie1977 wrote: »

Extreme would be forced by law to stay at home and if you left without written approval you would be fined or jailed.

We are forced to stay at home, you need a letter from your employer if stopped by the guards. It has not reached fines or jail yet but its not far off it.

rossie1977 wrote: »

Extreme would be where roads and bridges would be blocked off not allowing huge parts of the population to leave that particular area.

Ireland is small, there are roadblocks into tourist areas preventing non locals using holiday homes

rossie1977 wrote: »

Extreme would be where you are no longer allowed leave house at all and supplies are brought to you and if you do try to leave you are bolted into house.

Not too many places have taken it that far. Most countries in Eur /USA are similar measures to us.

niallo27

People are starting to turn, a week nobody would have suggested relaxing the restrictions but more and more think this will be unsustainable past next few weeks.

jams100

Drifter50 wrote: »

Agreed, best estimate at the min is 30 billion, half of what the bank bailout cost and that took 7/ 8 years to pay back.

Pay back? You do know we owe 206 billion. We have paid feack all back, were we just paying the interest really + a tiny bit.

thebaz wrote: »

When you have lost your business , and fear how to pay the rent in a months time , not the fun you outline -
Maybe you enjoy solitary reading, good for you , but most humans are actually social animals , they enjoy the pub / cafes / having fun / hugs / the oudoors / sport / concerts / general comardarie - the mental & economic cost of this in 2 months will be so severe, that it will be nearly as big a problem as what we are now facing - you may enjoy this so called living, but for many of us it is pretty unbearable, and we are bearing with it for the benefit of the vulnerable in our society.

I don’t enjoy it, and I’m a social person myself, but it’s a sacrifice I’m more than happy to make to beat this virus.

I’m self-employed and I’ve already lost business, I pay high rent and I have the same concerns most people do.

But I’m not going to demand the restrictions are lifted any sooner than they need to be because we need to beat this virus and save as many lives as we can and that’s more important to me than the economy.

I’m not suggesting it’s meant to be fun. I’m saying it’s doable. And it is.

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Of all the things to consider pubs are surely the least important. They'll be the last outlet to reopen.

How so? They provide a social outlet to a lot of people. A few pints and back a few horses is some peoples pleasure.

Not everybody is into Netflix, online gaming or yoga etc.

KiKi III wrote: »

I don’t enjoy it, and I’m a social person myself, but it’s a sacrifice I’m more than happy to make to beat this virus.

I’m self-employed and I’ve already lost business, I pay high rent and I have the same concerns most people do.

But I’m not going to demand the restrictions are lifted any sooner than they need to be because we need to beat this virus and save as many lives as we can and that’s more important to me than the economy.

I’m not suggesting it’s meant to be fun. I’m saying it’s doable. And it is.

Just because its doable to you doesn't mean its easy for everybody.

I am not too bothered but I am just lucky that I have a bit of cash to fall back on.

But I know an old person living on their own and this is pure hell. He is not the only one.

There are also families with young kids stuck in an apartment, people in unhappy relationships who are stuck with somebody who is difficult at the best of times.

irishgeo

An interesting chart here on market recovery.

easypazz wrote: »

Just because its doable to you doesn't mean its easy for everybody.

I am not too bothered but I am just lucky that I have a bit of cash to fall back on.

But I know an old person living on their own and this is pure hell. He is not the only one.

There are also families with young kids stuck in an apartment, people in unhappy relationships who are stuck with somebody who is difficult at the best of times.

Nobody’s saying it’s easy. But it’s a lot easier than dying alone in a hospital room because no one you love is allowed come in and spend your last minutes gasping for air with you.

Or living with the knowledge that someone in your community suffered such a terrible death (and no proper funeral) because you couldn’t put up with a few weeks of hardship.

GreeBo

To everyone complaining about how hard this is... Think of the child who died alone and in pain in the UK for a minute, then go put the kettle on and watch some Netflix and consider yourselves lucky.

No matter how hard isolation is, it sure beats dying alone, on a ventilator in agony.

Charles Babbage

niallo27 wrote: »

Because every person is different, your idea of bliss could be someone else's idea of hell. Its tough not being able to see your family.

But that family wouldn't like to see you die alone in hospital either.

In any case there is no point in relaxing things too soon until you have a plan which will allow a relaxation.

KiKi III wrote: »

I live in a small apartment in the city and I’m absolutely grand.

Lucky you. If only I was as charmed. Peoples problems here aren't as trivial as being entertained.

While I recognise this works and we should keep doing it. It's by no means easy.

the_pen_turner

KiKi III wrote: »

I live in a small apartment in the city and I’m absolutely grand.

your lucky.
most people would crack up locked in an apartment in a city. I would. even now I can see the diference in my mental health.

odyssey06

KiKi III wrote: »

The current restrictions are absolutely workable for most people (not including the groups already mentioned).
Lots of countries have introduced far more stringent measures.
Anyone who thinks this is too restrictive because they are outdoorsy and aren’t getting to train as often as they would like would want to cop on.

Stop with the strawman arguments.
People are bringing up those who lost their jobs. Over 70s cocooned. Parents who cant see kids. Kids who cant see parents.
Add up the people seriously impacted and it is a huge number of people.
And you deflect with references to outdoorsy or pub people. Who are these anyones?

They are not sustainable measures.

Dravokivich wrote: »

Lucky you. If only I was as charmed. Peoples problems here aren't as trivial as being entertained.

While I recognise this works and we should keep doing it. It's by no means easy.

Loneliness and boredom are not trivial but I bet anyone on a ventilator would trade for them given the opportunity. Perspective is important.

GreeBo wrote: »

To everyone complaining about how hard this is... Think of the child who died alone and in pain in the UK for a minute, then go put the kettle on and watch some Netflix and consider yourselves lucky.

No matter how hard isolation is, it sure beats dying alone, on a ventilator in agony.

Forget about Netflix. No one is arguing against the need to do this.

[Deleted User]

thebaz wrote: »

When you have lost your business , and fear how to pay the rent in a months time , not the fun you outline -
Maybe you enjoy solitary reading, good for you , but most humans are actually social animals , they enjoy the pub / cafes / having fun / hugs / the oudoors / sport / concerts / general comardarie - the mental & economic cost of this in 2 months will be so severe, that it will be nearly as big a problem as what we are now facing - you may enjoy this so called living, but for many of us it is pretty unbearable, and we are bearing with it for the benefit of the vulnerable in our society.

For the benefit of everyone, not just the vulnerable. Nobody wants this virus. It can damage your heart even if you recover.

I hear you about the rest. It's tough as **** staying in. I'm presuming it's for a long while, so have made my piece with that. It's the people that are too negative early on that will lose their minds. Easier said than done for sure.

odyssey06 wrote: »

Stop with the strawman arguments.
People are bringing up those who lost their jobs. Over 70s cocooned. Parents who cant see kids. Kids who cant see parents.
Add up the people seriously impacted and it is a huge number of people.
And you deflect with references to outdoorsy or pub people. Who are these anyones?

They are not sustainable measures.

I was literally replying to someone on the thread who said they were finding it very hard because they love the outdoors. This is a high class problem.

KiKi III wrote: »

Loneliness and boredom are not trivial but I bet anyone on a ventilator would trade for them given the opportunity. Perspective is important.

What are you doing bringing a ventilator into this? People know it needs to be done. Stop suggesting we are wrong about finding it difficult. You perceived the issue to be one of boredom? Then you are looking at it from a limited point of view.

chicorytip

What if there is another "sombrero" here in late autumn or early winter with a vaccine still not available? On a global level, when the head of the WHO expresses deep concern about the rapid rates of infection and huge geographical spread of the virus - as he did today - expectations that life will return to normal in just a few short weeks seem wildly optimistic.

lord quackinton

thebaz wrote: »

When you have lost your business , and fear how to pay the rent in a months time , not the fun you outline -
Maybe you enjoy solitary reading, good for you , but most humans are actually social animals , they enjoy the pub / cafes / having fun / hugs / the oudoors / sport / concerts / general comardarie - the mental & economic cost of this in 2 months will be so severe, that it will be nearly as big a problem as what we are now facing - you may enjoy this so called living, but for many of us it is pretty unbearable, and we are bearing with it for the benefit of the vulnerable in our society.

i work in finance and my honest view is the damage caused in the last few weeks to the economy is very serious , but everyone is focused on the virus. no one wants to think about it , including me.
many businesses will never reopen, paycuts will come, taxes will have to be raised, all those plans to build thousands of council houses, fix health are dead.

But if we are still in any version of lockdown by end of june the damage to the our economy and other western economies will make 2008 pale in comparison.
i would fully expect major corporations and corporate banks and pension funds to collapse within 6 months.
we are in very dangerous times

Dravokivich wrote: »

What are you doing bringing a ventilator into this? People know it needs to be done. Stop suggesting we are wrong about finding it difficult. You perceived the issue to be one of boredom? Then you are looking at it from a limited point of view.

Because we are doing this to avoid more people on ventilators. I would have thought that was obvious.

Lots of people have referenced being “stir crazy” which suggests their problem is indeed boredom.

People are allowed to find it difficult, but I consider their difficulty considerably less significant than those who are burying family members without proper funerals.

yubabill

My 2c FWIW.

I think we are at the top of a flat curve wrt new cases. Been around 2-300 new cases for several days now.

Given that it is said to take c.7 days for restrictions to affect infections, I expect to see a decline in new infections in maybe 5 or 6 days.

Also, Italy is beginning to see a decline in new cases and we are about two weeks behind them.

And, Italy is seeing civil unrest gestating, especially in the poorer South....

The right thing to do, if new cases recede between now and Apr 12th, is to relax lockdown ever, ever so slightly.

And with soon-to-be-former Taoiseach Leo having nothing to lose (which might be why he has acted so decisively wrt corona), this might just be a possible scenario.

odyssey06

chicorytip wrote: »

What if there is another "sombrero" here in late autumn or early winter with a vaccine still not available? On a global level, when the head of the WHO expresses deep concern about the rapid rates of infection and huge geographical spread of the virus - as he did today - expectations that life will return to normal in just a few short weeks seem wildly optimistic.

There is a range of options between normal v current restrictioms v previous restrictions. Has anyone said they expect no restrictions in a few weeks?

GooglePlus

Will be interesting to see how this all goes on once the weather really picks up.

There'll be flocks out in estates and parks. BBQs and garden drinks will be hard to police.

KiKi III wrote: »

I was literally replying to someone on the thread who said they were finding it very hard because they love the outdoors. This is a high class problem.

Below is the your first reply and the comment you replied to. No mention of outdoors. Get off the stage.

Originally Posted by Pheonix10
I seriously hope not. 2 weeks has felt like an age an we aren't even one week in.

KiKi III:
4 weeks is no length. Don’t understand people making such a big deal of it.

odyssey06

KiKi III wrote: »

Because we are doing this to avoid more people on ventilators. I would have thought that was obvious.

Lots of people have referenced being “stir crazy” which suggests their problem is indeed boredom.

People are allowed to find it difficult, but I consider their difficulty considerably less significant than those who are burying family members without proper funerals.

And another post where you ignore the people cocooned, families disrupted, people losing jobs with this nonsense.
Still with the stir crazy strawman ventilator nonsense.

Logan Roy

KiKi III wrote: »

Because we are doing this to avoid more people on ventilators. I would have thought that was obvious.

Lots of people have referenced being “stir crazy” which suggests their problem is indeed boredom.

People are allowed to find it difficult, but I consider their difficulty considerably less significant than those who are burying family members without proper funerals.

You could apply this logic to anything. There's so many things that people do that impact society negatively - drug taking is one such example. Bad things happen every day because of the choices people make in their own self interest.